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Offline Drjeggle  
#1 Posted : 27 February 2015 10:54:02(UTC)
Drjeggle

South Africa   
Joined: 13/11/2014(UTC)
Posts: 4
Location: GAUTENG, JOHANNESBURG
Hi everyone

I recently purchased a Roco BR053 Locomotive for Marklin 3-rail operation. It is the Roco 68254 model. I have not yet finished my layout but I did run the Loco on the part of my layout which I have finished. When the locomotive goes over any point, the tender seems to get weird and derail and lose contact. Has anyone else had this problem when running the other brands on Marklin m-track. I know the track is old and dated but the points which I have are in pretty good condition and I do not have any problems with them when running the Marklin locomotives. In fact, I also have a PIKO AC model which seems to work fine. It is only with the Roco model. Any advice or help would be much appreciated indeed. I have to say that the Roco model is a beautiful Loco and the sounds are awesome! Runs really smoothly too, except for when it goes over the m-track turnout of course. Blink
I look forward to hearing you guy's remarks etc...

Thanks!
Offline kiwiAlan  
#2 Posted : 27 February 2015 12:18:00(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 5,991
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Drjeggle Go to Quoted Post
Hi everyone

I recently purchased a Roco BR053 Locomotive for Marklin 3-rail operation. It is the Roco 68254 model. I have not yet finished my layout but I did run the Loco on the part of my layout which I have finished. When the locomotive goes over any point, the tender seems to get weird and derail and lose contact. Has anyone else had this problem when running the other brands on Marklin m-track. I know the track is old and dated but the points which I have are in pretty good condition and I do not have any problems with them when running the Marklin locomotives. In fact, I also have a PIKO AC model which seems to work fine. It is only with the Roco model. Any advice or help would be much appreciated indeed. I have to say that the Roco model is a beautiful Loco and the sounds are awesome! Runs really smoothly too, except for when it goes over the m-track turnout of course. Blink
I look forward to hearing you guy's remarks etc...

Thanks!


Several possibilities: -

First, do the bogies on the tender turn far enough for the radius of track on the turnout?

Second, how heavy is the tender? Could fitting it with some weight stop it from jumping over the frogs and check rails.?

Third, have you checked the wheel spacing on the axle? The critical dimension is the 'front to back' measurement, i.e. the front of the flange on one wheel to the back of the flange on the other wheel. Most people talk of the wheel spacing as a 'back to back' measurement on the flanges, which is fine if you stick to one brand of wheels, but the front to back measurement is what counts when running through the frog and having the other wheel held by the corresponding check rail.

I suspect the last one is your problem.

Offline Drjeggle  
#3 Posted : 27 February 2015 12:56:02(UTC)
Drjeggle

South Africa   
Joined: 13/11/2014(UTC)
Posts: 4
Location: GAUTENG, JOHANNESBURG
Hey!

Thanks for your response. The boggies on teh tender do not actually moce at all. They are fixed. Unless I am an idiot and there is something I'm supposed to loosen up before operating it...? It doesn't seem that way though. I'm pretty sure it's not the angle of the turnout as I have tried it on several different ones. Even a radius turnout does the same thing. The tender is really close to the locomotive and it seems more like the tender actually lifts up rather than de-rails if you know what I mean. As if there isn't enough space between the tender and locomotive for it to turn but, then surely it should do that on the a curved piece of track. Man, I really have no clue about this stuff. None of my Marklin trains have a problem, only this one. I will have a closer look at it tonight and see if I can figure something out.
Thanks again!
Offline jvuye  
#4 Posted : 27 February 2015 13:50:13(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,881
Location: South Western France
Originally Posted by: Drjeggle Go to Quoted Post
Hey!

Thanks for your response. The boggies on teh tender do not actually moce at all. They are fixed. Unless I am an idiot and there is something I'm supposed to loosen up before operating it...? It doesn't seem that way though. I'm pretty sure it's not the angle of the turnout as I have tried it on several different ones. Even a radius turnout does the same thing. The tender is really close to the locomotive and it seems more like the tender actually lifts up rather than de-rails if you know what I mean. As if there isn't enough space between the tender and locomotive for it to turn but, then surely it should do that on the a curved piece of track. Man, I really have no clue about this stuff. None of my Marklin trains have a problem, only this one. I will have a closer look at it tonight and see if I can figure something out.
Thanks again!


Hi!
The pick up shoe probably doesn't retract properly when passing over the (higher) contact points like those you find on switches.
At least, that's what it could be from the symptoms you describe.
Check that the pick up can be pushed up against the chassis and that it does son unimpaired, on both ends.
Good luck!
Cheers
Jacques
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
Offline mike c  
#5 Posted : 28 February 2015 02:38:29(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,147
Location: Montreal, QC
I believe that the model in question has the slider and the motor in the tender. The model is equipped with Roco's "Flusterschleifer", which is a new design for the slider and is designed to run quieter than the traditional version. It does require a little more clearance than the older ones and this may be problematic on older M track.

I guess the first question would be which M-Track are you using, the older solid rail track or the newer one with studs? The next question would be does the problem occur when going in both directions (Straight or turning) or only when turning? Does the problem happen when the loco is travelling in either direction (forward or backwards)? Does the problem still occur if you flip the loco around 180 degrees?

Here are the possibilities of what is causing your problem:

1) The slider needs to travel over the rail, so the studs or third rail is a little elevated. This is actually lifting up the tender and causes the wheels to leave the rails.
The Flusterschleifer requires a little more clearance. You might have better results with a normal slider. You will have to order the short slider (40003) and connect it to the circuit board where the original slider was connected.
2) The motorized tender is actually pushing the locomotive as it moves. If the locomotive is having trouble, this could actually cause the tender to push against it, causing the tender to leave the rails. This can be detected by carefully observing the locomotive as it traverses the switch to see where the problem first occurs. Do the wheels on the loco move freely or is there some sign of a problem? It could be that the narrow radius switch could be too tight for the 5 main wheels to navigate, causing the tender to push up instead of forward. If you flip the loco around and go tender first, the main wheels will enter the curve later and you will be able to see if this is the problem.
3) The connection between locomotive and tender is having an issue with the tight radius and is forcing the tender to lift. You should be able to observe if this is the case and you should be able to test this by running the loco and tender on a straight section that leads into a curve of the same radius as the switch

If you have a smartphone or camera that can take videos, record what happens, post it on YouTube as private and then paste the link here so we can see if we can help

Regards

Mike C
Offline Drjeggle  
#6 Posted : 28 February 2015 07:37:08(UTC)
Drjeggle

South Africa   
Joined: 13/11/2014(UTC)
Posts: 4
Location: GAUTENG, JOHANNESBURG
Thanks everyone for the help! When I got home yesterday, I ran the loco over the turnout and noticed that it was indeed the slider which was pushing the tender up. I flipped the loco upside down and un-clipped the slider and saw that one of the sides where it clips into was bent which was preventing the slider from flexing as it went over the higher studs. I bent it straight and wala! It works!!! I do need to change some of the points though because some studs have worn down from age, making a bit of a gap on the points which is fine for the Märklin models with the longer sliders but not so good for this loco with the shorter slider.
Thanks again for the help guys!!!

Happy modeling to you all!
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