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Offline charles Sharpe  
#1 Posted : 02 November 2011 07:57:13(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
It has happened again the loss of functions when I do a software update. I decided to do the update as the CS2 is not connected to the internet down the garden I did a back up first. I then took the CS2 with the trans to the house plugged it all back in and connected the internet wire in the back of the unit. I asked it to do the update and all went well. I then moved it back to the layout and plugged it all back in and switch the CS2 back on and it booted up as normal. It asked me if I wanted to update the MS2 and I click yes and that went ok. But know as the same as last time I have lost the function to 4 signals 2 will not light up at all and the other 2 will both go to green or red. It is always the same 2 signal that do this. If this happens went all the track is ballasted it is going to be a nightmare and it is such a waste of time. The signal are 76391 I must be doing some thing wrong Please can you help me.

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline river6109  
#2 Posted : 02 November 2011 09:22:22(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,728
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Charles,

Not being able to help you technically but what about unplugging the signals in question and see what's happen after that ?
I would also look at the signals that work correctly and compare the wiring with the others, maybe there is an interference, e.g. wrong decoder number ?
Do you program the signals ?

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline nevw  
#3 Posted : 02 November 2011 09:58:18(UTC)
nevw

Australia   
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,071
Location: Murrumba Downs QLD
CHarles,

Make a backup before you do the upgrade and then restore after the upgrade.
That may be a solution.
ALways , always do a backup before an UPGRADE
NN
NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders
and a hose pipe on the aorta
Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
Offline charles Sharpe  
#4 Posted : 02 November 2011 14:59:23(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Originally Posted by: river6109 Go to Quoted Post
Charles,

Not being able to help you technically but what about unplugging the signals in question and see what's happen after that ?
I would also look at the signals that work correctly and compare the wiring with the others, maybe there is an interference, e.g. wrong decoder number ?
Do you program the signals ?

John



Hello John.

Yes all signals programmed by us and all wiring the same and all worked before update.

Charles
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline charles Sharpe  
#5 Posted : 02 November 2011 15:05:03(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Originally Posted by: nevw Go to Quoted Post
CHarles,

Make a backup before you do the upgrade and then restore after the upgrade.
That may be a solution.
ALways , always do a backup before an UPGRADE
NN


Hello.

Back up made before. when I go to restore I get a list like this. The top one has a grey highlight over it but if you click on any of them you will get the same. So which one do I highlight and then press the upgrade tab.

back up tgz
back ip tgz-1
infocentre tgz
reset tgz
resetccc. tgz
reset marklin tgz
vor-update aur-v1-1-4 tgz

.Charles

Edited by user 06 November 2011 07:57:06(UTC)  | Reason: Added some more text to help the reader

CHARLES SHARPE
Offline charles Sharpe  
#6 Posted : 07 November 2011 19:45:48(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Can anybody tell me which one to hi light before I do a restore. It is imposable not to hi light one of then so it is a case of which one Charles..
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline charles Sharpe  
#7 Posted : 08 November 2011 23:52:11(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Am I the only one out in the big wild world that is having this problem . I have gone back to the basics but it don't help with this one. Factory reset is not a option.there more to life than spend days reprograming all my functions/ect. I think I will have to get on the phone to marklin tec dept and see what they have say.Angry Angry
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline Nielsenr  
#8 Posted : 09 November 2011 01:14:30(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Charles,

I have not experienced this occurrence with my CS2 after software updates. I have not used the new software version that much since my floor bahn is undergoing reconstruction on wood modules that will sit on the floor. My testing so far of the modules show the signals to be working fine.

My only problem in the past has been after an emergency stop. At that time some of the 76XXX signals refuse to respond. However, after a reboot, they function appropriately again.

One question, are the two signals in question prior to V2.0 of the signals? Apparently some time ago, Marklin updated the software in the signals and I think I have read that they upgraded the older versions for free. I am not sure what the problem with the old version was. I have to admit that I have a couple of the old version signal software and I haven't seen anything odd, other than the previously mentioned problem. And I am not sure if they are the ones not responding after an emergency stop.

And as a point of interest, since my signal electronics are now going to be installed under the boards and not easily accessible, on one of them I have soldered wires to the area where the "programming clip" contacts and brought the wires out to the side of the module where I have soldered some inline pins. When I want to program a signal, I install it in the base of that unit and put a shorting shunt across the two pins. I have tested this already and it works great!! You might consider something similar when you finally secure everything down on your layout.

I wish you luck with your problem. And please post if you find the cause of the problem or what solution fixed the problem.

Robert

P.S. Ooops!! I just looked, all of my signals are V2.0 ... check your boxes ...
Offline David Dewar  
#9 Posted : 09 November 2011 16:50:41(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,343
Location: Scotland
Hi Charles. Sorry I cant help as I have not had the problem. I do all updates on a USB stick and other than not knowing just what the updates are everything previously has worked OK. I dont like the newer type signals ( 76... type) and only use the older ones.
You say it is the same two signals that have a problem and I presume therefore that the others all operate OK. If everything else works then the CS2 should not be the problem but the signals themselves or the wiring.
Can you change a signal that is not working with another one that you know is OK.

dave
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
Offline charles Sharpe  
#10 Posted : 09 November 2011 19:03:11(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Originally Posted by: Nielsenr Go to Quoted Post
Charles,

I have not experienced this occurrence with my CS2 after software updates. I have not used the new software version that much since my floor bahn is undergoing reconstruction on wood modules that will sit on the floor. My testing so far of the modules show the signals to be working fine.

My only problem in the past has been after an emergency stop. At that time some of the 76XXX signals refuse to respond. However, after a reboot, they function appropriately again.

One question, are the two signals in question prior to V2.0 of the signals? Apparently some time ago, Marklin updated the software in the signals and I think I have read that they upgraded the older versions for free. I am not sure what the problem with the old version was. I have to admit that I have a couple of the old version signal software and I haven't seen anything odd, other than the previously mentioned problem. And I am not sure if they are the ones not responding after an emergency stop.

And as a point of interest, since my signal electronics are now going to be installed under the boards and not easily accessible, on one of them I have soldered wires to the area where the "programming clip" contacts and brought the wires out to the side of the module where I have soldered some inline pins. When I want to program a signal, I install it in the base of that unit and put a shorting shunt across the two pins. I have tested this already and it works great!! You might consider something similar when you finally secure everything down on your layout.

I wish you luck with your problem. And please post if you find the cause of the problem or what solution fixed the problem.

Robert

P.S. Ooops!! I just looked, all of my signals are V2.0 ... check your boxes ...


Hi Yes all signals are V2.0. I think the idea to solder wires to the place were the clip goes is a brilliant idea many thanks for that.

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline charles Sharpe  
#11 Posted : 09 November 2011 19:09:06(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
Hi Charles. Sorry I cant help as I have not had the problem. I do all updates on a USB stick and other than not knowing just what the updates are everything previously has worked OK. I dont like the newer type signals ( 76... type) and only use the older ones.
You say it is the same two signals that have a problem and I presume therefore that the others all operate OK. If everything else works then the CS2 should not be the problem but the signals themselves or the wiring.
Can you change a signal that is not working with another one that you know is OK.

dave


Hello David.

When you did your update did you do a restore afterwards and if so which one of the list did you high light and then do the restore. See my list from thread above. I think it is impossible to do a restore without high lighting any one from the list.

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline David Dewar  
#12 Posted : 09 November 2011 20:40:45(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,343
Location: Scotland
Hi Charles. After downloading to the USB stick I just pop it into the CS2 and and upload. Never done anything else for all the updates.
Sorry that in this case I cant be of any help.
I know how annoying it is when we cant get something working as it should but hopefully somebody can help.

dave
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
Offline Nilkram  
#13 Posted : 09 November 2011 22:59:58(UTC)
Nilkram


Joined: 18/02/2010(UTC)
Posts: 43
Location: Netherlands
Charles

Nowhere I read in your comments that you have checked if the update was successfull. Check if the version 1.6.4. was installed right.
If not, put the update on an USB stick (take a 'clean' stick), put the USB stick at the backside of the CS2, switch on the CS2 (can last 5 minutes) go to setup and install the program. Then restart the CS. Check afterwards if the right version is on the CS.
If everything is o.k you can program your signals again, see the FAQ in the Märklin help service (Märklin Digital, Central Station, program 76xxx profi signals).

There is also a possibility to call the Märklin help service, see their website.
That's all I can advise you.

Jan
Offline charles Sharpe  
#14 Posted : 09 November 2011 23:41:32(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Jan.

Were can I find FAQ bit I have been on the M site and all can get is products/ repairs / dealers.

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline Moris  
#15 Posted : 10 November 2011 14:28:45(UTC)
Moris

Italy   
Joined: 11/05/2007(UTC)
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by: charles Sharpe Go to Quoted Post

Were can I find FAQ bit I have been on the M site and all can get is products/ repairs / dealers.



On the german site: http://www.maerklin.de/de/service/hilfe/faq.html, then "Central Station" and then "Programmierung der Signale 76xxx".

Unfortunately it's only in german, but a good online translator can help Wink.

Moris
60216 CS3+ with 60175 Booster, Mostly Era III & IV German UserPostedImage and USA UserPostedImage Diesel & Steam Locs, C-Track Layout (always under construction...)
Offline Nilkram  
#16 Posted : 10 November 2011 22:35:56(UTC)
Nilkram


Joined: 18/02/2010(UTC)
Posts: 43
Location: Netherlands
Charles & Moris

The link to the Märklin website is o.k. When you go to 'Startseite' you can click on Märklin International and the website is in English. I guess that reads more pretty for you 'foreigners'Cool

Jan
Offline charles Sharpe  
#17 Posted : 15 November 2011 15:23:38(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Hello.

I have checked that I have the latest software and I have the latest so I have done a restore as it has been suggested and Disaster has happened I have lost everything all layout pages trains the lot. It has gone back to German speck. I did a back up before the update so how do I get that to work.


Charles Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline charles Sharpe  
#18 Posted : 16 November 2011 17:48:06(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Hello.

In desperation I brought the CS2 back down to the house and plugged it into the internet and did the upgrade again it said it was successful but I then had a message come up to say NO TRACK FORMAT PROCESSOR AVAILABLE. I have never seen this notice before. The CS2 is back on the layout and I have got back all the trains /routes etc but I have no functions ie trains will not move turnouts all dead unable to use the program track.etc. If you call up a loco you get all the icons down the sides as normal but won't work and when you turn the red knobs the red arrow moves around the dial but you get no needle stays put and the speed green bar will not move.
Please can you help me I am getting desperate .

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline charles Sharpe  
#19 Posted : 16 November 2011 18:25:46(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Please can you tell me if my settings are right INFORMATION

CS2 60213 SW 1.6.4 [3]

HW 3.1 Booster 60173 / 3684
item no 60173
version 1.38
trafo 60052 but my trans is 60061


CAN GATEWAY

starts can gateway is set to auto

destination address says 192 .168 .1 .255

IP

auto DHCP
mac address 00.e0.4b.21.06.5e
ip address 169.254.169.149
ip net template 255.255.0
ip gateway is blank
dns server 192.1681.254




TRACK

Speed sener dynamics box Blank

Slaid loc automatically box Black

Gles format loks box says Auto

GERATE

nothing in the box.

Veiw

Status injury interval box says 10 seconds.

active mouse curser box has a tick.



I hope all this makes sense .

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline charles Sharpe  
#20 Posted : 25 November 2011 21:42:26(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
FIXED

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline Webmaster  
#21 Posted : 25 November 2011 22:02:31(UTC)
Webmaster


Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC)
Posts: 11,161
Dear Charles

How did you manage to fix it?

I am just curious since the responses to this topic from experts have been - let's say, rather scarce, to put it mildly...Crying
Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service...
He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
Offline charles Sharpe  
#22 Posted : 28 November 2011 22:17:23(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Hello Juhan.

What can I say I was disappointed with the response but I know other people have there own lives to live. My train friend got it going for me and he said it was more look then anything else. He deleted the whole lot off the CS1 and then closed it down. He then booted it up again and he used a backup I made on a usb stick about 12 months ago. He then shut it down again. We made a cup of tea crossed his fingers and re booted it up. Ha presto it all but 3 signals came to live but what we found to our amassment is that it has the up to date HW and SW on it. My health is not good at the moment and I was really worried that the unit might have to go back to Marklin. This happens every time I do a back up that we loose some of the signals and it is a pain in the bum to have to keep reprogramming them. I t is going to be impossible too do them when the track gets it's ballast glued in. We have decided that we are to bypass the red wires that are used under the track and as suggested solider some wires the the parts were the clip goes when you re program them. We can then short them out and make up a very long cable to go from the CS to connect into each of the white boxs under the layout. It is going to take some time to do them all like this but it will be worth it in the end.

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline Nielsenr  
#23 Posted : 28 November 2011 23:20:05(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Charles,

It is good to see you got things back up and running again!! Reading between the lines of what you wrote as to what your friend did, I will make an assumption the your friend did a factory reboot. I recently had a problem with my CS2 that had all of the S88 contacts acting really funny after I crossed some wires wrong. I saved my data to a file on the CS2, rebooted with the factory default, and then did some testing. Things seemed ok. I restored my data and everything has been fine since then. I didn't offer that as a solution to you before because I had never done it. I guess, like most computers (the CS2 is a computer) the operating data can get messed up in the CS2 while running and then when you do a normal shutdown, it saves the messed up information so that when you start it the next time, it loads the same messed up data. Going back to a factory reset brings the CS2 back to a pristine, "vanilla" state.

I also am glad you liked my idea about soldering some wires to the spot on the signal electronics board to short out remotely in place of the clip. But it sounds like you are going to run wires to all of the boards to short each one separately. That can be done, but remember that the address for the digital signals is stored in the mast head not the electronics board. Unless your signal masts are going to be in hard to reach areas, you need to only solder wires to the clip area of one signal electronics board and then just slide any signal out of its base and slide it into the base of the one you have soldered the remote wires to, preferably the closest one to get to, and then program it. When done, slide it out and put it back to the base where it belongs. If you meant something else from you description or your layout will make the masts un-removable (I wouldn't recommend that), I apologize for not understanding.

Good luck with your layout!!

Robert
Offline charles Sharpe  
#24 Posted : 28 November 2011 23:48:56(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Hello Robert.

So if I short out the clip which is nearest to CS which is signal no 10 I then take the mast no15 and put it on no10 base program it for no15 and the put it back on no15 base it will work. Is that how I should be reading it.

Charles.
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline Nielsenr  
#25 Posted : 29 November 2011 00:27:13(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Yes, that is correct Charles. As I said, the address is programmed into the mast head, not the electronic circuit board that is underneath the track. That means wherever you install the mast, that is the address at that location. Move the mast to a different location, it is still the same address.

I have to go out at the moment but later tonight I will scan a page from the The HO Signal Book (03402) that says this and I will post it here. If you have the 03402 book, it is on page 8-2.

Robert
Offline Nielsenr  
#26 Posted : 29 November 2011 07:22:58(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Charles,

Here is the page from the HO Signal Book. Look down the first column to the paragraph that starts with "Important":

UserPostedImage

Hope this helps ...

Robert
Offline charles Sharpe  
#27 Posted : 29 November 2011 16:35:03(UTC)
charles Sharpe


Joined: 21/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,432
Location: NORFOLK UK
Hello Robert.

You have made my day with this news and my friend is coming on thursday and I know he will be please. I will get him to put the wires on the signal pc board nearest to the CS2.

many thanks once again

Charles. BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin BigGrin
CHARLES SHARPE
Offline Nielsenr  
#28 Posted : 29 November 2011 18:59:05(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Your welcome Charles!! Glad to help!!

Robert
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