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Offline sebastian  
#1 Posted : 14 February 2010 18:47:17(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
Hi all,
After a long wait, I am in the position to present you the final draft of my intended layout.
The plan has been put together using Wintrack by one of our members here in the forum. He is HAXPET. He was very helpful and came with new ideas and improvements over my initial drawing. I cannot thank him enough for being so humble and dedicating his own time to help me with this. A big THANK YOU goes to you Haxpet for all you've done. ThumpUp ThumpUp
The plan is a big one, since I do have the space. It measures approximately 6m X 3.35m. It has three layers, with lots of action at the surface, a big station with six tracks, a yard with a turntable and roundhouse with six or nine stalls, four bridges, mountains, tunnels etc. I wanted to use as much as possible curves in R5 and R4, as well as wide angle switches for more lifelike operations and look. I have not put a hidden staging yard.
If there is anything that you think could be changed to improve it, fire away. But please have in mind that I do not have Wintrack (I'm a Mac user), so I cannot make any changes to the drawings. Let me know your what your thoughts, comments critiques are.
Here it is:


UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline Piggy  
#2 Posted : 14 February 2010 18:59:30(UTC)
Piggy

Australia   
Joined: 08/05/2009(UTC)
Posts: 590
Location: Sydney
Very nice big layout. I really like the big soft curves. Will it be easy access the track behind, in case of derailments? Have you considered lower level staging area?
Regards
Kenneth
CS1 update - K & C tracks - German Era 3B & 4, with some Swiss and Austrian visitors. - My Layout
Offline sebastian  
#3 Posted : 14 February 2010 19:44:55(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
Piggy wrote:
Very nice big layout. I really like the big soft curves. Will it be easy access the track behind, in case of derailments? Have you considered lower level staging area?


Thanks Piggy. I will have to put some access hatches so I can easily get to the back area. I have considered it, but have not done it yet. I would like to have the ability to store long trains in there.
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline GSRR  
#4 Posted : 14 February 2010 20:09:54(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Sebastian,

Certainly is a big layout, and quite fortunate that Haxpet has stepped forward for another forum member again! Do you know the dimensions for the turntable / lokshed area?

Oh, and how much track is required?

Regards,

Thomas

ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline sebastian  
#5 Posted : 14 February 2010 20:25:33(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
GSRR wrote:
Sebastian,

Certainly is a big layout, and quite fortunate that Haxpet has stepped forward for another forum member again! Do you know the dimensions for the turntable / lokshed area?

Oh, and how much track is required?

Regards,

Thomas


Thanks Thomas. Yes, I am fortunate to have had Haxpet's unconditional help. He truly is great guy. I believe the dimensions of the turntable/lokshed are 135 cm x 120 cm. In terms of track, he sent me a list with all the track required for the layout, in one of the revisions. That list does not reflect the latest changes that you can see in the posted pics.
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline GSRR  
#6 Posted : 14 February 2010 20:41:05(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
sebastian wrote:
GSRR wrote:
Sebastian,

Certainly is a big layout, and quite fortunate that Haxpet has stepped forward for another forum member again! Do you know the dimensions for the turntable / lokshed area?

Oh, and how much track is required?

Regards,

Thomas


Thanks Thomas. Yes, I am fortunate to have had Haxpet's unconditional help. He truly is great guy. I believe the dimensions of the turntable/lokshed are 135 cm x 120 cm. In terms of track, he sent me a list with all the track required for the layout, in one of the revisions. That list does not reflect the latest changes that you can see in the posted pics.



Ok thanks. How will you run it? Digital, feedback?

Wiring alone will be a Herculean task. BigGrin


ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline sebastian  
#7 Posted : 14 February 2010 20:44:23(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
GSRR wrote:
sebastian wrote:
GSRR wrote:
Sebastian,

Certainly is a big layout, and quite fortunate that Haxpet has stepped forward for another forum member again! Do you know the dimensions for the turntable / lokshed area?

Oh, and how much track is required?

Regards,

Thomas


Thanks Thomas. Yes, I am fortunate to have had Haxpet's unconditional help. He truly is great guy. I believe the dimensions of the turntable/lokshed are 135 cm x 120 cm. In terms of track, he sent me a list with all the track required for the layout, in one of the revisions. That list does not reflect the latest changes that you can see in the posted pics.



Ok thanks. How will you run it? Digital, feedback?

Wiring alone will be a Herculean task. BigGrin




What do you mean digital, feedback? Blink Blink
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline GSRR  
#8 Posted : 14 February 2010 20:44:46(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Sebastian,

Hard to tell from the size of the picture. Are you using a 76510 Coaling station?



Thomas


ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline GSRR  
#9 Posted : 14 February 2010 20:58:24(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
sebastian wrote:
GSRR wrote:
sebastian wrote:
GSRR wrote:
Sebastian,




What do you mean digital, feedback? Blink Blink



Sorry, what will you use for control? Analog, Central station? Decoders, track feedback for lok position.


ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline TomB  
#10 Posted : 14 February 2010 20:58:30(UTC)
TomB


Joined: 08/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 412
Location: Asker, Norway
I guess you will miss more place for platforms in your stations. I did my main station like this:

UserPostedImage
Tom Blikstad
HO, german/swiss trains, Märklin K+C, ECoS I+II,
Viessmann, Kühn, MBTronik, WinDigipet 2012, WinTrack 11
Offline Writhdar  
#11 Posted : 14 February 2010 21:11:45(UTC)
Writhdar


Joined: 19/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 207
Location: Durango, Colorado
Sebastian,

I suggest you get a track planning program that works on the Mac. It would allow you to try out possible tweaks/ideas, etc. with little effort. The biggest effort would actually be in manually putting the present plan onto your computer. A commercial program that some people on the forum use is railmodeller:
http://www.railmodeller.com/.
I have a PC and use a freeware program, Xtrkcad, but there may be a Mac version now available: http://www.xtrkcad.org/Wikka/MacOSX
Offline scraigen  
#12 Posted : 14 February 2010 22:41:57(UTC)
scraigen


Joined: 29/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: Sheffield,
Hi

Nice plan, I'm in planning stage with mine - don't know when that will end, as time to get anything built is constantly slipping away, but I'm having hours of fun with http://www.railmodeller.com/ on my Mac, it has its quirks, but its pretty cheap and works reasonably well, and you get free upgrades.

Stu
Must build something
Offline sebastian  
#13 Posted : 14 February 2010 23:53:28(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
Thomas, I use Central Station. I would like to have traffic control as automatic as possible. Whether this means feedback or decoders or something else, I do not know at this point, as I am not that knowledgeable in this area. Of course, I do not want to take away from the fun as effectively control my trains and stop them whenever I want. I have a lot to learn, I know.
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline sebastian  
#14 Posted : 14 February 2010 23:55:03(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
TomB wrote:
I guess you will miss more place for platforms in your stations. I did my main station like this:


Tom, I was thinking about having the main station in an angle so I can have more space for longer trains.
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline sebastian  
#15 Posted : 14 February 2010 23:56:38(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
Thanks guys, I will look into railmodeller. Maybe I can work something out with it. BigGrin
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline hxmiesa  
#16 Posted : 15 February 2010 12:42:57(UTC)
hxmiesa

Spain   
Joined: 15/12/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,594
Location: Spain
Overall very nice, although I have some comments;

1) The partly single-line return-loop; to what is it connected? -Maybe you need another smaller loop for reverseing from the opposite direction. (Should be fairly east to implement. Maybe in combination with an inward industrial area)

2) Your station/platform tracks are quite short. -Because you use slim switches, and because you have access from all tracks to all platforms. In practice this is not needed (IMHO as always, of course! ;-) -and you could save some swithces and platform-length if you went for a more "right-hand" circulation concept. (or left if it is a swiss layout... :-)

3) I dont see any shadow-station or storage-tracks. I think that is a big mistake.

4) I wonder why you dont use the "dogbone" principle layout style for more interessting running¿?
Best regards
Henrik Hoexbroe ("The Dane In Spain")
http://hoexbroe.tripod.com
Offline sebastian  
#17 Posted : 15 February 2010 14:43:55(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
Thanks Henrik. Please find my answers below. In essence, I am not that good with layout planning, so I am bound to make mistakes. Any help would be appreciated. BigGrin

hxmiesa wrote:
Overall very nice, although I have some comments;
1) The partly single-line return-loop; to what is it connected? -Maybe you need another smaller loop for reverseing from the opposite direction. (Should be fairly east to implement. Maybe in combination with an inward industrial area)
A: Which one? I can't see it.

hxmiesa wrote:

2) Your station/platform tracks are quite short. -Because you use slim switches, and because you have access from all tracks to all platforms. In practice this is not needed (IMHO as always, of course! ;-) -and you could save some swithces and platform-length if you went for a more "right-hand" circulation concept. (or left if it is a swiss layout... :-)
A: I was thinking to use the slim switches, so the passenger cars do not waddle from one side to the other when going through the switches. I know the station is short. Crying Which solution would you recommend?

hxmiesa wrote:

3) I dont see any shadow-station or storage-tracks. I think that is a big mistake.
A: I know. I have that in mind and I will put one. BigGrin

hxmiesa wrote:

4) I wonder why you dont use the "dogbone" principle layout style for more interessting running¿?
A: I don't understand. Can you give me more details?

DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline Piggy  
#18 Posted : 15 February 2010 15:10:36(UTC)
Piggy

Australia   
Joined: 08/05/2009(UTC)
Posts: 590
Location: Sydney
A small thought, regarding the station area. You should consider the spacing between the tracks to match the platforms.
Regards
Kenneth
CS1 update - K & C tracks - German Era 3B & 4, with some Swiss and Austrian visitors. - My Layout
Offline hxmiesa  
#19 Posted : 15 February 2010 16:23:14(UTC)
hxmiesa

Spain   
Joined: 15/12/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,594
Location: Spain
sebastian wrote:
A: Which one? I can't see it.

Now that I watch the plan again, I think that you got the reurn loops already covered! (although I still dont see where they are connected, but it is clear that there are two of them ;-)

To get more length for the platform tracks, It´s like I have mentioned; you can dedicate 1 or 2 tracks in each direction to "one-direction" use only. You can then edit the plan, removing all the cross-overs and swtiches which wouldnt be necessary to enter the track in opposite direction.

A "dogbone" style layout is when you imagine one big singletracked oval line. Then you squeze it flat in the middle, so that you get a line with two parallel tracks, with return-loops in each end. Now, if you hide these two return-loops in tunnels (maybe even combined with a shadow station in each return loop) then what remains visible is a double tracked mainline. -Much like what you have planned already, except that the trains will be travelleing in both directions in the visible part, giving the illusion of "real" running and more variety compared to the standard "double oval" concept you are using currently.

What Piggy says is very important; You cant fit a platform in the 64mm parallel space. (which only leaves around 24mm free once track and ballast is subtracted.) Normally you would want AT LEAST 90mm between tracks for platforms. (meassured from track centres.) -although there are commercial platform kits available which will fit with 77mm distance.
Best regards
Henrik Hoexbroe ("The Dane In Spain")
http://hoexbroe.tripod.com
Offline sebastian  
#20 Posted : 15 February 2010 22:03:05(UTC)
sebastian

Canada   
Joined: 01/02/2007(UTC)
Posts: 729
Location: Ontario
Thanks Piggy, Henrik. I will ask Haxpet if he can make the changes proposed here and see what comes out of it. Like I said, I do not have Wintrack. I will also try to give Railmodeller a try. ThumpUp
DRG, DB and SBB
Era II, III and IV
Sincerely,
Sebastian
Offline haxpet  
#21 Posted : 23 February 2010 15:54:37(UTC)
haxpet


Joined: 17/11/2005(UTC)
Posts: 198
Location: Finland, Åland
Hi all.

As you all have figured out by now, this trackplan is made by me. So I will try and explain it a bit

This layout features both the dogbone and the merry-go-round. So your trains can go out in one end of the station and then enter the other end, or it can go out and enter at the same end. This works in both directions.

At the moment there is no hidden yard. I have made on to this plan but Sebastian haven't got that plan yet. But for the moment it's only 7 more tracks in the bottom level for trains from about 4 meters to 2 meters. I think it's possible to add a couple of more tracks. But I have been busy with other stuff for a while.

The size is actually 6.10 x 2.35 meters, and the roundhouse area is 1.30 x 1.20 meters.

I have made this plan so that trains can access all tracks in the station area, that is the way that Sebastian wanted it from the beginning. I have done other layouts where you have this right hand traffic. And then you only have to be able to access every other track.

And as you all pointed out already, these slim switches takes up a lot of room on the table, but the are beautiful.
Märklin, 3R, Digital (system), C-Track, favourit loco: Baureihe 103 137-6
My homepage: http://home.aland.net/mi...da/MR/modelrailroad.html
I will buy Märklin 4644 BP tankerwagons that have the original box and are in good condition. (No broken details)
Offline JT42CWRDriver  
#22 Posted : 24 February 2010 09:52:25(UTC)
JT42CWRDriver


Joined: 28/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 136
Location: Newton Abbot, Devon. UK.
I too am another very satisfied user of Railmodeller on my Mac.

Cheers,
Peter.
3 Rail/2 Rail Märklin, Fleischmann, Roco. DCC.
Offline steventrain  
#23 Posted : 27 February 2010 20:54:41(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 31,692
Location: United Kingdom
Very good trackplan, How long by wide feets is it?
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline klarinettmeister  
#24 Posted : 02 March 2010 00:22:54(UTC)
klarinettmeister

Sweden   
Joined: 13/02/2008(UTC)
Posts: 811
Location: Kirseberg
Impressive! It looks fun! I envy you for having that space. The layout is the size of my apartment.
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