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Offline Chrome  
#1 Posted : 28 October 2004 19:44:40(UTC)
Chrome


Joined: 26/09/2004(UTC)
Posts: 67
Location: ,
Hello,

I have an idea I'd like to share with you.

While digital control of trains, block control etc. today is very well developed and rather cheap, actual control of where one specific loco is on the track is more difficult. The commercial systems availiable are rather expensive and have limitations.

Here is my idea for an alternative.

Barcodes seems like a very nice way to go.

Rolling stock: Print some cheap labels with a unique number to put under every loc and wagon. On long locs you can put two if you want.

Layout: Install barcode scanners under the layout at the places you want to check for the trains. Connect those to a computer.

So far the limiting step in this is the barcode scanner. Most are expensive (€200+) and I have no idea how easy it would be to connect several to a computer and still be able to easilly from which one of the (potentially very many) scanners the signals comes from.

Untill the other day when I by pure coincidence found this on ebay:
http://search.ebay.com/cue-cat

The cue cat barcode scanners were given away for free at some point as advertising. The idea was to connect the cue cat barcode scanner to your computer. Scan interesting ads in magazines and stuff and the website would pop up on you computer.

Now, this concept failed and the cue cats are being used as cheap scanners for all sort of stuff.

As you can see, they are cheap, less then $10 per piece, so it will actually be possible to buy a lot to get many detection spots on your layout.

The cue cat connects to your computer via the keyboard (PS2 or USB) and sends a string of numbers when a barcode is scanned.

Furthermore it seems like the cue cats have some internal serial number (used in the advertising project for tracking of users) that is sends with the barcode number. This is ideal for this purpose because it will enable easy discrimination between a lot of scanners.

Some software then needs to be written that translates the number sent via the keyboard into a specific loc/wagon and position on the layout.

My plan is to buy a handfull or so of these devices from ebay and see how far I can get with this project. Perhaps some of you have some hints or prior experiences using barcode scanners?

I'll keep you posted on how this adventure turns out, but it might take a while to get set up.

/Brian
Offline xxup  
#2 Posted : 28 October 2004 23:37:54(UTC)
xxup

Australia   
Joined: 15/03/2003(UTC)
Posts: 9,586
Location: Australia
Unless these things work off the USB port, it is hard to see how more than one can be connected to each PC. It is not normal to use more than one barcode scanner with a PC. On the other hand, I am using 48 contacts (or s88 ports) to manage multiple trains on a modest (but track intensive) 3.5x0.9m layout. That's a lot of scanners!

However multiple portable scanners with wireless link, as used by supermarkets to manage inventory, could communicate with a single PC. Once again, it would depend on the lead time and the connection method (ie does the computer poll each in a sequence and engage in "chatter" to download the latest numbers.. In other words, where there are multiple trains running, the polling and "chatter" may be too slow to update a train's position with accuracy.

In spite of the air of negativity in the above commentc, I like the idea and you will have fun working through the technical issues.. They have a small snout - making it possible to hide in a trackside builing or in an overhead signal bridge..

Good luck.
Adrian
UserPostedImage
Australia flag by abFlags.com
Offline rschaffr  
#3 Posted : 28 October 2004 23:58:51(UTC)
rschaffr

United States   
Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC)
Posts: 5,181
Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
Brian:

Interesting project. Do keep us informed of your progress. I had considered that type of approach but didn't pursue it past the dream stage because of the difficulties I could forsee in setting it up.
-Ron
Digital, Epoch IV-V(K-track/CS3/6021Connect/60216051), Epoch III(C-track/6021/6036/6051)
http://www.sem-co.com/~rschaffr/trains/trains.html
Offline perz  
#4 Posted : 29 October 2004 00:45:59(UTC)
perz

Sweden   
Joined: 12/01/2002(UTC)
Posts: 2,578
Location: Sweden
There have been (and maybe still are) commercial barcode systems for model railway use. The drawbacks are, beside reader cost, the bulky size of the reader and the disturbing red light they use for the reading. For these reasons, barcode reading hasn't become popular. The cue-cat reader overcomes much of the cost problem, but the two remaining problems aren't solved. I also do not know whether the cue-cat scanner is of the "really scanning" type or if it relies on that you move it over the barcode by hand. In the latter case it will only be able to read bar codes on trains that are moving, not on the ones that are standing still. But this is maybe a minor limitation. The good thing with barcode reading is that the labels are almost for free and don't need power, so you can detect every single car on your layout.

I have thought of using barcode for this purpose but with a custom-built IR reader. A barcode reader is actually a reflex detector coupled to a microcomputer with a not too complicated SW. The reflex detector itself can be made very small and it can be made to use IR instead of red light.

However I abandoned the idea because I didn't believe it would be reliable enough, and specificly it would fail if the barcode label stops just over the detector. Instead I developed an active IR based transmitter/receiver similar to the Uhlenbrock Lissy (but not with the built in SW functionality that Lissy has).
Offline Maxi  
#5 Posted : 30 October 2004 00:54:05(UTC)
Maxi


Joined: 28/04/2003(UTC)
Posts: 757
Location: Wawa, Ontario
This is certainly a topic which did not get much attention mostly for reasons previously stated. Looking at the barcode readers it appears that the unit will have to be moved across the barcode for it to be read as apposed to just holding the barcode reader and letting the beam do the scanning.

This will definetly be a detailed challenge in getting the kinks worked out but the knowledge gathered will always be priceless.
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