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Offline Davy  
#1 Posted : 01 December 2006 15:26:00(UTC)
Davy


Joined: 29/08/2003(UTC)
Posts: 1,915
Location: Netherlands
I read this article in the Eisenbahn Kurier from oktober 2006.

The carriages comes from the shopwindow in the modeltrainshop which is proteced though a sunshade.
Carriages from Fleischmann, Brawa and Marklin survived undamaged the hot summer. The Piko carriages transformed in something new.


UserPostedImagebiggrin
M-track with a CS2.
Offline RayF  
#2 Posted : 01 December 2006 19:01:43(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,871
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Yikes!!![:0]
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline verheyen  
#3 Posted : 01 December 2006 19:45:42(UTC)
verheyen


Joined: 25/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 639
Location: ,
While very dramatic, this sort of thing can happen to all plastics when exposed to high levels of light and heat. I have had numerous Piko coaches (including the one shown)for many years now and not had anything happen. On the other hand, I have some Märklin cars (mostly older 2-axle flat cars) that have slightly deformed (and always been stored in coolish dark basements) and then there was also the old Ram TEE that had issues. I have seen images of an attic layout where the c-track expanded in the heat and buckled so that it lifted off the layout for a long length. The point is that one needs to be careful where one stores things. Layouts in attics under the roof are not always a good idea. Sometimes we don't have a choice where we keep things. Heat/UV light and plastics don't go together so well. The light can also bleach out colors. So, if you want the proper bleached out shade of DB Orient Red put your trains in the sun. ;)

p.
Offline steventrain  
#4 Posted : 01 December 2006 20:05:32(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 31,697
Location: United Kingdom
Very poor plastic thing.
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline Hemmerich  
#5 Posted : 01 December 2006 20:45:59(UTC)
Hemmerich


Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,734
Location: ,
The real issue is the BIG difference between these "junk pieces" and other companies' products, which apparently survived w/o problems under the SAME conditions.
Offline verheyen  
#6 Posted : 01 December 2006 21:15:10(UTC)
verheyen


Joined: 25/01/2004(UTC)
Posts: 639
Location: ,
Like early C-track and apparently some more recent examples as well? Since they're junk, what I encourage you to do is buy one and place it in a place where you can slowly increase the temperature to see how high at what point things start deforming. As for "same" conditions, all it takes is for a tree to shade half the shop window and the other half to be in direct intense sun. Btw, Brawa is made in China, as are some Roco and even Märklin (perhaps I'll borrow one of my wife's Z-gauge cars), and others. Have fun. [}:)]

Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Hemmerich
<br />The real issue is the BIG difference between these "junk pieces" and other companies' products, which apparently survived w/o problems under the SAME conditions.
Offline Goofy  
#7 Posted : 01 December 2006 21:28:59(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,282
Brawa is not made in China...!

All vehicles from Brawa are producing in Germany...!

Goofy Cool
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline jonquinn  
#8 Posted : 01 December 2006 21:46:32(UTC)
jonquinn


Joined: 15/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,591
Location: Pennsylvania
quality or performance of the plastic (resistance to heat in this case) has NOTHING to do with country of manufacture. It has everything to do with what grades of materials were specified to be used by their parent company (PIKO in this instance). PIKO is producing models to meet a certain price range. maybe we are being insulated from any news, but we haven;t ehard so far about PIKO being financially insolvent, have we?
If you're dumb enough to keep plastic models in a window exposed to direct sunlight - then this is what you deserve.

And go look at the tags on you BRAWA Br65 steam loco - made in PR China. Same goes with the big Trix/Marklin Schnabel transformer carrier.
You will find a wide ranging mix of production equipment in PR china, from older to extremely modern. Many chinese probably also have a much better work ethic than europeans and the americas.
Offline steventrain  
#9 Posted : 01 December 2006 22:24:43(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 31,697
Location: United Kingdom
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Goofy
<br />Brawa is not made in China...!

All vehicles from Brawa are producing in Germany...!

Goofy Cool


Are you sure that 100% made in Germany?
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline john black  
#10 Posted : 01 December 2006 23:09:26(UTC)
john black

United States   
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC)
Posts: 12,139
Location: New York, NY
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by jonquinn
<br />If you're dumb enough to keep plastic models in a window exposed to direct sunlight
- then this is what you deserve

biggrinbiggrinbiggrin
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators.
AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only.
CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ...
Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide

Offline hxmiesa  
#11 Posted : 01 December 2006 23:38:05(UTC)
hxmiesa

Spain   
Joined: 15/12/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,594
Location: Spain
My old original ICE (The first one M. made of the Experimental train, with two motorized units, has gone quite yellowish instead of clear white. It has been exposed to "some" sunlight through a window.
Apart from this deteoriation of the plastic, it also has other tecnical problems.
Not at all a good product.
-But very expensive, oh yes it was... &lt;sigh&gt;
Best regards
Henrik Hoexbroe ("The Dane In Spain")
http://hoexbroe.tripod.com
Offline Hemmerich  
#12 Posted : 02 December 2006 02:06:13(UTC)
Hemmerich


Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,734
Location: ,
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by verheyen
Have fun. [}:)]


Since you should still be skilled enough in reading German text, you know what I mean "in comparison" and "under same conditions". There is a good reason why only this Piko "junk" deformed to such an extreme, but not the models of those other named manufacturers. [}:)]

BTW: Why didn't this guy get his C-tracks exchanged for free - u never told him about Märklin's replacement offer? Cool
Offline hmsfix  
#13 Posted : 02 December 2006 02:21:00(UTC)
hmsfix


Joined: 06/02/2005(UTC)
Posts: 1,383
Location: Darmstadt,
[:0][:0][:0] What a mess, these car bodies! It's a joke, isn't it ?

There are different kinds of problems that may occur with plastic, but there are also injection mold plastic materials that are durable, and insensitive to sun and (reasonable) heat. Used in any automobile.

Definitely no question of german or american or chinese production. Also the chinese injection mold manufacturers have a polymer data book and know how to make high quality plastic products.

But this is simply...incredible.

Hans Martin



Offline JT42CWRDriver  
#14 Posted : 04 December 2006 15:00:12(UTC)
JT42CWRDriver


Joined: 28/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 136
Location: Newton Abbot, Devon. UK.
I'm not suprised the Piko vehicles deformed when others did not. I have a Piko Br 146 and the body on that is made of a brittle cheap looking plastic. It has now been replaced by a Trix metal one which is much better.Smile

Regarding the C Track with it's specially developed (by BASF) plastic, this is more worrying. I was going to use some of this in the loft. The temperature ranges from 1 deg C to 37 deg C.

Would I be better off sticking with K track?

Cheers,

Peter.
3 Rail/2 Rail Märklin, Fleischmann, Roco. DCC.
Offline Goofy  
#15 Posted : 04 December 2006 19:16:48(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,282
That`s way Piko vehicles are so cheap to bying,not the same quality like as the Marklin "stuff"...! biggrin

Piko,go home...!!! [xx(]

Goofy Cool
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline David Dewar  
#16 Posted : 05 December 2006 00:48:07(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,460
Location: Scotland
Hi Peter. I have C track in my loft with no problem. I do have a window which can be opened which is useful. I dont know where you live in the UK but most of my problems come with the winter and trying to keep the central heating going in the loft[:(] My wife thinks it is a waste of fuel when I switch on the heating an hour before playing.
Dont worry about C track its top quality stuff.

David
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
Offline john black  
#17 Posted : 05 December 2006 01:17:18(UTC)
john black

United States   
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC)
Posts: 12,139
Location: New York, NY
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by David Dewar
<br />My wife thinks it is a waste of fuel when I switch on the heating an hour before playing

David: Why not give Sheila a little try before. About two hours should do ... [}:)]biggrin

Peter: David is right. In summertime my train room gets about 55 C before I switch on A/C.
No trouble whatsoever to my C-track or other M stuff [^]
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators.
AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only.
CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ...
Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide

Offline JT42CWRDriver  
#18 Posted : 05 December 2006 15:59:08(UTC)
JT42CWRDriver


Joined: 28/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 136
Location: Newton Abbot, Devon. UK.
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by john black
<br />
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by David Dewar
<br />My wife thinks it is a waste of fuel when I switch on the heating an hour before playing

David: Why not give Sheila a little try before. About two hours should do ... [}:)]biggrin

Peter: David is right. In summertime my train room gets about 55 C before I switch on A/C.
No trouble whatsoever to my C-track or other M stuff [^]



Thanks for the replies guys, it's good to know that quality gear will stand up to these extremes of temperature, it brings to mind the phrase "the quality is there long after the price is forgotten". Why don't more wives understand that?!!

My wife also rebelled when I was using an electric fan heater in the loft, I've now replaced it with a freestanding halogen heater to keep the bills down, although at the moment I haven't needed it. Down here in Devon we are having a very mild winter, the loft was 15 C yesterday.

Cheers,

Peter.
3 Rail/2 Rail Märklin, Fleischmann, Roco. DCC.
Offline David Dewar  
#19 Posted : 05 December 2006 18:29:04(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,460
Location: Scotland
Im off to Devon to save on the heating bills.
Keep us up to date with the loft layout Peter. Its good to see anopther UK member although at the wrong end of the country !!

David
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
Offline john black  
#20 Posted : 05 December 2006 18:39:51(UTC)
john black

United States   
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC)
Posts: 12,139
Location: New York, NY
Happy holiday, David biggrin - don't forget to bring your travel layout ...
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators.
AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only.
CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ...
Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide

Offline steventrain  
#21 Posted : 05 December 2006 22:50:24(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 31,697
Location: United Kingdom
Have a safe travel.
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline john black  
#22 Posted : 05 December 2006 23:45:38(UTC)
john black

United States   
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC)
Posts: 12,139
Location: New York, NY
Hey Steven - David is just joking ... [:o)]
The serious business will take place when he opens Monument Valley's First MRR Savings & Loan biggrin
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators.
AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only.
CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ...
Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide

Offline David Dewar  
#23 Posted : 05 December 2006 23:50:11(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,460
Location: Scotland
Sorry Steven if I mislead you. No more holidays until next summer Im afraid.

David
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
Offline MärCo  
#24 Posted : 14 December 2006 22:02:09(UTC)
MärCo


Joined: 06/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 1,159
Location: The Netherlands
Ever put a Märklin 44## car in intens sunlight?
I think in general plastic don't like heat and sunlight.
Absolutly AFB-NOHAB fan ;-)
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