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Offline Oscar  
#1 Posted : 25 November 2003 19:30:00(UTC)
Oscar


Joined: 25/11/2003(UTC)
Posts: 783
Location: ,
G'day Smile! New here! Great site, very informative! Have a few questions.

1. I have a bunch of old Marklin trains. To me, the weakest point seems to be the relay that changes the direction of the loco. There is a small spring on it. My experiences are as follows:
-spring a tad too tight ---> loco moves a bit when changing direction or doesn't change direction at all (just moves...FAST)
-spring a tad too loose ---> loco stops driving at medium speeds and hums.
I just bought an '80s model 3153 (BR120) and the sping was too tight. I have an old '60s 3921 (a kit of the V200) and I can't run it fast because the spring is a tad too loose. Same with an old 3937 (kit of the green E41). Went to an official dealer and had "the right" springs installed in each model. Things didn't improve greatly. I experiment with minute alterations to spring length and get decent results.
Any suggestions about making the relay work flawlessy are welcome!!

2. There seem to be speed drops on certain sections of the lay-out. I frequently change the lay-out (I've got a huge stack of old M-rails that I use to please the kids with, making room-filling lay-outs every other weekend) and there are always slower sections. There seems to be a correlation to distance from the transformer. Ohm's Law at work here? Resistance in the tracks? Suggestions?

Thanks for any info y'all might offer biggrin. Oh, for the model buffs, here's a list of my stuff:
2953 3003 3016 3029 3153 3366 3921 3937 4000 4002 4017 4018 4027 4041 4050 4159 4160 4506 4620 4621 4802 4903 4905 4908 4909 4912 4914
Offline perz  
#2 Posted : 25 November 2003 21:02:06(UTC)
perz

Sweden   
Joined: 12/01/2002(UTC)
Posts: 2,578
Location: Sweden
Hi Oscar,

Welcome to the forum.
1. The direction relay is a weak point, I agree. Apart from adjusting the spring tension, cleaning of the contacts and checking that the wires are soldered correctly.

The definite way to fix it is to change to an electronic direction relay or a convert to Delta or Digital. The regulated digital conversion will give the best performance, also in AC operation, but it is the most expensive alternative and can not be applied to all models. If the only purpose is to make it run flawlessly in AC operation, the two other alternatives are OK too. Delta decoders are also quite expensive if you buy them new, but I think it should be possible to find second hand Delta decoders, since many people replace their Delta decoders with regulated digital ones.

2. Speed drop on certain sections is usually caused by bad contact in the track joints. By carefully adjusting the "track connectors" (don't know the proper name in English) with pliars, and bending the tongues for the center rail connection, you can improve the contact. Also, feeding the tracks at multiple places (feed both "red" and "brown") is a good idea.
Offline franciscohg  
#3 Posted : 25 November 2003 21:38:57(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,274
Location: Patagonia
Hi Oscar, i agree with perz, to regulate the spring may be a very difficult task, but with some work you can have the locos running smoothly. The drop of tension is a kwonw fact, marklin recomend feeders every 4-6 feets.
Bye
Francisco
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#4 Posted : 25 November 2003 22:13:31(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
My additions to the wise words already said.
- The points are related. On a distance from the feeder track you will get more "rush" when trying to change diretion.
- It's quite in order to have several feeder tracks on the layout. You don't have to buy them, you can do it yourself. The red cable is easiest; you can just press it between the two tongues of two tracks (not a good but a cheap solution). However, the brown cable is more important normally; soldering is always an advantage. Some people recommend no more than 10 tracks between connection, but it certainly is possible with greater distance. Remember that if you use signal stop sections, you force the current to go much longer distance too.

/Lars
Offline PeFu  
#5 Posted : 26 November 2003 00:01:12(UTC)
PeFu

Sweden   
Joined: 30/08/2002(UTC)
Posts: 1,210
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by perz
<br />The definite way to fix it is to change to an electronic direction relay or a convert to Delta or Digital ... Delta decoders are also quite expensive if you buy them new, but I think it should be possible to find second hand Delta decoders, since many people replace their Delta decoders with regulated digital ones.


One of my suppliers, Kurt Bothner (Stuttgart), has loads of old (but "new") delta decoders (Märklin 6603) at 22 EUR/each on http://www.bothner-model...e/html/digitalteile.html . The result should be good in analogue mode.

Cool Peter
Andreasburg-Mattiasberg Bahn is inspired by Swiss railways |Forum Thread |Track Plan |Youtube | C and K track | CS2 | TrainController Gold V10
Offline Oscar  
#6 Posted : 26 November 2003 11:49:50(UTC)
Oscar


Joined: 25/11/2003(UTC)
Posts: 783
Location: ,
Thanks Smile!! I'll add several feeder tracks to the lay-out from now on. I'm intrigued by Lars' observation that my problems are related. I'd say he's right!

I'm going to browse this site a bit more to figure out what the difference is between Delta and Digital, how a Delta decoder works and how it could run "in analog mode."
Offline kgsjoqvist  
#7 Posted : 26 November 2003 14:56:09(UTC)
kgsjoqvist

Sweden   
Joined: 04/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 754
Location: Täby
There are basically 3 differences between Delta and Digital decoders:

1) Delta runs with AC motors (all-current/alternative current) - which is the same kind that is used in analogue Märklin locos. Digital decoders runs with DC motors (direct current).

2) Digital has acceleration/brake delay, which gives the trains a more realistic start and stop. Delta starts more abruptly and brakes in the same way.

3) Digital has extra function outputs for lights, TELEX, sound etc. (if these are available on the loco). Only the latest Delta decoders have outputs for light - most Delta locos have only light change with direction and light intensity changing with speed...

Besides these 3 major differences there are a few more: Digital has more addresses (80 vs 15). Digital works automatically with analogue current without setting the DIP-switches (Delta has to be set to "address 0"). And this is only the facts about the locos - the control units are very different - but compatible to some degree.

The message is - if you buy a loco, always go for Digital if you can afford it, even if you use a Delta unit on your layout!

/K-G
K-G / H0 and Z model train user
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#8 Posted : 26 November 2003 15:22:54(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
K-G,
we have a hard time to explain this matters, as facts change all the time. I think your summary is good, but nevertheless, only as a rule of thumb. And times change. I bought the Berlin commuter set this summer, which clearly has a Delta loco. With DC motor, decent (but not adjustable) brake, controllable light and 80 adresses...
I would also recommend digital when buying a loco, but one must remember that lights might not function with analog or old delta unit.

Lars,
always willing to spread confusion. :-)
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