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Offline kevwill  
#1 Posted : 01 November 2011 20:05:40(UTC)
kevwill


Joined: 17/05/2008(UTC)
Posts: 153
Location: Norfolk, England
I'm still in the learning phase of model trains the Marklin way,and i'd be grateful for help
I have 9 mfx loco's and i would like to know how to upgrade them to the latest sounds. Is there a thread or post on here from the past, or does someone know a youtube video on this subject. Is upgrading something a complete novice like myself would be able to do.
Also i have 4 fx locos and would like to upgrade them to mfx with the latest sounds too.
Some times i feel really uneducated on electrics and digital and i'm reluctant sometimes to post silly questions like this but i really would like some advice.
I'm still in building stage but while i had the budget i wanted to use it for upgrading the loco's

Many thanks

Kevin
My wife, children, and all my friends, think as i'm into Model trains, i'm very boring and should grow up. NEVER NEVER!!!
Offline H0  
#2 Posted : 01 November 2011 22:12:32(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,276
Location: DE-NW
The decoders of early mfx locos are not locked against updates. You can upload new sound projects with an ESU lokprogrammer.

Later decoders (approx. 2006 and later) are locked. You need a new decoder to upload a new sound project. You may need new speakers, too, as there are different speaker impedances in use.

fx locos can be upgraded to sound decoders if they do not have the C Sine motor and if the space allows the speaker(s).

I never installed a sound decoder, therefore I can only provide some general information.
If the current decoder is plugged in, then you may be able to do the upgrade with little or even no soldering.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline kevwill  
#3 Posted : 02 November 2011 20:15:54(UTC)
kevwill


Joined: 17/05/2008(UTC)
Posts: 153
Location: Norfolk, England
Tom
Thank you for all your help, i understand what you've said and the advice really helps

Kevin
My wife, children, and all my friends, think as i'm into Model trains, i'm very boring and should grow up. NEVER NEVER!!!
Offline Webmaster  
#4 Posted : 03 November 2011 19:21:41(UTC)
Webmaster


Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC)
Posts: 11,162
If you use ESU mfx (m4) LokSound decoders for upgrades, you can upload sound projects with the ESU programmer... Is it possibe to do it with an Ecos too?

As Tom says, the first M mfx sound loks had an "untampered" ESU LokSound decoder, but somehow they managed to lock them so they became less flexible...

M has introduced some new decoder kits, also with sound, but I don't know if you can upload sounds to them - if possible, it will probably be with CS2 with a very late hw/sw version...

If anyone knows more about the new M decoder sets, please make a noise about it... BigGrin
Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service...
He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
Offline pa-pauls  
#5 Posted : 04 November 2011 01:26:08(UTC)
pa-pauls


Joined: 08/06/2002(UTC)
Posts: 1,843
Location: Norway
Originally Posted by: Webmaster Go to Quoted Post
...if possible, it will probably be with CS2 with a very late hw/sw version...

Yes ThumpUp
Pål Paulsen
Märklin Spur 1 Digital, epoche 3
Offline Hemmerich  
#6 Posted : 06 November 2011 00:41:00(UTC)
Hemmerich


Joined: 15/04/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,734
Location: ,
Originally Posted by: pa-pauls Go to Quoted Post
Yes ThumpUp

Hi Pål,

as we discussed earlier this might depend upon the decoder HW&FW version.

The (quite extensive) documentation which comes with the set(s) actually refers to CS-II V2.0 and to even more information on the Märklin server which will be made available soon. Wink
Offline jeehring  
#7 Posted : 06 November 2011 11:57:11(UTC)
jeehring


Joined: 25/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 2,786
Location: ,
...the new Marklin decoder kits are not yet available here in France, but...according Marklin leaflets and written info here and there, it should be possible to upload sounds directly with the CS2 + one of the next software update.
No need extra hardware, nor any kind of "lokprogrammer"...which is one more advantage of the CS2...ThumpUp

Edited by user 06 November 2011 15:38:18(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline NZMarklinist  
#8 Posted : 07 November 2011 02:19:06(UTC)
NZMarklinist

New Zealand   
Joined: 15/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,757
Location: Auckland NZ
Originally Posted by: kevwill Go to Quoted Post
I'm still in the learning phase of model trains the Marklin way,and i'd be grateful for help
I have 9 mfx loco's and i would like to know how to upgrade them to the latest sounds. Is there a thread or post on here from the past, or does someone know a youtube video on this subject. Is upgrading something a complete novice like myself would be able to do.
Also i have 4 fx locos and would like to upgrade them to mfx with the latest sounds too.
Some times i feel really uneducated on electrics and digital and i'm reluctant sometimes to post silly questions like this but i really would like some advice.
I'm still in building stage but while i had the budget i wanted to use it for upgrading the loco's

Many thanks

Kevin

Hello Kevin,
I have early and the latest Marklin Loks with MFX decoders and sounds. There is probably not a lot to be gained just yet in upgrading the sounds of your early (2005) MFX Loks, you can only use sounds from the ESU menu anyway as the new Marklin ones may not necessarily be compatible, nobody knows yet as Marklin haven't made them available.
Another vital point is the early decoders do not have much memory space, so probably won't hold a newer sound project.Sad I have upgraded or should I say one of the list members here in Auckland NZ has upgraded for me, several analogue and FX Loks. It also depends what type of decoder your present Lok has, ie is it a 21 pin decoder or a wired in type. If its a 21 pin variety one of the new Marklin ones or an ESU one of the 21 pin variety could be used. With ESU you really need an ESU Lok programmer to do the job succesfully, Dennis allways starts, decoderwise at least, by having the Lok programmer read the decoder for it's settings or CV's. Usually they will need to be programmed into the replacement decoder, this is absolutely vital with C Sine propulsion as the settings are different to the 5 star or non Sine Can motors which themselves are different.
I had a brand new M39800 MFX C Sine V200 go up in smoke on it's first run, two of the wires from the decoder board to the CSine driver board were jammed under the body mount and shorted out causing the complete burnout of the decoder. A small repair was also necessary to the Decoder board as an IC had been burnt thru. Dennis replaced the Decoder with the 21 pin ESU one and downloaded the V200 sound project from their site and put it on the decoder via the ESU Lokprogrammer and away it went, well not quite, The 21 pin decoder you buy from ESU has by default, the sound for a Klass 64 Steam Lok on it, the 64 of course is C Sine but anyway Dennis knew or obtained the C Sine CV's for the V200, adjusted the decoder accordingly, then it went and yes with a lot more sound functiuons than you get with a standard Marklin Issue C Sine V200. I have three of those now but I will not bother to upgrade the other two, because the MAIN sounds are really no different. Presently we are waiting on the new Marklin ones to upgrade a 37900 V290 I have, to sounds, double "A" light function (for shunting) and telex couplers. We are hoping the new Marklin ones will have an extra function output which will allow the Telex couplers to be switched independantly from one another. Dennis also has a CS2 which will enable the handling of the new Marklin sound project. Now sorry if thats a bit boring for some but, I just wanted you to know Kevin, that decoder upgrades involve more than just a physical swap. So to answer the fourth part or your first question it's fair to say it's not something a novice could do easily, but we all start with no knowledge Huh Smile
I decided to short circuit the learning process by getting somebody who allready had the knowledge and the equipment to do the job. See; http://www.thetraindoctor.co.nz/ for a few free ideas.
You also need to make a descision on a controller ie CS2, or ESU Lok programmer to work with everything else, when making a decision on which decoders to use for your upgrades. What you have now is probably a good starting point ThumpUp
Let us know how you get on, you will get helpful suggestions as you go where needed RollEyes
BTW I have no financial or other interest in the Train Dr (Dennis) I'm just another satisfied customer.ThumpUp
Glen
Auckland NZ

" Every Marklin layout needs a V200, a Railbus and a Banana car", not to mention a few Black and red Steamers, oh and the odd Elok !

CS1 Reloaded, Touch Cab, C Track Modules, K track layout all under construction. Currently Insider
Offline drwhitl  
#9 Posted : 07 November 2011 06:04:02(UTC)
drwhitl


Joined: 12/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 97
Location: Auckland,
Originally Posted by: kevwill Go to Quoted Post
I'm still in the learning phase of model trains the Marklin way,and i'd be grateful for help
I have 9 mfx loco's and i would like to know how to upgrade them to the latest sounds. Is there a thread or post on here from the past, or does someone know a youtube video on this subject. Is upgrading something a complete novice like myself would be able to do.
Also i have 4 fx locos and would like to upgrade them to mfx with the latest sounds too.
Some times i feel really uneducated on electrics and digital and i'm reluctant sometimes to post silly questions like this but i really would like some advice.
I'm still in building stage but while i had the budget i wanted to use it for upgrading the loco's

Many thanks

Kevin



Hi Kevin,

I think Tom, Glenn and others have said most of it already, but just to clarify some points a little:

Presuming your MFX decoders are factory installed, generally they'll have 21 pin conectors. The ESU and Marklin 21 pin sound decoders are PIN compatible (direct drop in replacement) but you will need to:
a) find space for a speaker
b) probably wire from the 21 pin "mother board" to the speakers
c) ensure that the sound decoder will fit in the space of the old MFX decoder (the sound decoders are larger)
d) check CVs of the existing decoder to give you a good starting point for getting the new one set up correctly

The loksound/MFX (ESU) decoders mostly have an 8 pin NEM connectors which is no use at all to you, but there is one (ESU 62499) that has a 21 pin connector. You will require the ESU lokprogrammer to be able to load the correct sound files into it and the files themselves are downloadable from ESU's website. If you don't want to invest in a lokprogrammer, whoever you buy your deocders off should be able to sell you one with the correct sound file alreday loaded on it. I don't believe you can upload sound files to your decoder with the ECOS-2 but the other decoder CVs etc are programmable with one, (or a MArklin CS2)

The new Märklin sound decoders are still eagerly awaited (any minute now Drool) but I presume what we're really waiting for is the sound files and the CS2 software release that will enable one to program them.

Unless ESU have a philosophical change of heart, The ESU lokprogrammer will almost certainly NOT be able to program Marklin decoders.

With regard to your locos that have FX decoders, the same space considertaions apply, but the ease of swapout will depend largely on the type of interface on the existing decoder. It depends on the model, but some may be quite difficult in that the decoder is an integral part of a larger PCB that may have all manner of other components integrated into it. Lamps (other general loco wiring etc). Best leave those ones until last when you may have gained some confidence and knowledge by doing the simpler ones.

Glenn,
Thank you for your kind words

Have fun
Dennis
Offline kevwill  
#10 Posted : 07 November 2011 20:31:49(UTC)
kevwill


Joined: 17/05/2008(UTC)
Posts: 153
Location: Norfolk, England
Glen,Dennis,Pal,Tom and Juhan thank you so much for your words of advice, i will take in ,all what you say. It helps me very much and i will update you when i come round to doing the updates.

Thank you very much

Kevin
My wife, children, and all my friends, think as i'm into Model trains, i'm very boring and should grow up. NEVER NEVER!!!
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