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Offline bookcabinet  
#1 Posted : 27 July 2021 22:19:50(UTC)
bookcabinet

Canada   
Joined: 18/07/2021(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: New Brunswick, Moncton
I recently acquired an m-track set from the 1970's without a transformer. I've found a used 110v European transformer for sale - model 6114. It is the correct voltage for my country (Canada) but is designed for 50Hz main current rather than 60Hz. Everything I've read says that shouldn't be an issue - apparently the opposite scenario (using a 60Hz transformer with 50Hz input) could cause issues like overheating but not the other way around. It has a European plug but I can either use a simple adapter or rewire it.

Anyone have experience using one of these in the US or Canada?

Thanks,
Evan
Offline DaleSchultz  
#2 Posted : 28 July 2021 02:53:15(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,857
I would be very surprised that a 110V transformer has a European plug on it.
Since Europe does not use 110V I cant get my head around what you mean by a 110V European transformer.

Can you post an image of the plug and the plate where it says 110V ?
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by DaleSchultz
Offline marklinist5999  
#3 Posted : 28 July 2021 02:59:46(UTC)
marklinist5999

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2021(UTC)
Posts: 939
Location: Michigan, Troy
Yeah, strange! Maybe it's a 100 volt trafo. For Japan?
Offline mike c  
#4 Posted : 28 July 2021 05:31:48(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,206
Location: Montreal, QC
Hi Evan,

Marklin models are designed to work with 50 or 60Hz, so they will operate when used with that transformer.
Those transformers are old enough to be affected by the decay of the wires inside the shielding, which can cause a short and potentially a fire.
My recommendation would be to locate a 6646, which can be had for around 100-130 US and use that to power your layout.

You can try Westend Trains or John's Photo in Toronto, RJF Trains in the New York area or AJC Kids in Texas or on eBay.

The other reason to opt for a newer transformer is that the reverse pulse on the older transformers could damage the decoder/electronics on newer locomotives.

Regards

Mike C
Offline Mman  
#5 Posted : 28 July 2021 15:04:10(UTC)
Mman

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/05/2021(UTC)
Posts: 72
Location: England, Guildford
European countries haven’t always been 230 v plus or minus 10% (the current standard) although by the 1950s most were. Looking at the packaging of a 6114 it is certainly not pre 1950s so I assume it was made to cater for all requirements and somewhere must still have had it. Transformers were used when countries initially went over to 230 so older appliances were still usable and just maybe some ultra cautious parents would only let little Hans or Pierre loose with 110v?
Offline bookcabinet  
#6 Posted : 28 July 2021 15:50:00(UTC)
bookcabinet

Canada   
Joined: 18/07/2021(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: New Brunswick, Moncton
Here are pictures of the one I was looking at (I don’t have a picture of the back plate):

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

From the research I’ve done, it looks like this 6114 model was made for both Europe (220v) and the US (110v), both at 50Hz. I've found a number of pictures of the back that show the voltage stamped on, but the Hz is pre-printed as 50 Hz. Here is an example of a US one on ebay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm...82c56:g:ee4AAOSw6WZgsAxS

So the 110v one above with the European style plug must either be a US one that was modified or maybe was made for a country with a round plug like Europe and 110v current (if such a country exists). In either case, it would probably work okay here. But while doing the research, I also found out that there are some issues with the wiring of these old transformers and that the quality is much better in the newer analog ones like the 6646. So I think I’ll keep looking for a newer one.

Thanks for all the comments.

Evan
Offline bookcabinet  
#7 Posted : 28 July 2021 15:56:29(UTC)
bookcabinet

Canada   
Joined: 18/07/2021(UTC)
Posts: 5
Location: New Brunswick, Moncton
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
Hi Evan,

Marklin models are designed to work with 50 or 60Hz, so they will operate when used with that transformer.
Those transformers are old enough to be affected by the decay of the wires inside the shielding, which can cause a short and potentially a fire.
My recommendation would be to locate a 6646, which can be had for around 100-130 US and use that to power your layout.

You can try Westend Trains or John's Photo in Toronto, RJF Trains in the New York area or AJC Kids in Texas or on eBay.

The other reason to opt for a newer transformer is that the reverse pulse on the older transformers could damage the decoder/electronics on newer locomotives.

Regards

Mike C


Thanks. I did find similar information in the last few days that made me think it's better to get a newer one. Thanks for the tips on locating a 6646 model.

Evan
Offline DaleSchultz  
#8 Posted : 28 July 2021 21:52:07(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,857
it could also be that that transformer did not come in that box.

i.e. a box for a 110V transformer with a 220V transformer in it.
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
Offline ccranium  
#9 Posted : 29 July 2021 20:27:41(UTC)
ccranium


Joined: 30/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 13
Location: Seattle area
Originally Posted by: Mman Go to Quoted Post
European countries haven’t always been 230 v plus or minus 10% (the current standard) although by the 1950s most were. Looking at the packaging of a 6114 it is certainly not pre 1950s so I assume it was made to cater for all requirements and somewhere must still have had it. Transformers were used when countries initially went over to 230 so older appliances were still usable and just maybe some ultra cautious parents would only let little Hans or Pierre loose with 110v?


IMG_5030.jpg

The 1972 catalog shows the 6114 as 110V, and the image shows 50hz. Hope that helps with the mystery; the German descriptions may also when translated.

Brian
Offline Crazy Harry  
#10 Posted : 29 July 2021 21:38:34(UTC)
Crazy Harry

Canada   
Joined: 18/11/2008(UTC)
Posts: 410
Location: Oakville, Ontario
The description from the 1972 catalog and picture indicate a plastic casing for the 6114 transformer. Evan's (bookcabinet) picture shows a metal casing so it must be an older version in the wrong box. The only way to be sure is to get the information off the back plate on the transformer - it will have the electrical details and the Marklin product number. 50 or 60 cycle doesn't matter for the motors and lights (unless your running an electric clock). I have three 6153 30VA transformers that state 50 to 60 cycle, 110 to 115VAC input and have never had any issues.

Cheers,

Harold.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Crazy Harry
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