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Offline DaleSchultz  
#1 Posted : 25 May 2019 04:34:35(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,997
I see some excitement about an MS2 update that allows 32 functions to be controlled.

I am intrigued as to what one would actually do with 32 functions.....

So lets see who can produce the longest list of actual functions that they have in a single loco....

Rules:

  1. You must actually own the loco
  2. You must list the functions and what f number it is assigned to



Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
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Offline Goofy  
#2 Posted : 25 May 2019 06:51:02(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,019
This is my rule:
1. I want a loco to have fun with.
2. I want only to use functions which are machine sound, lighting effect and smoke generator.
3. I need only to start light and machine sound.
4. Go!
I agree that 32 functions are extreme and i don´t use them all.

Just simple! ThumpUp
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
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Offline river6109  
#3 Posted : 25 May 2019 12:14:53(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,722
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
one can add a few Aux functions from Aux 1 - Aux 7 but some of these Aux functions, some can be integrated with sound slot. for instance coal shoveling and the fire box, I think steam locos would take more functions than diesel or electrics.

DB BR 185, SBB Re 486

Electric loco: excluding lights on, you've got under F 1 = sound on, F 2 = high pitched horn, F 3 = low pitched horn, F 4 = short pitched horn low, F 5 = short pitched horn high, F 6 = double horn, F 7 = acceleration, F 8 = fan, F 9 = pantographs up & down, F 10 = open close doors, F 11 = high beam, F 12 = coupling, F 13 = tail light front, F 14 = tail light back, F 15 = cab light front, F 16 = cab light back, F 17 = motor room light, F18 = curve squeal, F 19 = track sound, F 20 = conductors whistle, F 21 = Shunting mode, F 22 = compressor, F 23 = compressed air let off, F 24 = announcement, F 25 = announcement, F 26 = announcement, F 27 = sound fader, F 28 = motor fan, F 29 = Aux 2 - interior lights for carriages, F 30 = Aux 3 = interior lights for carriages, F 31 = release/set brake, F 32 = automatic train control, F 33 = arcing Pantograph, F 34 = arcing brake shoes, F 35 = radio conversation 1 , F 36 = radio conversation 2,
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
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Offline Bigdaddynz  
#4 Posted : 25 May 2019 12:40:24(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,665
Location: New Zealand
This is the function list for my 55105 BR103 1 Gauge loco. It has 32 functions including the headlights, but I personally think 32 functions is way too many - I don't have 32 fingers to activate them all.

55105.JPG
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Offline xxup  
#5 Posted : 25 May 2019 12:56:24(UTC)
xxup

Australia   
Joined: 15/03/2003(UTC)
Posts: 9,472
Location: Australia
I don't really think that Marklin expect that you will use all of the functions, all of the time.. If you have computer control, then you have the opportunity to create a script that can incorporate most, if not all, of the functions..
Adrian
UserPostedImage
Australia flag by abFlags.com
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Offline Purellum  
#6 Posted : 25 May 2019 14:29:43(UTC)
Purellum

Denmark   
Joined: 08/11/2005(UTC)
Views messages in topic : 3,505
Location: Mullerup, 4200 Slagelse
Cool

Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
I don't have 32 fingers to activate them all.


But you can use your PC with 70+ buttons Cool

One finger at a time or 10............. ?? LOL

Per.

Cool

If you can dream it, you can do it!

I, the copyright holder of this work, hereby release it into the public domain. This applies worldwide.

In case this is not legally possible:
I grant anyone the right to use this work for any purpose, without any conditions, unless such conditions are required by law.

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Offline DaleSchultz  
#7 Posted : 25 May 2019 15:02:01(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,997
yes, I see that since any number of different sounds can be had, one can fill any number of function slots with different sound effects.

I see a lot of sounds effects in locos that have nothing to do with the loco (Eg station announcements, whistles, etc.)
(I run all those sorts of things from the station - so they can be used with all trains, not just those with special sound decoders.)

Brake squeals need not use an actual function slot either, being tied to high decelerations, (apart from switching that effect on or off).

Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
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Offline David Dewar  
#8 Posted : 25 May 2019 19:49:55(UTC)
David Dewar

Scotland   
Joined: 01/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 7,342
Location: Scotland
Hard to believe but I agree with Goofy ...almost as I also like the odd toot toot.
Take care I like Marklin and will defend the worlds greatest model rail manufacturer.
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Offline LongHairedDavid  
#9 Posted : 25 May 2019 20:00:53(UTC)
LongHairedDavid


Joined: 04/01/2019(UTC)
Posts: 344
Location: England, Ipswich
Originally Posted by: David Dewar Go to Quoted Post
Hard to believe but I agree with Goofy ...almost as I also like the odd toot toot.


I use the lights - just so I can see which way the loco will go! - basic sound, the horn/whistle and the relex couplers (on one single shunter).

I have been into DCC since around 2007 - when I had a shop selling the stuff - now retired and using a nice ECOS with my Marklin layout.
Long Haired David
AKA David Pennington
A mystified Maerklin Newbie
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Offline RayF  
#10 Posted : 25 May 2019 20:34:49(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,839
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
I have always said that most of the functions are irrelevant for me. I've never been able to think of more than 8 or so useful functions.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline Jabez  
#11 Posted : 25 May 2019 22:55:02(UTC)
Jabez

Belgium   
Joined: 30/08/2016(UTC)
Posts: 636
Location: Brussels
I'd go lower still. For a steamer, the chuff, the toot, the lights, and maybe as a fourth a sequential melange of injectors, compressor, pumps, generator and safety valve blowing, to remind you that the loco is alive while standing still. i.e. three F buttons and an automatic background.
Jabez
PS. I forgot brake squeal, which is nice, but since I leave it permanently on I hardly think of it as an F function.

Edited by user 26 May 2019 19:00:08(UTC)  | Reason: Forgetfullness

I heard that lonesome whistle blow. Hank Williams
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Offline Danlake  
#12 Posted : 25 May 2019 23:09:31(UTC)
Danlake

New Zealand   
Joined: 03/08/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,571
As discussed before in the forum, the decoder functions is not only limited to sounds but also how to control or simulate the loco and of course increasing light functions etc.

ESU full throttle features is an good example of what the future could bring and personally I find quite fun to operate (dynamic brakes, coasting and hold etc.).

So even though it may seem useless today I think there will be a need for these functions in the future. E.g. imagine you can have different decoder profiles and activate each individual one with a push button? That means you could tailor make drive characteristic based on a full loaded consist or empty?

Best Regards
Lasse
Digital 11m2 layout / C (M&K) tracks / Era IV / CS3 60226 / Train Controller Gold 9 with 4D sound. Mainly Danish and German Locomotives.
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Offline cookee_nz  
#13 Posted : 26 May 2019 05:17:56(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,954
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: DaleSchultz Go to Quoted Post
I see some excitement about an MS2 update that allows 32 functions to be controlled.

I am intrigued as to what one would actually do with 32 functions.....

So lets see who can produce the longest list of actual functions that they have in a single loco....

Rules:

  1. You must actually own the loco
  2. You must list the functions and what f number it is assigned to





Interesting topic, I held off replying until I saw what the theme of other comments might be.

I have only a very few Loco's with functions and I tend to agree with others here that it does seem some of them are a bit pointless.

I was particularly interested in John's list, and BD's chart of functions on his BR103.

For me, while I do enjoy 'operating' functions, it's all the different sounds I find most irritating, and my own personal feeling is that they don't always reflect real-world operation.

On the prototype, many of these sounds actually take place quite some distance from each other, so you could stand beside the loco say at the center, and although you might hear these actual sounds, some will come from close to you, some will be at one end of the loco, some will come from underneath etc. On a model, they almost always come from a single speaker that more often than not is nowhere near where the sounds actually should come from, and because they come from one source they tend to get lost in a general cacophony of noise.

And more importantly, many of these sounds are not sounds that are turned on or off on a real train, they just happen as a result of it's operation.

For example, "curve squeal" - really?, or how about a Contactor, or Main Relay. I don't have models with these effects so I'm curious, do these functions actually produce the desired sound when activated, or do they simply 'enable' the desired sound but it does not 'play' unless the circumstances require it?

So getting back to curve squeal, is the model sophisticated enough to know it's going around a curve to detect and play the sound if the effect is enabled, or is the modeler expected to be watching the train and activate the curve squeal every time it actually goes around a curve? If it's the former, then yes that's pretty smart and some people might like it, but if you are simply playing the sound manually, then why?? - the real engineer can't do that, the wheels either squeal (on a curve), or they don't (on a straight).

If you enable the Contactor or Main Relay, again, does this simply play the sound, or does it enable the sound ready to be played but only when the Loco starts moving? I think on the G1 models I've seen, sounds match the prototype in that the effect happens only when it's meant to but I don't know about H0 examples?

Synchronized chuff I get, vs a repeated repetitive chuff that does not relate to the wheels, but in a small space it's just another noise quickly lost when there is another effect or Loco also going.

Two models I have with 'operational' functions are the 39970 Catenary Maintenance Railcar and the 46715 Remote Crane.

The Catenary engine has a few sounds, machinery working etc which are ok but I rarely use them, but also movable Pantographs, and the ability to raise, rotate and lower the platform. I like that.

The crane has no sounds, but the crane operation can be controlled. The Boom lifted and lowered, the Hook extended and retracted, and the Crane Turret can rotate, really neat. Telex could have been useful on this model, but of course also added to the cost.

One often overlooked function I do like is the ability to switch on/off the inertia, or prototypical acceleration and braking. When you are positioning or testing a loco, sometimes you want it to respond instantly to the speed control, rather than waiting an age for it to sloooowly speed up and/or stop.

I also have the Observation Car 37850. The interior lights have two levels of brightness. Actually useful, or gimmicky? - I guess some people will have a layout where that option would actually be useful, but not me.

Cookee
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
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Offline DaleSchultz  
#14 Posted : 26 May 2019 14:24:04(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,997
Originally Posted by: Danlake Go to Quoted Post
imagine you can have different decoder profiles and activate each individual one with a push button? That means you could tailor make drive characteristic based on a full loaded consist or empty?



This has been possible using the software that drives the train since the beginning.
My software has done this since 1989.
Does not need functions at all.

Using Functions to switch things simply illustrates that the manufactures still don't understand that it is the software that is critical.
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
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Offline DaleSchultz  
#15 Posted : 26 May 2019 14:29:10(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,997
Originally Posted by: cookee_nz Go to Quoted Post


So getting back to curve squeal, is the model sophisticated enough to know it's going around a curve to detect and play the sound if the effect is enabled, or is the modeler expected to be watching the train and activate the curve squeal every time it actually goes around a curve? If it's the former, then yes that's pretty smart and some people might like it, but if you are simply playing the sound manually, then why?? - the real engineer can't do that, the wheels either squeal (on a curve), or they don't (on a straight).


I have a sound effect file of flange squeal, which I can play automatically for any train passing any curved track I like. The whole train squeals, not just the loco.

But if one did want to activate that function in a loco, the approach I would use would be to identify which curves should trigger it and when the train passes through those locations, the software triggers the loco functions. I do this for smoke, lights, whistle etc. so curve squeal would be no different.

Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
Offline MaerklinLife  
#16 Posted : 26 May 2019 18:22:50(UTC)
MaerklinLife


Joined: 03/02/2016(UTC)
Posts: 490
I personally don't care about how many functions are available or if they are relevant. I like the model, I go for it.

I have a few with more than 16 functions, don't know what they are and never use them. I turn on the light and run the model.

I value light effects over sound effects.
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Offline fusionfaded  
#17 Posted : 26 May 2019 22:58:10(UTC)
fusionfaded

Switzerland   
Joined: 04/01/2018(UTC)
Posts: 33
The most functions one of my models has is 28, it's the Roco Vectron LokRoll/SBBCI.

I'm a huge fan of those digital extras and personally I wouldn't mind getting another 32 functions on top of the ones right now.
Offline DaleSchultz  
#18 Posted : 26 May 2019 23:02:51(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,997
buy a second such loco then...
Dale
Intellibox + own software, K-Track
My current layout: https://cabin-layout.mixmox.com
Arrival and Departure signs: https://remotesign.mixmox.com
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Offline gene harvey  
#19 Posted : 27 May 2019 00:23:49(UTC)
gene harvey

United States   
Joined: 12/02/2019(UTC)
Posts: 7
Location: California, El Sobrante
That solves the problem with my wife. She says I should get the most functions possible. So I guess I get to buy another lok.

Regards,

gene
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Offline Minok  
#20 Posted : 28 May 2019 22:13:38(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,311
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
Originally Posted by: cookee_nz Go to Quoted Post

For example, "curve squeal" - really?, or how about a Contactor, or Main Relay. I don't have models with these effects so I'm curious, do these functions actually produce the desired sound when activated, or do they simply 'enable' the desired sound but it does not 'play' unless the circumstances require it?

So getting back to curve squeal, is the model sophisticated enough to know it's going around a curve to detect and play the sound if the effect is enabled, or is the modeler expected to be watching the train and activate the curve squeal every time it actually goes around a curve? If it's the former, then yes that's pretty smart and some people might like it, but if you are simply playing the sound manually, then why?? - the real engineer can't do that, the wheels either squeal (on a curve), or they don't (on a straight).


Some of the ESU locomotives I have have this flange squeel capability; you enable/disable the feature, and the loco auto-senses the condition where it plays the sound on top of the running sound of the engine. It provides more realistic sound when the loco is moving over turnouts and corners (low speed only).. if I recall the flange squeel doesn't play when the loco is running at speed, so its more a yard/switching area affect. I think its a neat feature, when your focusing on a single loco. Generally, I'd not have the sound on for my locomotives and only turn on the sound for one train when I'm going to control/focus on it. The cacophony of 10 trains with their sound tracks filling the room would probably drive me nuts.
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel:
https://youtube.com/@intercity134
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Offline Goofy  
#21 Posted : 29 May 2019 06:57:28(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,019
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post

The cacophony of 10 trains with their sound tracks filling the room would probably drive me nuts.


I agree with you!
That´s way i only use one locomotive/train set to listen with the sounds playing when the train drives around on the layout.
Just listen a steam locomotive out there in the landscape alone and suddenly a whistle eco in the landscape...BigGrin
The squel sound when the locomotive/train set arrives to the station area and pass over the turnouts in the slow speed...yeah! ThumpUp
Who needs all 32 functions and 10 trains at the same time?? Huh

H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline Harryv40  
#22 Posted : 29 May 2019 08:43:33(UTC)
Harryv40

United Kingdom   
Joined: 07/08/2015(UTC)
Posts: 243
Location: Wilshire
Hi
I agree with goofy!

Most sounds are a waste of time, a fairly basic sound of the loco running is nice, smoke, lights about fits the bill for me. I buy locos I like and most of the time they running without sounds. The only sound is the real sound of the electric motors running that reflects the skill of the maker.

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