Welcome to the forum   
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Share
Options
View
Go to last post in this topic Go to first unread post in this topic
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#1 Posted : 25 May 2018 12:10:55(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 17,497
Location: New Zealand
Tonight we held our normal monthly Clubnight, but for our clinic we had something rather special.

Cookee presented his Märklin Wunderrad (Wonder Wheel) which he recently acquired off a seller on NZ's auction site, Trademe.

These wheels were a promotional item (Märklin dealer code BKM7) that Märklin sold to dealers in the late 1950's and are made out of Märklin Metal.

I'll leave it to Cookee to provide more information.


"https://www.marklin-users.net/fo...M-track-and-BR-89-inside

https://www.marklin-users.net/fo...-BKM7-on-Trademe-NZ-1800

Who's a happy boy then?

Finally after much negotiation I have scored an original Wonder Wheel / Wunderrad - Märklin dealer code BKM7

It needs a reasonable amount of work, initially just a thoroughly good clean is the main thing, then I have to replace all the missing lamps, I have purchased some 12v E10 coloured LED's for now to see how they look. I can get incandescent lamps from Ritter, but they are like 3.00 Euro each, and there's 32 of them!! Plus postage vs 50 LED's from Aliexpress for around $30 NZ - it's a no-brainer for me.

I also have a few missing screws, (and some from the model also lol), plus assorted other 'could-be-better' things to repair or replace.

It's an interesting item in detail. The track is Modeller's track, finely cut through the base every 4 ties to allow the arc-curvature. Most of it is standard Marklin Metall but of necessity there are some apparently unique parts, although a few may still be actual Marklin parts from other obsolete products.

These 'BKM' items (5 in total) were available from 1953 until around 1957 or '58.

Of the Wunderrad, Markus Schild said there are about a dozen known examples. I have confirmed the existence now of 13 including mine, and I am certain of another one which I simply cannot now find any reference for but it is or was in a Restaurant in the USA somewhere. I read about it quite some time ago but every possible search combination I can think of has not thrown up any results. But if I can find it, that would be 14, unless it's been traded and is among the two or three US examples.

About 7 or 8 are in various museums in Europe, Frank Ronneberg of Tischbahn also has one - https://tischbahn.de/200...is-das-marklin-wunderrad

Three have been traded in the past 5-6 years and their current ownership is unknown but I can careful scrutinised the photos of all the example I know about and there are enough subtle differences to make me think at this stage that none of them are duplicates of another.

Hopefully later today I'll add some info regarding the ones I have found and documented.

To say I'm excited is probably an under-statement, it has to be among the more unique items one can hope to have but for sure, it's not for everyone.

For one thing, it's MASSIVE - you just get no idea until you are standing n front of it just how imposing a 1.1 mtr diameter wheel made of Marklin Metall really is!!

There has so far only been one example of a catalogue for them from 1954, it was on eBay a while back and while the quality is low, it's better than nothing.

I have approached some others for more information but of course everyone is busy these days so it can be a looong wait.

I also emailed a couple of the museums that have them requesting additional photos and will see what comes of those inquiries.


Wunderrad_01.jpg

Wunderrad_02.jpg

Wunderrad_04.jpg

Wunderrad_05.jpg

Wunderrad_03.jpg

Wunderrad_06.jpg

Edited by moderator 25 May 2018 23:24:39(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 28 users liked this useful post by Bigdaddynz
Offline cookee_nz  
#2 Posted : 25 May 2018 23:27:26(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,552
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Thanks Dave, I'll see if I can add some more info over the next day or three using the powerpoint slides from last night as a guide.

I was sure surprised by the reception and response it got, something most of our club had not seen or even knew existed.

Cookee
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by cookee_nz
Offline Ross  
#3 Posted : 26 May 2018 01:31:03(UTC)
Ross

Australia   
Joined: 25/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 752
Location: Sydney, NSW
Hi Cookee,

I think this makes you an official collector, well done on your acquisition.
Ross
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Ross
Offline cookee_nz  
#4 Posted : 26 May 2018 01:57:28(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,552
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Ross Go to Quoted Post
Hi Cookee,

I think this makes you an official collector, well done on your acquisition.


Cheers Ross, but 'enthusiast' please, 'collector' seems to have such connotations. Scared

I've certainly always had an eye for the eclectic, things that are a little different. A stroll around the house would quickly confirm that and I am blessed to have a supportive and equally enthusiastic wife to enjoy it all with.

Märklin-Mania !!
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by cookee_nz
Offline Pmare4  
#5 Posted : 26 May 2018 06:34:23(UTC)
Pmare4

Australia   
Joined: 15/10/2015(UTC)
Posts: 224
Location: Queensland, Brisbane
Yes, congratulations on your great acquisition Cookee!

Now we all need to see some video footage... *just* to prove it works.

regards
Peter
Peter
Collecting vintage Märklin from 1935-1970, also Hornby O Gauge
Offline cookee_nz  
#6 Posted : 26 May 2018 10:05:27(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,552
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Pmare4 Go to Quoted Post
Yes, congratulations on your great acquisition Cookee!

Now we all need to see some video footage... *just* to prove it works.

regards
Peter


Well of course....

- Sorry about the glare from the LED's, and note that in this one, the train is running the wheel anti-clockwise which is incorrect, it's meant to run clockwise for the banner to turn correctly but I had removed the banner at this stage.

And the rotating banner which was completed only a few days ago...


Note the dual-language is not original, this was my own idea while I was experimenting with designs.
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
thanks 11 users liked this useful post by cookee_nz
Offline Crazy Harry  
#7 Posted : 26 May 2018 19:13:48(UTC)
Crazy Harry

Canada   
Joined: 18/11/2008(UTC)
Posts: 374
Location: Oakville, Ontario
Congratulations on the acquisition of an excellent piece of Maerklin history! I bet Markus Schild could add some background information since he is also a Maerklin Metall expert!

Cheers,

Harold.
Offline cookee_nz  
#8 Posted : 26 May 2018 22:51:59(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,552
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Crazy Harry Go to Quoted Post
Congratulations on the acquisition of an excellent piece of Maerklin history! I bet Markus Schild could add some background information since he is also a Maerklin Metall expert!

Cheers,

Harold.


Indeed Harold, Markus has already provided me with assistance behind the scenes, and was one of the very few aware I had the item from the start.

A few people know a lot, and many more know a little, but each snippet of information builds a bigger picture.

It is interesting and rewarding to write something informative from all these fragments of information.

I might add also that almost all the current information to be found on the 'net is in German, so I hope to bring a different perspective to the item topic.

I will create a new posting soon to help spread the word in my quest for knowledge.

Steve
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by cookee_nz
Offline Purellum  
#9 Posted : 26 May 2018 23:16:41(UTC)
Purellum

Denmark   
Joined: 08/11/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,262
Location: Mullerup, 4200 Slagelse
Cool

Now we need to build on in 1-gauge. LOL

Per.

Cool
If you can dream it, you can do it!

I, the copyright holder of this work, hereby release it into the public domain. This applies worldwide.

In case this is not legally possible:
I grant anyone the right to use this work for any purpose, without any conditions, unless such conditions are required by law.

UserPostedImage
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by Purellum
Offline Ross  
#10 Posted : 27 May 2018 02:57:06(UTC)
Ross

Australia   
Joined: 25/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 752
Location: Sydney, NSW
Hi Cookee,

No judgement was implied.Blushing BigGrin

Originally Posted by: cookee_nz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Ross Go to Quoted Post
Hi Cookee,

I think this makes you an official collector, well done on your acquisition.


Cheers Ross, but 'enthusiast' please, 'collector' seems to have such connotations. Scared

Märklin-Mania !!


Ross
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Ross
Offline Markus Schild  
#11 Posted : 27 May 2018 08:00:58(UTC)
Markus Schild

Germany   
Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,802
Location: Wurttemberg
Originally Posted by: Purellum Go to Quoted Post
Cool

Now we need to build on in 1-gauge. LOL

Per.

Cool


Hi Per,

Already done. Model by Andreas Abel from Brunswick (Braunschweig), Germany. Shown at an exhibition in 2005.

abel-wheel.jpg

Regards

Markus
thanks 10 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
Offline amartinezv  
#12 Posted : 27 May 2018 10:18:11(UTC)
amartinezv

Spain   
Joined: 25/08/2004(UTC)
Posts: 281
Location: Madrid,
Congratulations Cokee,

it's really wonderful, but I have two questions, does the locomotive really move the wheel? and how is the power supplied to the locomotive?

Thank you
Antonio Martínez
marklin, IB, era 3, Train controller
www.raildigital.es/davidruso
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#13 Posted : 27 May 2018 10:49:54(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 17,497
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: amartinezv Go to Quoted Post
....I have two questions, does the locomotive really move the wheel? and how is the power supplied to the locomotive?


Yes, the locomotive does move the wheel. Power is supplied like any normal 3 rail layout - from the transformer you see to the centre rail.
Offline cookee_nz  
#14 Posted : 27 May 2018 11:21:32(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,552
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: amartinezv Go to Quoted Post
....I have two questions, does the locomotive really move the wheel? and how is the power supplied to the locomotive?


Yes, the locomotive does move the wheel. Power is supplied like any normal 3 rail layout - from the transformer you see to the centre rail.


Hey Antonio,

Yes it may seem surprising but the wheel itself is actually finely balanced and takes almost no effort to turn it, then it spins freely for some time, rather like an airplane engine when you see those slowing coming to a halt.

There is a commutator or "slip-ring" between the wheel and the frame - it has three copper rings with motor brushes pushing against them. I've pasted a photo of the design below, this photo was supplied by Markus from one of his, I do not have a clear photo of mine just now but it's virtually identical.

One brush for the track power, two for the lighting circuits.

Originally, these required three Trafos, one for the Engine, and one each for the lights - 32 lamps in total, but the old incandescent lamps draw quite a bit of current so half of the wheel lamps were on one Trafo, and half on the other.

Because I have used LED's, I can run it all off one. But I'm having a short life on some of the LED's so I may switch to a 12vDC controller which will lower the brightness and help the life hopefully.

E10 coloured lamps are hard to find, and very expensive.

Thanks for your interest and hope this answers your questions. ThumpUp

DSC02259 - Copy.jpg
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
thanks 4 users liked this useful post by cookee_nz
Offline PJMärklin  
#15 Posted : 27 May 2018 13:10:56(UTC)
PJMärklin

Australia   
Joined: 04/12/2013(UTC)
Posts: 1,616
Location: Hobart, Australia
I like your new avatar Cookee !
ThumpUp

Philip
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by PJMärklin
Offline kiwiAlan  
#16 Posted : 27 May 2018 14:11:46(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 5,423
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: PJMärklin Go to Quoted Post
I like your new avatar Cookee !
ThumpUp

Philip


ThumpUp ThumpUp ThumpUp ThumpUp ThumpUp
Offline amartinezv  
#17 Posted : 27 May 2018 18:44:41(UTC)
amartinezv

Spain   
Joined: 25/08/2004(UTC)
Posts: 281
Location: Madrid,
Originally Posted by: cookee_nz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: amartinezv Go to Quoted Post
....I have two questions, does the locomotive really move the wheel? and how is the power supplied to the locomotive?


Yes, the locomotive does move the wheel. Power is supplied like any normal 3 rail layout - from the transformer you see to the centre rail.


Hey Antonio,

Yes it may seem surprising but the wheel itself is actually finely balanced and takes almost no effort to turn it, then it spins freely for some time, rather like an airplane engine when you see those slowing coming to a halt.

There is a commutator or "slip-ring" between the wheel and the frame - it has three copper rings with motor brushes pushing against them. I've pasted a photo of the design below, this photo was supplied by Markus from one of his, I do not have a clear photo of mine just now but it's virtually identical.

One brush for the track power, two for the lighting circuits.

Originally, these required three Trafos, one for the Engine, and one each for the lights - 32 lamps in total, but the old incandescent lamps draw quite a bit of current so half of the wheel lamps were on one Trafo, and half on the other.

Because I have used LED's, I can run it all off one. But I'm having a short life on some of the LED's so I may switch to a 12vDC controller which will lower the brightness and help the life hopefully.

E10 coloured lamps are hard to find, and very expensive.

Thanks for your interest and hope this answers your questions. ThumpUp

DSC02259 - Copy.jpg


Hello
Thank you for your answer. I imagined something like the slip ring. Now it's clear. Enjoy your wonderful wheel.
best regards
Antonio Martínez
marklin, IB, era 3, Train controller
www.raildigital.es/davidruso
Offline Markus Schild  
#18 Posted : 21 November 2018 09:05:18(UTC)
Markus Schild

Germany   
Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,802
Location: Wurttemberg
Hi,

I just found this "Gebrauchsmuster" which is a kind of "patent light" in German law, which Märklin applied for the roller bearing of the Wunderrad. The part was never offered for private customers.

bearing.jpg

Full pdf: DE________1631130U__I_.pdf (335kb) downloaded 29 time(s).

Regards

Markus

Edited by user 21 November 2018 14:43:55(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 6 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
Offline cookee_nz  
#19 Posted : 22 November 2018 08:38:50(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,552
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Go to Quoted Post
Hi,

I just found this "Gebrauchsmuster" which is a kind of "patent light" in German law, which Märklin applied for the roller bearing of the Wunderrad. The part was never offered for private customers.

bearing.jpg

Full pdf: DE________1631130U__I_.pdf (335kb) downloaded 29 time(s).

Regards

Markus


I wonder why they would patent just the bearing?, it seems to be a relatively normal engineering design probably commonly used in a wide range of products.

A Patent on the entire Wunderrad design would seem to make much more sense but I would also think you cannot possibly patent a unique design or creation made from off-the-shelf kit components intended to be assembled in any way the creator wishes.

Very interesting. What is the essential outline of the text with that document?

Steve

Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by cookee_nz
Offline cookee_nz  
#20 Posted : 07 December 2018 23:50:34(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,552
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Couple of weekends ago (24/25 Nov.) Railex was held again in Wellington.

And for the first time in at least 30 years, and first time ever in Wellington (that I am aware of), the Wonderwheel had a public outing.

I was very well positioned between our flagship 'Bergtalbahn' exhibition layout, and the Toot Toot stand, and with the wheel visible from the other side of the stadium, it was quite a draw-card, I know quite a few photos and videos were taken of it but I didn't actually get to take many myself.

To say there was a lot of interest would be an understatement. Most people naturally first thought it was 'Meccano' so that prompted me to throw together some information in front of the display, as well as a small folded flyer that anyone interested could take away.

A couple of comments about a hamster in a wheel got me to thinking... I don't have a Hamster, or a Rat/Mouse. But I have a PIG!! And so it came to pass that a German symbol of Good Luck had a bit of a workout - the kids loved it. I got a kick too I must admit. Great fun.

I ran the Pig for about a couple of hours or so only on Sunday afternoon, the earlier part of the weekend I ran the 3000 and three boxcars as usual. Several people did not at first believe it was just the Loco powering the wheel.



It was a real joy to display the wheel, I've included below the information I put together, but still have to do some more accurate fact-checking, several references on the internet regarding the history of Meccano & Metallbaukasten have differing specific details and dates pre-1920 but the essential facts are reasonably accurate for the purpose of telling the story.

Display1.jpgDisplay2.jpg

Display3.jpgDisplay4.jpg

Strips.jpg

And just a bit of amusement that caught a few people out...

Achtung.jpg
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
thanks 5 users liked this useful post by cookee_nz
Users browsing this topic
OceanSpiders 2.0
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

| Powered by YAF.NET | YAF.NET © 2003-2020, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.804 seconds.