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Offline Goofy  
#1 Posted : 20 January 2018 08:30:17(UTC)
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Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,012
Is there possible to shop protective paint for the K tracks under frame?
I want to spray paint the tin to avoid rust when i add water glue on the ballast.
I did tested with acrylic spray paint and used water glue on the ballast.
So far not see any rust.
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Offline Goofy  
#2 Posted : 21 January 2018 07:51:55(UTC)
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Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,012
I did bought an spray metal primer paint and this product are excellent to protect tin plate like Märklin K-tracks.
It works really good by spray thin and don´t need spray too much.

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Offline Goofy  
#3 Posted : 21 January 2018 07:54:23(UTC)
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Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,012
I forgot to write...it takes about 12 hours to let metal primer dry.
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Offline Purellum  
#4 Posted : 21 January 2018 08:06:18(UTC)
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Purellum

Denmark   
Joined: 08/11/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,500
Location: Mullerup, 4200 Slagelse
Cool

I think you should measure your track with an Ohm-meter now; because to me this looks like a short-circuit between pukos and rails.

Per.

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Offline Goofy  
#5 Posted : 21 January 2018 08:13:41(UTC)
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Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,012
Originally Posted by: Purellum Go to Quoted Post


I think you should measure your track with an Ohm-meter now; because to me this looks like a short-circuit between pukos and rails.



I don´t understand why you did write like this.
It´s paint and yes i did tested and no short-circuit.
It´s paint to protect tin from rust.

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Offline Purellum  
#6 Posted : 21 January 2018 08:22:31(UTC)
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Purellum

Denmark   
Joined: 08/11/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,500
Location: Mullerup, 4200 Slagelse
Cool

Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post


I don´t understand why you did write like this.
It´s paint and yes i did tested and no short-circuit.
It´s paint to protect tin from rust.



All zinc sprays I know off are electrical conductive; I just wanted to warn you.

Per.

Cool

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thanks 3 users liked this useful post by Purellum
Offline cookee_nz  
#7 Posted : 21 January 2018 10:28:44(UTC)
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cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,953
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Purellum Go to Quoted Post


I think you should measure your track with an Ohm-meter now; because to me this looks like a short-circuit between pukos and rails.



I don´t understand why you did write like this.
It´s paint and yes i did tested and no short-circuit.
It´s paint to protect tin from rust.



It looks to me that the spray has only put a coat onto the underside of the metal base.

When you use water-based glue for your ballast, the moisture will possibly get between the base metal and the sleepers - I suspect that area is not protected because the zinc spray would not get into that gap.

Attached are images showing the base removed from a double-slip (for example), for full protection you would need to remove the metal base completely and spray both sides and I can tell you (from experience), you do not want to be doing that to every track piece! OhMyGod

You will reduce the chances of rust for certain, and perhaps long enough for the expected life of your layout but do not be surprised to still see rust develop where the zinc spray cannot reach.

Good luck anyway Smile

Steve

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Cookee
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Offline Goofy  
#8 Posted : 21 January 2018 14:22:08(UTC)
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Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,012
I did tested another way.
Did sprayed with Tamiya redbrown on both side of the track.
Later did sealed flat clear TS-80 under frame of the track.
This to protect the color contact with the water glue.


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Offline Goofy  
#9 Posted : 21 January 2018 14:47:29(UTC)
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Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 9,012
Originally Posted by: cookee_nz Go to Quoted Post

It looks to me that the spray has only put a coat onto the underside of the metal base.

When you use water-based glue for your ballast, the moisture will possibly get between the base metal and the sleepers - I suspect that area is not protected because the zinc spray would not get into that gap.

Attached are images showing the base removed from a double-slip (for example), for full protection you would need to remove the metal base completely and spray both sides and I can tell you (from experience), you do not want to be doing that to every track piece! OhMyGod

You will reduce the chances of rust for certain, and perhaps long enough for the expected life of your layout but do not be surprised to still see rust develop where the zinc spray cannot reach.

Steve

(snip images)


You have right!
To protect the tin from rust i must spray both side of it.
This is not for me.

Edited by moderator 22 January 2018 00:57:09(UTC)  | Reason: Remove repeated images

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Offline cookee_nz  
#10 Posted : 22 January 2018 01:00:30(UTC)
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cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,953
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: cookee_nz Go to Quoted Post

It looks to me that the spray has only put a coat onto the underside of the metal base.

When you use water-based glue for your ballast, the moisture will possibly get between the base metal and the sleepers - I suspect that area is not protected because the zinc spray would not get into that gap.

Attached are images showing the base removed from a double-slip (for example), for full protection you would need to remove the metal base completely and spray both sides and I can tell you (from experience), you do not want to be doing that to every track piece! OhMyGod

You will reduce the chances of rust for certain, and perhaps long enough for the expected life of your layout but do not be surprised to still see rust develop where the zinc spray cannot reach.

Steve

(snip images)


You have right!
To protect the tin from rust i must spray both side of it.
This is not for me.


Just thinking about this some more, is there a water-based rust-inhibitor? - surely in this modern world there must be.

I'm thinking something along the lines of an additive that you would put into your car cooling system - you can get 'anti-freeze', but for climates where this is not a problem you still need to protect against corrosion. Most modern engines are alloy of course but older engines are cast-iron so the car enthusiasts must use something - you just need to find something that will be compatible with glue??

Then you don't need to worry about protecting the track.

Something to think about ThumpUp
Cookee
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Offline Legless  
#11 Posted : 22 January 2018 10:12:40(UTC)
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Legless

Australia   
Joined: 20/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 809
Location: Leopold, Victoria
The primer you have is cold gal or zinc enriched primer.
The zinc is the slave metal that corrodes before the normal metal and zinc conducts electricial currents.

As for rust converters, this is ferric acid and that as the name says converts the rust over. Note do not use both together as the converter will attack both, the zinc first then the metal.

If you use fish oil underneath the track that will form a barrier that will stop the moisture from the PVA attacking the metal but the down side is that it tasked a long time to dry. I haven’t tried a conductivity test while still wet. (I can do One if asked).
Legless
Era's 1 to 111,C track,k track
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Offline hxmiesa  
#12 Posted : 02 February 2018 14:03:13(UTC)
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hxmiesa

Spain   
Joined: 15/12/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,520
Location: Spain
As I have already written so many times;
Wet the ballast with a spray of cleaning alcohol.

I know that the glue should till be diluted with water (and a little soap), but the total WETTING of everything with an alcohol-mist doesnt damage the tracks.

That, and maintating the humidity of the train-room on about 55% helps prevent ANY rust.
Has done so far in my wet and cold basement for the last 12 years!

PS: The 55% humidity is by the book. In reality I just keep it around 65%, as the room otherwise is unfomfortable to be in, and static electricity can sometimes be generated.
Best regards
Henrik Hoexbroe ("The Dane In Spain")
http://hoexbroe.tripod.com
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