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Offline rr22  
#1 Posted : 25 January 2016 05:57:13(UTC)
rr22

Australia   
Joined: 17/01/2016(UTC)
Posts: 3
Location: Queensland, Brisbane
I am completely new new to the Marklin "game" and I would appreciate some assistance. I have a CS2 controller and I have fitted motors and 74461 decoders to my turnouts. I also have a m83 decoder.

My question is; do I need to connect each turnout to the m83 or can the turnouts be worked from the CS2 without doing this? If this can be done, what is the purpose of the m83?

Question 2. Does anyone know where I can get up to date wiring layout diagrams showing how to setup up a basic digital HO Marklin layout that is easily understood by a newcomer. Thanks.
Offline mrmarklin  
#2 Posted : 25 January 2016 07:04:45(UTC)
mrmarklin

United States   
Joined: 27/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 890
Location: Burney, CA
The k83 decoder is not necessary if you have decoders in each turnout. It is for K Track turnouts and others that don't already have a decoder installed. With the decoder in the turnout itself, one is drawing track power to do the switching. For many people that's too much.Blink
From the People's Republik of Kalifornia
Offline H0  
#3 Posted : 25 January 2016 08:12:04(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: rr22 Go to Quoted Post
If this can be done, what is the purpose of the m83?
The 74461 is for C track only. The m83 replaces four 74461 (cheaper alternativ) and can be used with C track, K track, M track, other tracks and other gauges.
Turnout decoders for four or eight turnouts from other companies are even cheaper and users with limited funds can avoid the 74461.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline rr22  
#4 Posted : 26 January 2016 00:59:13(UTC)
rr22

Australia   
Joined: 17/01/2016(UTC)
Posts: 3
Location: Queensland, Brisbane
Originally Posted by: mrmarklin Go to Quoted Post
The k83 decoder is not necessary if you have decoders in each turnout. It is for K Track turnouts and others that don't already have a decoder installed. With the decoder in the turnout itself, one is drawing track power to do the switching. For many people that's too much.Blink


Thanks mrmarklin. Could you please elaborate re possible problem re drawing track power? Thanks rr22.
Offline rr22  
#5 Posted : 26 January 2016 01:01:06(UTC)
rr22

Australia   
Joined: 17/01/2016(UTC)
Posts: 3
Location: Queensland, Brisbane
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: rr22 Go to Quoted Post
If this can be done, what is the purpose of the m83?
The 74461 is for C track only. The m83 replaces four 74461 (cheaper alternativ) and can be used with C track, K track, M track, other tracks and other gauges.
Turnout decoders for four or eight turnouts from other companies are even cheaper and users with limited funds can avoid the 74461.



Thanks Tom, regards, re.
Offline ixldoc  
#6 Posted : 29 January 2016 02:21:14(UTC)
ixldoc

Australia   
Joined: 18/11/2015(UTC)
Posts: 220
Location: Brisbane,Australia
Hi rr22, I live in Brisbane and I have sent you a PM.
Regards,
Howard.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by ixldoc
Offline Minok  
#7 Posted : 01 February 2016 03:18:15(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,310
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
So the

74461 decoder can be built into the C-track turnouts - and thus draws its power from the C-track - 1 part added to the turnout and your are done.
60831 m83 decoder is a separate from track part (usable on all track types), with its own power in capability, and LED indicators on state.

When layouts get bigger and one starts reaching the limits of the power capacity of power supplies, you need to start breaking up what is supplied by which of our power supplies.
One approach is to power things like switches and lights and signals from a separate power supply than the track - the m83 makes that possible.
Another approach is to split the track layout into separately powered sections, and keep the turnouts and track all powered by the same source in each section.

Going with an m83 gives you more options on controlling other things as well as layout, some visual feedback (which may not be useful if the module is hidden under buildings, under the layout table), and will be more wiring.
Going with the built-into-turnout decoder keeps the wiring simple and simplifies the layout building and storage. @30E each, vs @45E for the m83 decoder that can work with 4 turnouts, the built in route is more expensive.

Did I get that correct?
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel:
https://youtube.com/@intercity134
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Offline clapcott  
#8 Posted : 01 February 2016 03:50:33(UTC)
clapcott

New Zealand   
Joined: 12/12/2005(UTC)
Posts: 2,433
Location: Wellington, New_Zealand
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post
74461 decoder can be built into the C-track turnouts - and thus draws its power from the C-track - 1 part added to the turnout and your are done.
The 74461/5 has a third (yellow) wire for the power aspect, connecting this to the other "B" (red) terminal under a C-Track turnout is the easy option.
Refer pg 28 & pg 31 of manual


Quote:

When layouts get bigger and one starts reaching the limits of the power capacity of power supplies, you need to start breaking up what is supplied by which of our power supplies.
One approach is to power things like switches and lights and signals from a separate power supply than the track - the m83 makes that possible.
Another approach is to split the track layout into separately powered sections, and keep the turnouts and track all powered by the same source in each section.
You have the pertinent points however I believe this is not the whole story.

Well before "... reaching the limits of the power capacity..." it is probable that you will observe loco/coach lighting blink as you energise a turnout if you have them on the same booster.

I will always suggest that the Red/Brown bus for your accessories be wired separately and all the way back to the control desk. This allows for a switch to the track bus which allows isolation in the case of a train emergency BUT you can still control your accessories

While the m83(for turnouts) and 74461/5 MAY be fed with external power, this means additional wiring and complexity when it comes to power distribution.
Marklin state that you need both a power supply and a 60822 for the m83 when doing this. If your m83s are not in close proximity then you will need an extra pair of devices for each location. Or spend some time wiring up cables with D-9 plugs/sockets as extenders (Marklin do not provide such a cable)

In summary I would suggest just using the two wires from a dedicated booster

Quote:

Going with an m83 gives you more options on controlling other things as well as layout, some visual feedback (which may not be useful if the module is hidden under buildings, under the layout table), and will be more wiring.
As above, think about the benefits of separate circuits for separate purposes. Sure when starting out 4 devices in an area can be serviced by a single m83. If you are using a non-turnout function for LEDs you will definitely see them blink when there is command traffic and/or a turnout energized.

Quote:

Going with the built-into-turnout decoder keeps the wiring simple and simplifies the layout building and storage.
Please do not forget about serviceability access - should a component fail. I have seen cutouts to allow access, from underneath the roadbed, to the motor done well. However this is just two screws , by the time you add in the fiddly wire connection for a decoder you may be cursing at the lack of forethought (and the time spent).
Peter
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