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Offline Bahn-an-arama  
#1 Posted : 10 September 2009 16:51:58(UTC)
Bahn-an-arama

Australia   
Joined: 30/12/2007(UTC)
Posts: 300
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Hi all.
After converting my HAMO loco to digital with Uhlenbrock 76320, all was fine but lately there is an issue with it running jerky, i.e. it runs but when you speed it up it suddenly stops, pauses for 10 seconds and starts up again. I've checked all wiring again and again, but cannot seem to resolve the issue. I have noticed when it does run, lights in the stationary carriages seem to flicker. All other locos run fine, so I think I can rule-out any track issues. Any help please would be greatly appreciated. Smile
Glenn
Offline spitzenklasse  
#2 Posted : 10 September 2009 18:00:44(UTC)
spitzenklasse


Joined: 06/04/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,573
Location: ,
G-Day Glenn. I've encountered this situation myself as well with Delta Locs. At first I thought your problem may be the reverse loop you get with 2 rail. Then I remembered my own experience. I have never resolved it, but have better performance always with clean wheels, and tracks.
Offline spitzenklasse  
#3 Posted : 10 September 2009 18:22:00(UTC)
spitzenklasse


Joined: 06/04/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,573
Location: ,
I just thought of a possible cause. Which controller are you using? Are there coding switches to adjust the rf signals, like on a 6021? There are 4 dip switches on the back for sending the original, the expanded Motorola format, and both. I know that one of my 3700 series Loc's has a Uhlenbrock decoder in it.
Offline Bahn-an-arama  
#4 Posted : 10 September 2009 22:37:58(UTC)
Bahn-an-arama

Australia   
Joined: 30/12/2007(UTC)
Posts: 300
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Ah, yes you may be onto something. Using 6021 which I recently purchased. What setting should I have the dip-switches again?
Glenn
Offline Webmaster  
#5 Posted : 10 September 2009 23:52:10(UTC)
Webmaster


Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC)
Posts: 11,036
If the stationary carriage lights flickers, it sounds a bit current shortcircuit-orientated...

1 - Is the motor & gearing running smoothly to minimize the current load on the decoder?

2 - Is the motor maybe over-oiled inside, causing shorts in the rotor gaps?


The 10 second cutout seems to me that a current-protection circuit in the decoder, if there is any, cuts the motor current of due to too much current being drawn by the motor... This is of course to protect the decoder from damage...

Usually high current draw is an indication of mechanical issues with too much mechanical friction somewhere...

My tip is to clean the axles/gears and the put a tiny drop of oil to lubricate, usually - and especially if you have "carpetbahn" - dust, textile fibers and dog/cat hairs have a tendency to like locos... If that doesn't fully help, dismantle the motor and clean the parts. The reassemble and put a drop of oil on the motor axle ends...

Have you checked the brushes so they are not worn out?

I don't think 6021 settings has anything to do with it...
Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service...
He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
Offline Bahn-an-arama  
#6 Posted : 12 September 2009 18:46:16(UTC)
Bahn-an-arama

Australia   
Joined: 30/12/2007(UTC)
Posts: 300
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Stripped the motor and found the permanent magnet was sitting a little awkward. Loco now run better although when you push it over 150 on the 6021 controller, it cuts out again. Does anyone think I should add some resistors, if so which ones as I am not sure what OHMS and where best to connect them. Cheers. Smile
Glenn
Offline river6109  
#7 Posted : 12 September 2009 18:54:19(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 13,210
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Bahn-an-arama
<br />Stripped the motor and found the permanent magnet was sitting a little awkward. Loco now run better although when you push it over 150 on the 6021 controller, it cuts out again. Does anyone think I should add some resistors, if so which ones as I am not sure what OHMS and where best to connect them. Cheers. Smile

a photo of the motor would be ideal.
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline Bahn-an-arama  
#8 Posted : 12 September 2009 19:10:00(UTC)
Bahn-an-arama

Australia   
Joined: 30/12/2007(UTC)
Posts: 300
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Will post one tomorrow John. Cheers Smile
Glenn
Offline banco  
#9 Posted : 12 September 2009 19:38:29(UTC)
banco


Joined: 20/06/2005(UTC)
Posts: 121
Location: The Netherlands
Hi
Just one thought ..............what type of motor have you converted is it a drum style or LC or SC ? There is one combination where the clearence of the HAMO magnet is very limited . IN fact it can be so limited that it binds on the rotor and this could cause a short out under load.

Also depending upon the motor type the eraly Marklin motors LC and SC can have problems with the brass brush holders or the clips that hold them onto the plastic housing binding slightly too.

Maybe this is helpful or I may be barking up the wrong tree.
C track,6021,large digital loft layout modelled in the legendary European land of "Moresnet"
Offline Bahn-an-arama  
#10 Posted : 13 September 2009 11:50:54(UTC)
Bahn-an-arama

Australia   
Joined: 30/12/2007(UTC)
Posts: 300
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Hi guys, here's a pic. I have noticed very limited clearance of the rotor and magnet. Have bent the magnet slightly seems to have improved it somewhat. To me, the gearing all seems to run smooth....but it just seems to be overloading at higher speeds and under load when climbing up gradients.

UserPostedImage
Glenn
Offline river6109  
#11 Posted : 13 September 2009 15:33:27(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 13,210
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Glenn,
Looking at the motor, I would take it apart and clean it thoroughly.
Look at any wear & tear and also have a close look at the rotor, brushes etc.
One thing You haven't mentioned although you've converted the loco to digital, are you running on 3 rail ?
Look at the smooth and free running without brushes.
Also look at the decoder capacity.
see if the brush plate needs any interference diodes.

regards.,
John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline Bahn-an-arama  
#12 Posted : 13 September 2009 15:41:00(UTC)
Bahn-an-arama

Australia   
Joined: 30/12/2007(UTC)
Posts: 300
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
John,yes running on 3 rail.Motor has been thoroughly clean, brushes seem fine. There is a little more resistance in the gearing when the brushes are added, but no more than other digital locos that I have. I am not sure about the diodes or where to solder them. Should I perhaps put the ( what I presume is ) the RF choke back that is originally there on analogue models? Cheers, Glenn
Glenn
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