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Offline mvd71  
#1 Posted : 06 May 2023 05:58:50(UTC)
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mvd71

New Zealand   
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,727
Location: Auckland,
Hi All,

I have just put a Märklin sound decoder into a HAG Re6/6 and most things seem to work fine, except running at low speed.

I have done a calibration run with no improvement. At low speed settings it moves in a series of small jerks until I increase the speed setting, then it accelerates away and seems ok.

Can any one confirm the following:

- Does the capacitor between the brushes should remain in place?
- Do the resistors/chokes added to a Märklin motor get used on a HAG unit too?
- What CV’s are used to optimise performance?
- Are there any traps when converting a HAG dc loco?

Many thanks,

Mike
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Offline Unholz  
#2 Posted : 06 May 2023 08:15:44(UTC)
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Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,394
Location: Switzerland
Originally Posted by: mvd71 Go to Quoted Post

- Are there any traps when converting a HAG dc loco?


Sorry, I am a non-digital type and can't help, but the most common trap is neglecting to remove the washer that lies beneath the screw marked with an arrow here:
https://www.moba-forum.ch/index....p;postID=66845#post66845
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Offline mvd71  
#3 Posted : 06 May 2023 08:35:12(UTC)
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mvd71

New Zealand   
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,727
Location: Auckland,
Thanks Stefan,

I didn’t even know there was a washer under there. I’ll take a look and see what I find.

Cheers….

Mike
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Offline mvd71  
#4 Posted : 06 May 2023 08:45:02(UTC)
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mvd71

New Zealand   
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,727
Location: Auckland,
Originally Posted by: Unholz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: mvd71 Go to Quoted Post

- Are there any traps when converting a HAG dc loco?


Sorry, I am a non-digital type and can't help, but the most common trap is neglecting to remove the washer that lies beneath the screw marked with an arrow here:
https://www.moba-forum.ch/index....p;postID=66845#post66845


Mine has a different motor. I had a look under the two screws on mine, and no washer in sight.

245DBB24-B12B-42A7-BA89-5246A30D34BF.jpeg
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Offline bph  
#5 Posted : 06 May 2023 10:43:57(UTC)
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bph

Norway   
Joined: 04/08/2018(UTC)
Posts: 996
Did you use a cs3 and mfx to set the motor type?
There is a bug in the latest cs3 software that affects motor type read/write when English is used as the system language. (any other language is correct)
ref: https://www.marklin-users.net/forum/posts/t48216-CS3-software-bug-affecting-motor-type--when-English-is-used-as-system-language

example: If the type c90 is programmed when the system is set to English, the mfx decoder is actually programmed with a bell anchor motor.
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Offline Unholz  
#6 Posted : 06 May 2023 10:54:37(UTC)
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Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,394
Location: Switzerland
The washer in question is only present in (originally) DC locos. Since you asked about a DC conversion, I assumed that it was/is such a model.

But sorry, are you sure that you looked under the correct screw? It might be concealed beneath the right "spring holder plate" visible on your picture. This washer establishes an unwanted electric contact between the motor parts und thus it is not "potential free" (sorry for my layman's description Wink ).

And a second miniature washer should be present on the axle of the rotor - that one has to remain there.
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Offline river6109  
#7 Posted : 06 May 2023 20:16:36(UTC)
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river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,722
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
I never had problems with my DC HAG locos conversions (ESU sound decoders), the reason I bought DC locos was, I didn't had to do an expensive conversion, as all my electric locos run from the overhead. (the motors are all older versions without the ballbearing and 5 pole armature).

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
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Offline mike c  
#8 Posted : 06 May 2023 22:34:59(UTC)
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mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,897
Location: Montreal, QC
I had two Hag models digitized by the factory. I sent them to Herr Alther. The first one has the old Hag 501 (Digitraxx) and the second one has a Loksound decoder.
I would think that a Hag model deserves to have the better sounds and operations that an ESU or Zimo decoder offer compared to the Maerklin one.
I wanted to see how the new decoders in the Roco BLS Re 465 and SBB Re 460 models sound. Even the ESU decoders did not sound right to my ears.
I want to hear that electric hum that most Swiss Locomotives (post 1960) are known for.

Regards

Mike C
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Offline mvd71  
#9 Posted : 07 May 2023 03:49:19(UTC)
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mvd71

New Zealand   
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,727
Location: Auckland,
Originally Posted by: Unholz Go to Quoted Post
The washer in question is only present in (originally) DC locos. Since you asked about a DC conversion, I assumed that it was/is such a model.

But sorry, are you sure that you looked under the correct screw? It might be concealed beneath the right "spring holder plate" visible on your picture. This washer establishes an unwanted electric contact between the motor parts und thus it is not "potential free" (sorry for my layman's description Wink ).

And a second miniature washer should be present on the axle of the rotor - that one has to remain there.


Stefan, you are a genius!. There was another screw that I missed, it was hidden behind the steel plate that retains the brushes. Removed that, changed the decoder for one that wasn’t faulty, and away it went.

Thanks again for your help.
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thanks 1 user liked this useful post by mvd71
Offline mvd71  
#10 Posted : 07 May 2023 03:51:29(UTC)
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mvd71

New Zealand   
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1,727
Location: Auckland,
Originally Posted by: mike c Go to Quoted Post
I had two Hag models digitized by the factory. I sent them to Herr Alther. The first one has the old Hag 501 (Digitraxx) and the second one has a Loksound decoder.
I would think that a Hag model deserves to have the better sounds and operations that an ESU or Zimo decoder offer compared to the Maerklin one.
I wanted to see how the new decoders in the Roco BLS Re 465 and SBB Re 460 models sound. Even the ESU decoders did not sound right to my ears.
I want to hear that electric hum that most Swiss Locomotives (post 1960) are known for.

Regards

Mike C


I used the Märklin for convenience for me, plus I figured the latest Re6/6 sound file from Märklin should be good??

As it was I had a spare decoder that I was going to reprogram. After all most Swiss electric locos don’t go chuff chuff!
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