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Issue Trix 22823 Loco - Replacement sound decoder
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Offline Ross246  
#1 Posted : 15 February 2019 11:05:13(UTC)
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Ross246

Australia   
Joined: 15/02/2019(UTC)
Posts: 3
Location: Bendigo Victoria
Trix 233017a.jpgTrix 233017b.jpg
Greetings All,

I have a Trix 22823 sound loco that has a faulty decoder. Loco just stopped running one day. I replaced the decoder with a 'HobbyKing' basic decodfer and loco now runs but no sound or lights.

Marklin/Trix parts web site has no stock of original decoder (part no 233017). Photo's of faulty decoder enclosed top and bottom. Is it possible to use an ECU decoder as a replacement and get sound and lights functioning again?

Any advice appreciated

Regards Ross
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Offline ktsolias  
#2 Posted : 15 February 2019 12:03:27(UTC)
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ktsolias

Greece   
Joined: 01/05/2016(UTC)
Posts: 610
Location: Athens
This decoder is an mSD decoder (2nd generation)

The mSD/3 60976 Diesel form Marklin or LokSound decoder with 21pin connector will do the job.

Of course you need the appropriate programming tools for the ESU decoder

Costas
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Offline H0  
#3 Posted : 15 February 2019 12:05:40(UTC)
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H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,262
Location: DE-NW
Hi!
ESU decoders are NEM compatible. The decoder on the photo is NMRA compatible.
ESU decoders may work in that loco if neither AUX3 nor AUX4 are used for anything. Do you know if AUX3 or AUX4 are used?

Märklin decoders MSD and MSD/3 are NMRA compatible and can be used.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Ross246  
#4 Posted : 16 February 2019 22:38:27(UTC)
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Ross246

Australia   
Joined: 15/02/2019(UTC)
Posts: 3
Location: Bendigo Victoria
Thank you for your prompt replies, I will try and source a Locsound decoder
Regards Ross
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Offline Dave Banks  
#5 Posted : 16 February 2019 23:15:48(UTC)
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Dave Banks

Australia   
Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,026
Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
Ross just looking at the 1st picture, I noticed what looks like a blown component midway up the right side. This via the forum to identify this component may be a cheaper option to fix it if your handy with a soldering iron.
D.A.Banks
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#6 Posted : 16 February 2019 23:41:26(UTC)
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kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,101
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Dave Banks Go to Quoted Post
Ross just looking at the 1st picture, I noticed what looks like a blown component midway up the right side. This via the forum to identify this component may be a cheaper option to fix it if your handy with a soldering iron.


Oh yes, that has definitely let the magic smoke escape.
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Offline Bigdaddynz  
#7 Posted : 18 February 2019 01:51:29(UTC)
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Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,663
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: Dave Banks Go to Quoted Post
...looking at the 1st picture, I noticed what looks like a blown component midway up the right side.


Seems to be a common problem (well, OK, two that I know of...)

The decoder in my 37107 E10 let the magic smoke out from one of the components in the row immediately below the 21 pin connector as seen in the first picture (3rd chip from the left).

Just waiting for a Marklin Decoder programmer to arrive from Toottoot so that I can program a mSD/3 to replace it.
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Offline Dave Banks  
#8 Posted : 18 February 2019 06:22:15(UTC)
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Dave Banks

Australia   
Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,026
Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
David would you happen to be able to take a real close up picture of the decoder you have & publish it / or supply #No. so we can identify the blown component on this one in question if it has any identification on it at all?
D.A.Banks
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thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Dave Banks
Offline Ross246  
#9 Posted : 18 February 2019 12:15:06(UTC)
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Ross246

Australia   
Joined: 15/02/2019(UTC)
Posts: 3
Location: Bendigo Victoria
Thanks All for your input. The chip as described by Dave is certainly defunct, and I have no problems in delving into the board to replace it. I have been an electronics technician all my life and regularly repair surface mount boards. The problem arises when the 5 pin device has no markings on it and I have no idea what device it is. In addition there appears to be a problem with the small transformer in the centre of the board at the bottom which has been heat stressed. I have enclosed better pics of the chip.

Its a problem when a service manual or circuit is unobtainable from the manufacturers as all they want to do is sell a replacement module.

Regards Ross

DSC02348sml.jpgDSC02347sml.jpg
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#10 Posted : 18 February 2019 14:36:44(UTC)
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kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,101
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: Ross246 Go to Quoted Post
Thanks All for your input. The chip as described by Dave is certainly defunct, and I have no problems in delving into the board to replace it. I have been an electronics technician all my life and regularly repair surface mount boards. The problem arises when the 5 pin device has no markings on it and I have no idea what device it is. In addition there appears to be a problem with the small transformer in the centre of the board at the bottom which has been heat stressed. I have enclosed better pics of the chip.

Its a problem when a service manual or circuit is unobtainable from the manufacturers as all they want to do is sell a replacement module.

Regards Ross


It is always worth taking the chip off and having a look underneath to see if there is a marking that may be traceable. Did that once with a chip out of a non-working Hewlett Packard plotter that had its fault diagnosed by swapping chips one at a time with a good one. Had the HP part number on the top, but the bottom said '6802', so having a 6802 microprocessor chip around I plugged that in and away it went.

The transformer at the bottom is likely to be the harder part. I suspect that is used to inject the mfx response back to the control unit onto the rails. Teh control units have a similar looking transformer to pick off the mfx response message from the rails.
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Offline Bigdaddynz  
#11 Posted : 18 February 2019 16:27:29(UTC)
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Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,663
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: Dave Banks Go to Quoted Post
David would you happen to be able to take a real close up picture of the decoder you have & publish it / or supply #No. so we can identify the blown component on this one in question if it has any identification on it at all?


Can do (if I remember where I put it - I do still have it).
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Offline Bigdaddynz  
#12 Posted : 19 February 2019 09:59:28(UTC)
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Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,663
Location: New Zealand
Picture of the decoder from my E10. You can see quite clearly where the smoke escaped from.

E10_decoder.jpg
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Offline Bigdaddynz  
#13 Posted : 20 February 2019 10:01:12(UTC)
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Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,663
Location: New Zealand
Decoder pictures without labels


E10_decoder-2.jpg

E10_decoder-3.jpg
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Offline Dave Banks  
#14 Posted : 23 February 2019 04:12:42(UTC)
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Dave Banks

Australia   
Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,026
Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
Hi David, the first picture, what is the component "5 legged #number above the big silver one with "24000" written on it please.
D.A.Banks
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Offline MaerklinLife  
#15 Posted : 23 February 2019 07:43:07(UTC)
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MaerklinLife


Joined: 03/02/2016(UTC)
Posts: 490
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Hi!
ESU decoders are NEM compatible. The decoder on the photo is NMRA compatible.
ESU decoders may work in that loco if neither AUX3 nor AUX4 are used for anything. Do you know if AUX3 or AUX4 are used?

Märklin decoders MSD and MSD/3 are NMRA compatible and can be used.


Won't the ESU MKL editions work like the NMRA compatible ones? I believe that is why ESU made those.
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