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Offline danmarklinman  
#1 Posted : 01 December 2018 21:12:47(UTC)
danmarklinman

United Kingdom   
Joined: 18/10/2012(UTC)
Posts: 940
Dear all. I’ve seen pics of yards in Germany, I think in the 1960s.
A few wagons still had brake cabins, usually g10 types. But I want to know, when brake cabins on wagons on the roofs of freight cars stopped being used? Any ideas?
See link of a picture. You can see some wagons with cabins on the roofs
https://www.google.co.uk...-GB#imgrc=2boNKIKVD7tYvM

It has to be taken post 1961 after the v60 was introduced?

Edited by moderator 02 December 2018 02:00:59(UTC)  | Reason: Spelling in the header

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Offline H0  
#2 Posted : 01 December 2018 22:14:21(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,203
Location: DE-NW
Brakemen were no longer needed on regular trains in Germany once automatic brakes were in general use (mid 1920s).
The brakes were still needed after that day and AFAIK even need cars with brakeman's cabs were built after this time, even though the brakes were no longer manned during train rides.

Rolling stock usually is used for 30+ years. I don't know how long those cabs could be seen in trains.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline SteamNut  
#3 Posted : 02 December 2018 01:27:39(UTC)
SteamNut

United States   
Joined: 11/05/2013(UTC)
Posts: 422
This is only from other posts that I have read through the years, no direct source link. Freight trains five wagons or more needed a place for the conductor and that is why some tenders had a small cabin or they used the cabins on the wagons and sometimes a baggage wagon would be attached to the train for their use . Since conductors were not well liked practical jokes were played on them if they stayed on the tenders. I am ready to be corrected on this at any time on my understanding on this - Fred
Offline MrB32  
#4 Posted : 02 December 2018 03:06:59(UTC)
MrB32

United Kingdom   
Joined: 08/08/2017(UTC)
Posts: 209
Location: England,West Molesey
100000s of Cars with brakeman cabs were built until the 1950s, some were still used well into the 1970s in Germany, and even into the 1990s in Switzerland or Italy. They were slowly withdrawn from the 60s onwards.
Wikipedia has a few articles on the topic.
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Offline H0  
#5 Posted : 02 December 2018 10:03:13(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,203
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: SteamNut Go to Quoted Post
This is only from other posts that I have read through the years, no direct source link. Freight trains five wagons or more needed a place for the conductor and that is why some tenders had a small cabin or they used the cabins on the wagons and sometimes a baggage wagon would be attached to the train for their use.
Any written source for "five wagons"?
The cab in the tender had a desk for the paperwork of the conductor. I never heard of conductors doing their paperwork in a brakeman's cab.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline SteamNut  
#6 Posted : 02 December 2018 10:45:56(UTC)
SteamNut

United States   
Joined: 11/05/2013(UTC)
Posts: 422
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: SteamNut Go to Quoted Post
This is only from other posts that I have read through the years, no direct source link. Freight trains five wagons or more needed a place for the conductor and that is why some tenders had a small cabin or they used the cabins on the wagons and sometimes a baggage wagon would be attached to the train for their use.
Any written source for "five wagons"?
The cab in the tender had a desk for the paperwork of the conductor. I never heard of conductors doing their paperwork in a brakeman's cab.


I saw this on a other post post, it might have been four wagons. The conductor would rather be in a brakeman's cab then be at the tender then get "accidentally" get sprayed when the tender was filled.
Offline H0  
#7 Posted : 02 December 2018 10:56:32(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,203
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: SteamNut Go to Quoted Post
The conductor would rather be in a brakeman's cab then be at the tender then get "accidentally" get sprayed when the tender was filled.
Sources for that?
Would the conductor be on the loco while the tender got filled? Conductors where primarily needed for local freight trains - and local trains didn't need refilling while the loco was on the train.
The conductor was in charge - they were telling the traindriver what to do. They could always leave the loco before the refilling started.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline SteamNut  
#8 Posted : 02 December 2018 16:15:15(UTC)
SteamNut

United States   
Joined: 11/05/2013(UTC)
Posts: 422
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: SteamNut Go to Quoted Post
The conductor would rather be in a brakeman's cab then be at the tender then get "accidentally" get sprayed when the tender was filled.
Sources for that?
Would the conductor be on the loco while the tender got filled? Conductors where primarily needed for local freight trains - and local trains didn't need refilling while the loco was on the train.
The conductor was in charge - they were telling the train driver what to do. They could always leave the loco before the refilling started.

I did not save the article but I believe it came from the Railways of Germany form and many of them are rivet counters. Many locomotives did not have cabins on their tenders and no matter how short a train might be there is always paper work to be done Since Germany did not have cabooses as the Americans it made sense to me at the time. I am sure the engine crews had other tricks but that one stuck on my mind. Maybe someone has a rule book from back then to clear this up,
Offline H0  
#9 Posted : 02 December 2018 18:06:55(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 13,203
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: SteamNut Go to Quoted Post
no matter how short a train might be there is always paper work to be done
For direct trains there is little paperwork to be done on route, even if there are 40 cars.

Diesel and electric locos usually have two cabs and the conductor could use the other cab to do the paperwork in splendid isolation - no Pwg needed.

Link to the question on the other forum:
https://www.tapatalk.com...-the-db-t6537.html#p5344
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline SteamNut  
#10 Posted : 02 December 2018 19:11:58(UTC)
SteamNut

United States   
Joined: 11/05/2013(UTC)
Posts: 422
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: SteamNut Go to Quoted Post
no matter how short a train might be there is always paper work to be done
For direct trains there is little paperwork to be done on route, even if there are 40 cars.

Diesel and electric locos usually have two cabs and the conductor could use the other cab to do the paperwork in splendid isolation - no Pwg needed.

Link to the question on the other forum:
https://www.tapatalk.com...-the-db-t6537.html#p5344

I agree with you but not so in the early days of steam. Short trains, here in the States they were peddler freights, often dropped and picked up wagons on route.,
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