 Joined: 25/08/2004(UTC) Posts: 332 Location: Madrid,
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Hi, there, The production of insider wagons can give you an idea of how the hobby is going or how much märklin sells, can't it? I found this data: The insider club was created in 1993 and this year some 10,000 units of the insider wagon were produced. In 1994 ---15,000 units In 1995 ---20,000 units In 1996 ---20,000 units In 1997 ---30.000 units In 1998 ---30.000 units In 1999 ---50.000 units " "" """"" In 2009 ---50,000 units In 2010 ---40,000 units In 2011 ---10,000 units In 2012 ---10,000 units In 2013 ---10,000 units In 2014 ---10,000 units In 2015 ---10,000 units What do you think? Any suggestions? Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator |
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Joined: 01/06/2016(UTC)
Posts: 2,465
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Originally Posted by: amartinezv  Hi, there,
The production of insider wagons can give you an idea of how the hobby is going or how much märklin sells, can't it?
I found this data:
The insider club was created in 1993 and this year some 10,000 units of the insider wagon were produced.
In 1994 ---15,000 units
In 1995 ---20,000 units
In 1996 ---20,000 units
In 1997 ---30.000 units
In 1998 ---30.000 units
In 1999 ---50.000 units
" ""
"""""
In 2009 ---50,000 units
In 2010 ---40,000 units
In 2011 ---10,000 units
In 2012 ---10,000 units
In 2013 ---10,000 units
In 2014 ---10,000 units
In 2015 ---10,000 units
What do you think? Any suggestions?
It's obvious. The Insider wagon has nothing to do with the Insider Club. Everything is only hot marketing air. And what's about the Insider locomotives?
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 1 user liked this useful post by TEEWolf
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Joined: 25/08/2004(UTC) Posts: 332 Location: Madrid,
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Originally Posted by: TEEWolf It's obvious. The Insider wagon has nothing to do with the Insider Club. Everything is only hot marketing air.
And what's about the Insider locomotives? I don't understand why there's no connection between the insider car and the club. Or between the number of insider cars produced in a year and the number of insider club members. As for the locomotives, I have no data. Best regards |
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Joined: 03/02/2016(UTC)
Posts: 490
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A 30,000 unit drop in one year? It tells that either your numbers are wrong or somebody realised that they miscalculated something.
The numbers will tell you little about the hobby, they will tell you aprox. how many orders the Insider wagon. They might give a hint of the state of the Märkin customer clubs. But a 30,000 drop in one year is unrealistic. There is no way.
Your numbers have no source of origin, so we can't really know if they are correct or not. Not really worth debating unless you tell us where you found them.
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 Joined: 11/08/2015(UTC) Posts: 1,091
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Originally Posted by: MaerklinLife A 30,000 unit drop in one year? It tells that either your numbers are wrong or somebody realised that they miscalculated something.
The numbers will tell you little about the hobby, they will tell you aprox. how many orders the Insider wagon. They might give a hint of the state of the Märkin customer clubs. But a 30,000 drop in one year is unrealistic. There is no way.
Your numbers have no source of origin, so we can't really know if they are correct or not. Not really worth debating unless you tell us where you found them. The number drop is also right around the date/time of the Marklin bankruptcy/insolvency and the acceptance of company restructuring by the courts... 2009 - 2011, I think a scale back because of that as cost cutting is more likely |
American by Geography, Australian by Birth. I am an original Ameristraylian |
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Joined: 03/02/2016(UTC)
Posts: 490
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Originally Posted by: sjbartels The number drop is also right around the date/time of the Marklin bankruptcy/insolvency and the acceptance of company restructuring by the courts... 2009 - 2011, I think a scale back because of that as cost cutting is more likely Perhaps, but since the insider wagon is built according to number of orders it can be considered a rather large over production. I would assume that the number of wagons more or less is the same as the number of people ordering them. Give or take, since they might estimate and start production before all orders are in. I find the drop unrealistic because an estimate off by 30,000 out of 40,000 is a historically bad estimate. Also: Only 10,000 units thereafter? I don't know the number of customers in the Insider club, I would assume it is way more than 10,000 people. I would have guessed at 30,000 customers. I was under the impression that most got their insider wagon. From the looks of it, either the membership number is smaller than I thought or people are not claiming their insider wagon. I don't know. I totally claim mine every year and find it a fun part of the club membership. Again, we don't know the origin of these numbers.
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 Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg
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Hi,
For the years until 1999 the number of the cars should match the known number of the Insider magazine which have a print-code which shows the number.. The cars were and are part of the club-package. And everybody getting the paper, also gets the voucher for the car.
So we get
1993 16000
1994 26000
1995 34000
...
1999 55000
In later years it's more complicated to find out. But the printed number of the Märklin Magazine was also published. Your numbers for 201x are far to low.
Regards
Markus
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2 users liked this useful post by Markus Schild
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Joined: 25/08/2004(UTC) Posts: 332 Location: Madrid,
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Originally Posted by: MaerklinLife Again, we don't know the origin of these numbers. Hello The origin of these numbers is the Koll's , the book about sondermedell and werbemodell, edition 2016, they are estimated but Mr. Koll's is supposed to calculate them somehow. Best regards |
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Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,446
Location: DE-NW
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I have two of the yellow Alak Insider freight cars. I got one free in return for the Insider order form. The second came free as a bonus for an order exceeding €100 from a dealer who had to dump many Alak Insider cars into the market. The Insider magazine is made in several languages, the Insider cars are made in two different gauges. How many Insiders are too lazy to collect the car from the dealer or simply forget it? It seems dealers usually get a few cars more so they can help members who missed the deadline. Theoretically Märklin should only produce the amount they need to fulfil the orders from customers that were submitted before the deadline. Quantity produced could be larger than the quantity delivered to customers, but smaller than the membership base. Happy speculation everybody. Edited by user 20 August 2018 08:17:45(UTC)
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Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS  |
2 users liked this useful post by H0
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 Joined: 29/05/2014(UTC) Posts: 839 Location: DONEGAL, CARNDONAGH
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How could the quantity produced be smaller than the quantity delivered ? Is this some kind of magic . Eddie
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1 user liked this useful post by MalinAC
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Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,446
Location: DE-NW
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Originally Posted by: MalinAC How could the quantity produced be smaller than the quantity delivered ? Is this some kind of magic . Eddie The body was headaching while I wrote that.  Anyway you cannot deduct the number of members from the number of Insider cars that was produced. The number of cars could be larger (optimistic production scheduling) or smaller (not everybody claims their car). Lacking official information it surely is interesting to look at the various production codes of Insider products. |
Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS |
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Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg
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Hi Tom,
I still think, that the number of club members give a good estimation of the number of cars produced. You will agree that 10,000 cars are as wrong as 100,000 cars if there had been 55,000 members. This is no discussion about exact numbers. But the number of club members gives the right scale: The most club cars are far from "rare".
Regards
Markus
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Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,446
Location: DE-NW
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Originally Posted by: Markus Schild I still think, that the number of club members give a good estimation of the number of cars produced. Probably better than the figures in Koll's. There are different figures we can look at. And I think we can come up with estimates as good as +/-20% or maybe even +/-10%. Insider cars are not rare. Insider cars are not built to order. We can look at the circulation of the German Märklin Magazin - but not every subscriber is an Insider, not every Insider gets the German edition. Saying that the club had 55,000 members in the past looks like a very plausible figure. What's the ratio between H0 and Z gauge Insider cars? 95 to 5 maybe? |
Regards Tom --- "In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS |
1 user liked this useful post by H0
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Joined: 25/08/2004(UTC) Posts: 332 Location: Madrid,
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Originally Posted by: Markus Schild Hi,
For the years until 1999 the number of the cars should match the known number of the Insider magazine which have a print-code which shows the number.. The cars were and are part of the club-package. And everybody getting the paper, also gets the voucher for the car.
So we get
1993 16000
1994 26000
1995 34000
...
1999 55000
In later years it's more complicated to find out. But the printed number of the Märklin Magazine was also published. Your numbers for 201x are far to low.
Regards
Markus Thanks for the information, but can you explain how to find and read that code? in both insider magazine and marklin magazine. Best regards |
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Joined: 14/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,802 Location: Wurttemberg
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Joined: 25/08/2004(UTC) Posts: 332 Location: Madrid,
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