Welcome to the forum   
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Share
Options
View
Go to last post in this topic Go to first unread post in this topic
Offline Thewolf  
#1 Posted : 09 September 2016 16:49:58(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Hi guysCool

10 wires red and brown had been prepared for the power supply with 74995 M and 70415 and 70425 M.

The first connection of the wires with the 72090 was a failure..and the second....and so on....I am tired to see '' overload '' on the screen of the cs2

I must check all the wires or at best go made new wires with 74995 one by one and avoid the maximum of sockets, because these sockets for me...this is bulshit with 0.14 mm2 wire

My patience is tested severely and............ I am not patient

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Thewolf  
#2 Posted : 09 September 2016 20:13:12(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
If I understand well, seen the absence of comments, I have to be the only one to have had this kind of very irritating problems.

Either you are hardly in the assembly, or I miss something to succeed in the first blow

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Danlake  
#3 Posted : 09 September 2016 20:28:42(UTC)
Danlake

New Zealand   
Joined: 03/08/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,571
Hi Wolf,

Maybe lack of replies is because people are not sure what your question or problem is.

I can figure out that you are using distribution strips and the feeder wires are connected to the tracks via the small clips (instead of soldering).

My best guess is that you have a short cut and not an overload?

Check all wires and make sure you haven't swopped any wires. For sake of good order, the Marklin distribution strip has all sockets electrical connected so you have to use one for each brown and red wire bus.

Brgds Lasse
Digital 11m2 layout / C (M&K) tracks / Era IV / CS3 60226 / Train Controller Gold 9 with 4D sound. Mainly Danish and German Locomotives.
Offline Minok  
#4 Posted : 09 September 2016 20:30:10(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,310
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
Take a breath. Relax. No response could well be because we haven't seen the post yet. Surprise surprise, we don't all hang out and monitor the posts 24/7. ;)

More seriously, what is the 70415 and 70425 ? My search at Märklin returns unknown part number.

If you are seeing overload, then I'm guessing there is a short circuit somewhere. Could one of the wires be plugged into the wrong contact on the tracks? With C track its not that hard to make that mistake since both spade connectors there are near each other.
Or is a tool laying on the track?
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel:
https://youtube.com/@intercity134
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Minok
Offline Thewolf  
#5 Posted : 09 September 2016 21:10:02(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
When I said that I was not the perfect example of the patience, it is my big defect.

When I say '' Overlaod'' it is, it is so registered on the screen: '' surcharge'' . Overload or short cut (you are right Lasse and Minok) that's the same for me : no current on my layout Crying

I checked some connections and the results make me say: relax Serge and redo quite correctlyall your connections . The 74495 seem not to be correct as well as 71415 and 71425 M. ( and not 70425 and 70415 Blink )

I am going to make a kind of trial table where all the connections will be tested with a multimeter. I also forgotted the fact that a tool on the track can do some troubles

As says my wife, I am incorrigible

Thank you both

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Thewolf
Offline waltklatt  
#6 Posted : 09 September 2016 21:40:41(UTC)
waltklatt

United States   
Joined: 17/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 138
Maybe try to figure out the basics.
Go back and start from the beginning (all wires disconnected) and connect each wire, one-by-one, till you find the same error (surcharge).
Then you skip that wire and connect the rest (or till you hit another error).
If it is only one wire, then you have narrowed down the problem to that one wire.

Further investigation with that wire will give you the cause.

Same with any car. Many cars now have a single fuse with many items connected to it. Fuse for the cigarette lighter will often have other items connected and one is causing a short.
So you disconnect all the items till the one that causes the fuse to blow (you have found the short).

Hope this helps, and sometimes turning the air blue Cursing is a good thing. BigGrin As long as there are no police or children nearby.
Offline Harvey  
#7 Posted : 09 September 2016 22:03:44(UTC)
Harvey

United States   
Joined: 17/02/2008(UTC)
Posts: 591
Location: Glen Oaks, N.Y.
Not sure if I follow the problem (other than a short) and not familiar with the part numbers. Here is what I do when I have a short that is difficult to solve.

1. Disconnect the current to the tracks and turn on the power. Is there a short?
2. If not, reconnect power one section at a time and turn the power on. Is there a short.
3. Continue doing this until you find the section with the short. Once found, redo step 2 but only on that section. Break down that section into subsections.

You'll likely need a floating 'power connection' track for the step three if you have to break the signle section into subsections.

Above is if the tracks or power feed is causing the short. Could also be a dislodged car or a metallic piece on the tracks.

Harvey
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Harvey
Offline Thewolf  
#8 Posted : 10 September 2016 00:57:24(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Thank you for all your advice guys Cool I appreciate.

But I have a big problem and I give some explanation:

four tracks with 744995, red and brown wires were independtly made. The wires were connected to 72090 (red on one hand et brown on other hand) ,the whole connected to the exit(re programming of the cs2, the other exit being for the rails of the layout.

That's ok, All is ok.

But...here begins the disorder...I put one of the rails on the layout and I t to connect one of the 4 tracks with the power on the 7209O of my layout...red to red ...brown to brown....after 3-4 seconds the damned message appears ....problem

Now I am going to make 2-3 meter sections to see the place of the problem.....very long job !!

Next week ....tomorow and sunday ...my job ...Awakening in 3.30 am


Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline PMPeter  
#9 Posted : 10 September 2016 01:46:21(UTC)
PMPeter

Canada   
Joined: 04/04/2013(UTC)
Posts: 1,273
Location: Port Moody, BC
Originally Posted by: Thewolf Go to Quoted Post
The wires were connected to 72090 (red on one hand et brown on other hand) ,the whole connected to the exit(re programming of the cs2, the other exit being for the rails of the layout.


Thewolf


Hopefully the above sentence doesn't say what I think it says. It sounds like you are using one 72090 distribution block and connecting red on one side and brown on the other side. If that is what you are doing that is your problem. A 72090 has all ports common so you can use one whole block for red and another whole block for brown. You cannot have both on one block.

Peter
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by PMPeter
Offline Minok  
#10 Posted : 10 September 2016 01:54:53(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,310
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
What Peter said. A single block (72090) is all electrically connected together. Per the Märklin site's French description : "Pour 11 connecteurs conformes nouveau standard. Toues les connexions sont reliées électriquement. Amenée également possible via 1 connecteur ancienne version. Taille 47 x 26 mm." (my emphasis added).

So you need 1x 72090 to distribute the red(power) and 1x 72090 to distribute the brown(ref/neutral)


http://www.maerklin.de/e...s/details/article/72090/

Edited by moderator 14 September 2016 22:13:18(UTC)  | Reason: Shortened the URL /Webmaster

Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel:
https://youtube.com/@intercity134
Offline Thewolf  
#11 Posted : 10 September 2016 01:56:35(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Originally Posted by: PMPeter Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Thewolf Go to Quoted Post
The wires were connected to 72090 (red on one hand et brown on other hand) ,the whole connected to the exit(re programming of the cs2, the other exit being for the rails of the layout.


Thewolf


Hopefully the above sentence doesn't say what I think it says. It sounds like you are using one 72090 distribution block and connecting red on one side and brown on the other side. If that is what you are doing that is your problem. A 72090 has all ports common so you can use one whole block for red and another whole block for brown. You cannot have both on one block.

Peter


Peter Cool

I wrote : '' connected to 72090 (red on one hand et brown on other hand) '', it means 1 x 72090 for red wire 1 second for brown wire, thus 2 x 72090

Thewolf

Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline PMPeter  
#12 Posted : 10 September 2016 02:06:00(UTC)
PMPeter

Canada   
Joined: 04/04/2013(UTC)
Posts: 1,273
Location: Port Moody, BC
OK. "red on one hand et brown on other hand" could be read as "red on one side and brown on other side". That is why I asked.

If you disconnect all of the exit feeders from these 2 - 72090 distribution blocks and only leave the red and brown power feed wires to these blocks, can you power up with no short circuit message? If yes then you have no problem with the blocks and the power cable feeding them. If no, then you have a problem with the cable from your power source to the distribution blocks.

If everything is OK up to that point, then do as others have stated and add one pair of wires at a time for each of your 4 track sections until you get the short. That will tell you which track section/feeder has the problem.

Good luck.

Peter
Offline dominator  
#13 Posted : 10 September 2016 02:14:12(UTC)
dominator

New Zealand   
Joined: 20/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 1,195
Location: Kerikeri
Hi Segre. I suggest you start labeling all your wires. That way you can more easily track down where your fault lies. Go back and disconnect the area where you first got the problem [ that is if you made a change that might have caused it.. ] then re-attach things one at a time and test.

I had a problem last night where a loco slowed down in one section and stopped. I found there was no power feed in that area [ only one power feed for the whole circuit ] then after removing that section of track to tighten the contacts, I found another feed wire, which while under the track I discovered was not even connected. It is now and is working ok.

My wiring under the track is a birds nest, as a result of doing one thing at a time with no plan in mind. That s my problem though so its just as well some of the wiring has labels. have to put more labels down myself now.

Dereck
Northland. NZ REMEMBER 0228 for ä
Offline Purellum  
#14 Posted : 10 September 2016 22:34:53(UTC)
Purellum

Denmark   
Joined: 08/11/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,498
Location: Mullerup, 4200 Slagelse
Cool

Maybe this is obvious to you; but I just want to be sure:

Take a look at this picture. The wires are opposite in the two ends of the track:

UserPostedImage

Thus, if you just connected all red wires in one side of the track, and all brown wires on the opposite side,
without thinking of which end of the track pieces you used, you have a problem / short.

Per.

Cool

If you can dream it, you can do it!

I, the copyright holder of this work, hereby release it into the public domain. This applies worldwide.

In case this is not legally possible:
I grant anyone the right to use this work for any purpose, without any conditions, unless such conditions are required by law.

UserPostedImage
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Purellum
Online Dave Banks  
#15 Posted : 10 September 2016 23:16:28(UTC)
Dave Banks

Australia   
Joined: 08/03/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,025
Location: Gold Coast, Australia.
Hi Wolf, Can you please take some pictures of what you are doing. A picture is worth a thousand words & we may spot your problem straight away. Cool
D.A.Banks
Offline Thewolf  
#16 Posted : 11 September 2016 14:51:01(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Hi guys ...I answer from my office...I work the week end from 5.30 am to....2.30 -3.30 pm

all what you want ....tomorrow

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline dominator  
#17 Posted : 11 September 2016 23:23:54(UTC)
dominator

New Zealand   
Joined: 20/01/2015(UTC)
Posts: 1,195
Location: Kerikeri
https://www.marklin-user...purellum/Ctrack01res.jpg

That looks pretty straight forward to me. I suspect there is something fishy .
Dereck
Northland. NZ REMEMBER 0228 for ä
Offline Hoffmann  
#18 Posted : 12 September 2016 01:27:27(UTC)
Hoffmann

Canada   
Joined: 25/11/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,106
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Hi.

You may have all wires connected right . Is it possible that you pushed a Tap on the B connection ( red wire ) to far down, if so it will make a short with the bridge to the outer rails O connection ( brown wire ).

Wiring up C-Track should not be a Problem for anyone.

Regards Martin
marklin-eh
Offline Thewolf  
#19 Posted : 13 September 2016 23:46:19(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Originally Posted by: Hoffmann Go to Quoted Post

Hi.

You may have all wires connected right . Is it possible that you pushed a Tap on the B connection ( red wire ) to far down, if so it will make a short with the bridge to the outer rails O connection ( brown wire ).

Wiring up C-Track should not be a Problem for anyone.

Regards Martin


Don't be worry...wiring up C-Track is not a problem for me

Thewolf

Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Thewolf  
#20 Posted : 14 September 2016 00:03:33(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Hi guys Cool

As you will see it by the photos which are going to follow, it is actually a problem on the layout somewhere that causes a short circuit. It is what I believe as most of you

First of all, the exit used of the cs2 is the layout exit.

a) Picture 1 and 2 show the cs2 with the test of red/brown wires-72090. All is connected and all is ok

201609013 (1).JPG

201609013 (2).JPG

b) Picture 3 and 4 show one track on Heidleberg....the wires red/brown are connected to cs2 by 72090...all is correct and cs2 too

201609013 (3).JPG

201609013 (4).JPG

c) Pictures 5 and 6 show the 72090 of Heidelberg

201609013 (5).JPG

201609013 (6).JPG

d) The last picture shows the reaction of the cs2.

Here is 5 seconds the track has just been connected to the other tracks of the layout

201609013 (7).JPG

I am going to verify everything by short sections up to the place where the problem is

Your advice ?

Thank you for all

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Minok  
#21 Posted : 14 September 2016 00:35:19(UTC)
Minok

United States   
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,310
Location: Washington, Pacific Northwest
Nothing looks unusual. I see there are dangling red and brown wires w connectors in the background. Are those connected to the track loop? The plugs with their set screws may be contacting each other (brown and red) ? Just make sure you account for every conducting wire and component coming into contact with the electrical system of the track.
Toys of tin and wood rule!
---
My Layout Thread on marklin-users.net: InterCity 1-3-4
My YouTube Channel:
https://youtube.com/@intercity134
Offline Thewolf  
#22 Posted : 14 September 2016 00:48:18(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Originally Posted by: Minok Go to Quoted Post
Nothing looks unusual. I see there are dangling red and brown wires w connectors in the background. Are those connected to the track loop? The plugs with their set screws may be contacting each other (brown and red) ? Just make sure you account for every conducting wire and component coming into contact with the electrical system of the track.



Thank you MinokCool

Don't be worry for the dangling wires . I continue my work and in date,.... everything is functional

Game over for todayCool

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Thewolf  
#23 Posted : 14 September 2016 02:58:13(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
I found the problem: a grey wire of one 7555 affecting one of the borders A or B of a track. Finally I think that it is the reason

This is my fault: to place one 7555 M on one 24077 M... damned Serge.Crying

201609014.JPG


As it is at the foot of a curve, 7555 M will be replaced by one 24194 M and one 24115 M, 24077 will stay "nude"

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Thewolf
Offline Thewolf  
#24 Posted : 14 September 2016 21:26:10(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
60 % of my layout has electric current Cool

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Thewolf
Offline waltklatt  
#25 Posted : 14 September 2016 22:17:10(UTC)
waltklatt

United States   
Joined: 17/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 138
Ahh the great feeling of moving forward.
You found one of the culprits.
Now to get power to 100% of the layout.

Hmm, I wonder, does the gauge of the wire also affect the setup? Thicker wires versus thinner wires?

Just curious.

Walter
Offline Thewolf  
#26 Posted : 14 September 2016 22:54:15(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Originally Posted by: waltklatt Go to Quoted Post
Ahh the great feeling of moving forward.
You found one of the culprits.
Now to get power to 100% of the layout.

Hmm, I wonder, does the gauge of the wire also affect the setup? Thicker wires versus thinner wires?

Just curious.

Walter


Hi WalterCool

It affects not at all. It is a little the principle of subdivision

There are 10 mintues : 100 % power of the layout BigGrin

Tomorow the first loco shall run on Heidelberg. This evening european soccer : 5 recorded games

Thewolf

Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
Offline Thewolf  
#27 Posted : 14 September 2016 23:18:15(UTC)
Thewolf

Canada   
Joined: 08/09/2015(UTC)
Posts: 2,035
Location: Saint Mathias dur Richelieu-Canada
Impossible to wait .

I was not able to resist the fact of testing my softwre ''Itrain''

The sound '' clac clac '' of the turn outs are pleasant to hear BigGrin

Thewolf
Project The Richelieu Valley Railway-CS2-Track C- Itrain-Digital
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Thewolf
Users browsing this topic
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

| Powered by YAF.NET | YAF.NET © 2003-2024, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.954 seconds.