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Offline Dick  
#1 Posted : 02 July 2005 23:45:27(UTC)
Dick


Joined: 08/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 134
Location: ,
I am in the process of converting my older locos to digital using the subject decoder. As you may know this will allow you to convert without having to change the motor in any way. It uses the original 3 pole flat commutator motor as is! The circuit board sits in the space that used to house the solenoid reversing unit.

My problem is the manual is all in German. Their website has no downloads for instructions in English.

Can anyone e-mail me a circuit diagram or hook-up instructions? Either here or at my address <bolz@mountainaccess.net>. Sur would appreciate it
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#2 Posted : 03 July 2005 10:55:29(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
Hello Richard,

I'll make a try. It's true, you should remove the old reversing relay, and disconnet the cable from the motor. The field coil has 3 cables, or maybe 4 where two are connected togheter, to a drossle (hf coil) which goes to one of the motor connection I think; this connection is not used anymore, but if it consists of tow separate wires, those should be soldered together and isolated from the rest. The othet two wires from the field coil should be connected to the white cables from decoder. I'm not 100 % sure here, but this is the only interpretation that makes sense to me.

The other things are straightforward. Keep the capacitator between the two brushes, which take the blue and green cables from decoder; no other connection to the motor should be present when finished. Yellow and grey goes to the direction dependent lights where grey preferable is forward. If the direction of travel differs from the lit end when finished, you may change this by programming CV 29; but of course, there is also the option of wait with grey and yellow until everything else is done and you may test what direction it travels.

Red goes as usual to the slider, and brown to the chassis; you the old 'main soldering point' which I think is situated at the lower left screw of the motor. This has connection both to wheels and to the lamsps.

Do you need f1 and f2? In the german manual those are denoted A1 and A2, and must be soldered to the PCB by yourself. And I don't think those will be usable with a 6020 central.

In case the engine goes with wrong speed, or changes direction, you could buy 71500, two drossles and a capacitator connected as shown; however, I would suggest you try without thsese, just keeping the capacitator as said above.

Programming is preferable done with a DCC central, but also possible with a Märklin central. Please tell if you want instruction for this as well.

Regards,
Lars
Offline Dick  
#3 Posted : 04 July 2005 03:01:25(UTC)
Dick


Joined: 08/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 134
Location: ,
A BIG THANK YOU to Lars, for such a complete response to my posting. I think this makes clear how to hook up the 76200. Thanks also to the providers of the forum for making cooperation such as this possible.

Too bad the folks at Uhlenbrock in Germany don't take the time to at least post downloads of their manuals in English. I am certain that they sell quite a few of their products here in the U.S.
Offline rugauger  
#4 Posted : 04 July 2005 19:38:16(UTC)
rugauger

United Kingdom   
Joined: 19/12/2003(UTC)
Posts: 1,205
Location: Swindon, Wiltshire
Lars - nicely done. That's exactly how it's done! The only slight difference is that, usually, if the light change is not in line with the direction change, you would swap the green and blue cables.
Richard
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#5 Posted : 05 July 2005 00:22:00(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by rugauger
<br />Lars - nicely done. That's exactly how it's done! The only slight difference is that, usually, if the light change is not in line with the direction change, you would swap the green and blue cables.


Yes, swapping green and blue will be more in order. However, my idea has the benefit of not needing resoldering. When the blue and green cables are connected, I can check the direction of travel, and measure which cable has voltage. But my idea also means that the arrow indication of the central will be wrong; your's is better, unlesss you are lazy. Better yet is probably using CV29 if the diretion is wrong.

/Lars
Offline rugauger  
#6 Posted : 07 July 2005 17:12:46(UTC)
rugauger

United Kingdom   
Joined: 19/12/2003(UTC)
Posts: 1,205
Location: Swindon, Wiltshire
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Lars Westerlind
(...) Yes, swapping green and blue will be more in order. However, my idea has the benefit of not needing resoldering. (...)/Lars
This is where I "stray" a little from the installation instructions. wink

I don't solder green/blue until I know they are right. I just turn on the speed at a really low setting, then briefly hold both cable ends to the field coil connections. The loco will make a brief jump. Enough for me to work out which cable goes to where!
Richard
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#7 Posted : 07 July 2005 19:00:06(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
Idea stolen wink
/Lars
Offline rschaffr  
#8 Posted : 07 July 2005 19:22:13(UTC)
rschaffr

United States   
Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC)
Posts: 5,180
Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
Yes, great idea. I'll add that to my conversion process. Thanks.
-Ron
Digital, Epoch IV-V(K-track/CS3/6021Connect/60216051), Epoch III(C-track/6021/6036/6051)
http://www.sem-co.com/~rschaffr/trains/trains.html
Offline Dick  
#9 Posted : 08 July 2005 05:47:15(UTC)
Dick


Joined: 08/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 134
Location: ,
Thank you all for your replies. It would have been so much simpler and avoided so much discussion (which I appreciate and thank you all for) if Uhlenbrock would be willing to do as ESU/LokPilot does. That is to at least provide a download on their website with instructions in other languages such as Marklin finally has done for a long time. Perhaps if they are flooded with complaning e-mails from users that feel asI do, then they might listen. I am sure that I am not the first to make a complaint. After all, they are willing to take our money, Euros, Pounds and Dollars. Not everyone speaks German! How do you Guys and Gals feel?
Offline Lars Westerlind  
#10 Posted : 08 July 2005 09:22:14(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
Wouldn't learning german solve your problem as well?
/Lars
Offline Dick  
#11 Posted : 08 July 2005 22:34:12(UTC)
Dick


Joined: 08/09/2003(UTC)
Posts: 134
Location: ,
Good Point Lars, I agree and I have studied German for 7 years, 4 in University. I almost always can understand what I read. The problem is that the instructions are not clear to even a German. If they had provided a simple circuit diagram, there would be no problem. My native born German neighbor was unable to get a clear meaning from the instructions either. He sent a fax copy to his nephew in Berlin, an E.E. to see if perhaps he could clarify their meaning. On my past visits to Germany, it usually took me about a week and a few beers before I got back into a reasonably good conversational mode.

Be assured, I appreciate your point. The fact that Uhlenbrock has not responded to an e-mail query that I sent almost 2 weeks ago indicates a certain lack of customer concern, I think. Again best wishes and have a nice week-end.

Offline Lars Westerlind  
#12 Posted : 09 July 2005 01:13:08(UTC)
Lars Westerlind


Joined: 19/10/2001(UTC)
Posts: 2,379
Location: Lindome, Sweden
I agree,
the meaning was unclear to me too. I had to use other knowledge too in order to figure out a meaning that made sense. And think Richard confirmed that this interpretation was correct.
/Lars
Offline Hoffmann  
#13 Posted : 10 July 2005 00:19:08(UTC)
Hoffmann

Canada   
Joined: 25/11/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,106
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Hi Dick,

This may be somewhat of your topic but I have noticed that there are a lot of questions lately about conversion with decoders and decoder problems[:I][:I].
A easy solution would be to convert your older Locos with a ESU decoder and a Hamo Magnet, this would mean that you can use your old Marklin Motor minus the Field and the reversing unit.
The Price is allmost the same as any other conversion and ESU has excellent instructions in english and you also can use either the regular or MFX decoders.
By converting with a Hamo magnet your Engines will be allmost as smooth as a 5 Star conversion for a 3rd of the Price.
In addition if you use the Wiring Harness with the Plug you can swap decoders if needed.

Martin
marklin-eh
Offline rschaffr  
#14 Posted : 10 July 2005 01:50:13(UTC)
rschaffr

United States   
Joined: 03/01/2003(UTC)
Posts: 5,180
Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
Martin: I have started using the ESU decoders almost exclusively, but I still convert to 5 pole motors. The loks I had converted with HAMO magnets and the old 3 pole rotors just didn't run to my satisfaciton. I know it is more expensive, but really, the parts don't cost THAT much compared to what you have already invested in the decoder.
-Ron
Digital, Epoch IV-V(K-track/CS3/6021Connect/60216051), Epoch III(C-track/6021/6036/6051)
http://www.sem-co.com/~rschaffr/trains/trains.html
Offline chon  
#15 Posted : 30 August 2005 13:48:14(UTC)
chon


Joined: 08/03/2004(UTC)
Posts: 113
Location: Antwerp,
Hello you all,

I've recently bought 2 Uhlenbrock 76200 to put them into old Märklin locos and to enjoy smooth running and cruise control. The first one I've changed was a BR 04 (Märklin 3049). I proceed like the description Lars gave and it worked fine. The loco runs gently now.

I started to put the other one in the steam loco of the Rheingold set, a BR S 3/6, which had a original Delta decoder. I removed it and put the 76200 at the place and wired all cables as described before. But this time the loco refuses to run. I've programmed the decoder in DCC mode, every parameter is recognized. When I increase the speed, I hear the motor making a noice but there's no movement. The lights shines correctly however.

I read somewhere that I had to remove some capacitors (I suppose these are those brown pastille-like elements - I'm far from an expert Smile), is it necessary ? Do I overlooked something ?

Thanks for any reply,
Chon
Offline al_pignolo  
#16 Posted : 30 September 2005 15:28:26(UTC)
al_pignolo


Joined: 30/09/2005(UTC)
Posts: 904
Location: bologna, BO
Hallo. I too had problems on mounting 76200 decoder in my old locomotives... because I don't speak german, too, (and also my english is very bad, as you can see..) I first tried with a 3039 (BR 110) following Lars' instructions and finding that it is quite easy... Smile
But I still have 3 problems, hoping that someone can help me:

1) I read somewhere that some decoders can't support "normal" Maerklin lightbulbs (60015), because they drain too much current and could damage the decoder[xx(]: I didn't link the lights by now. Do I have to change them with 610080 or something like that?

2) I don't know how to program CVs, like address, etc. with my 6021. A friend of mine also tried with his Intellibox but we didn't have success. How can I program the decoder and wich are the most important CVs? The CVs' function are the same of other decoder (like Zimo, ec?)

3) I left the old 3 pole motors. But I found that its runnig in digital purpose is worse than before. I think I could have better results on setting the frequency of the PVM... but how can I do it?

FInally, my answer to chon... based on my little experience: yes, you must remove all the capacitors ("pastille-like elements") except for the one between the motor brushes. If you don't do that, the digital signal is grounded and the locomotive doesn't move.

Bye.
Offline john black  
#17 Posted : 30 September 2005 20:43:38(UTC)
john black

United States   
Joined: 22/04/2004(UTC)
Posts: 12,139
Location: New York, NY
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by al_pignolo
<br />I don't know how to program CVs, like address, etc. with my 6021


Hi Al, easy task:

www.maerklin.de * service * FAQ * mfx-products * mfx-loco programming with 6021 * download file ... biggrin

John
I hope no one visits a poor Southener's layout in Brooklyn. Intruders beware of Gators.
AT&SF, D&RGW, T&P, SP, WP, UP, BN, NYC, ARR, epI-III - analog & digital Marklin Classics only.
CU#6021 FX-MOTOROLA DIGITAL SYSTEM. Fast as lightning and no trouble. What else ...
Outlaw Member of BIG JUHAN's OUTSIDER CLUB. With the most members, worldwide

Offline chon  
#18 Posted : 30 September 2005 23:26:54(UTC)
chon


Joined: 08/03/2004(UTC)
Posts: 113
Location: Antwerp,
I've two remarks.

1. Some of you say it's better to remove the capacitors, except the one between the brushes. But when I did it, nothing runs. If I don't do it, everything runs perfectly. So, it seems that Uhlenbrock is right saying you don't need to change anything to the motor.

2. When I wrongly solder the green and the blue wires, so that the direction doesn't match with the lights, if I use CV29 instead of soldering the wires correctly, have noticed some strange behaviour of the engines at very slow motion : they hesitate which direction to follow. I have noticed it twice. So, I prefer to solder the wires again, correctly this time wink.

For the rest, I'm very satisfied with this decoder. The locos run more smoothly than before and, in DCC-mode, you can effectively run at very slow motion, what was impossible before.
Chon
Offline al_pignolo  
#19 Posted : 04 October 2005 18:15:28(UTC)
al_pignolo


Joined: 30/09/2005(UTC)
Posts: 904
Location: bologna, BO
Quote:
[size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by chon
<br />


2. When I wrongly solder the green and the blue wires, so that the direction doesn't match with the lights, if I use CV29 instead of soldering the wires correctly, have noticed some strange behaviour of the engines at very slow motion : they hesitate which direction to follow. I have noticed it twice. So, I prefer to solder the wires again, correctly this time wink.




I have the same problem with my motors, but I didn't change Cv29. I'll try to change it.

It sounds very strange to me that you prefer to leave capacitors... I have ever heard that with capacitors the digital signal becomes flat...

Thank you for you replies. Bye
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