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nevw		#1 Posted : 28 October 2008 10:02:38(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		WEll I got the Lovely looking box this morning, First experience was that it cost an additional $175 in Customs fees due to the meltdown of the OZ $$. Next experience, box is nice, Manuals have nice pictures but not much useful information. read what I could set it up. Help is terrible, cannot search it and there IS NO Help on Upgrading. Hooked up the Wireless Bridge, turned on the box, again Nice Pictures, CS2 got a valid Ip address from the router so I said UPGRADE. about 10 attempts later including resets, restarts etc still nowhere. during this time I tried to add some locos from the programming track as the manual says. How many loaded NONE. Tried loading one on the layout , Success (Non MFX) Now tried upgrading software via the USB Port. took 3 goes. but we got there. PLaced a MFX loco on the programming track, no recognition, did a restart cs2 registered 3 MFX Locos on the layout, let me add one other manualy. Now all of this time the loco menus would pop up randomly on both sides. Then when adding a loco the system froze. SHut down , did a system restore, Now no locos , cannot add any, MFX locos are not registering. SO back to the US . Full refund. Do not want another heap of worry. It appears to be very flakey. Anyone who claims to have no problems with these are telling porkies. Nev, FRUSTRATED [V][V][V][V][xx(][xx(][xx(][:(][:(][:(][:(] EDIT: we did a restart but on the way some smoke escaped. Dead. [xx(][:(][:(][:(][:(][:(] ANother good thing got a gst and Lodgement fee refund as item leaving the country.
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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foumaro		#2 Posted : 28 October 2008 10:12:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/12/2004(UTC) Posts: 4,430 Location: Attiki Athens Greece		Long live 6021.
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Bigdaddynz		#3 Posted : 28 October 2008 10:27:50(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,768 Location: New Zealand		Oh dear! Bring back the CS1. Early adopters beware!
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PeterG		#4 Posted : 28 October 2008 10:40:02(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 24/07/2008(UTC) Posts: 156 Location: Sydney,		Your report is pretty discouraging Nev - thanks for sharing. Could you tell me a little more about the extra customs fee you had to pay? What was that for exactly? I'm thinking about buying some already extremely expensive Maerklin stuff from German ebay in the next few days and I don't want to pay any extra. Maerklin has just become even more prohibitive thanks to the dollar's decline.-Peter
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steventrain		#5 Posted : 28 October 2008 10:46:13(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC) Posts: 31,686 Location: United Kingdom		Sorry to hear that, Nev.[V]
		Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
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mvd71		#6 Posted : 28 October 2008 11:21:30(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,919 Location: Auckland,		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Your report is pretty discouraging Nev - thanks for sharing. Quite right. Mike.
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Macfire		#7 Posted : 28 October 2008 11:22:45(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 04/11/2006(UTC) Posts: 2,652 Location: New Zealand		Jeez mate [xx(] [xx(]
		Lord Macca New Zealand branch of Clan Donald.
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laalves		#8 Posted : 28 October 2008 11:37:59(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal		Wow.... You were way more unlucky than I was. Mine is currently operating perfectly, except for the known issues (and I've left it on for many hours to see if it burns again!). You probably got a low S/N of which some are known to have knob problems (the menus popping up). From what I've read in stummi and here, there's no way around that but to send it back for hardware repair. I haven't experienced any mfx recognition problems with any CS2 I tried (I've used 4, I think), but I've read about similar problems to yours in stummi, although some of them showed up to be wrong wiring, i.e., CS1 wired plugs. Remember the CS2 muat have the cables reversed, compared to the CS1. Better luck next time....
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Legless		#9 Posted : 28 October 2008 11:43:08(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 20/07/2007(UTC) Posts: 809 Location: Leopold, Victoria		Sorry to hear the hassle of your new CS2 Nev, again thats why I'll stick to my CS1 and upgrade to V3.0.
		Legless Era's 1 to 111,C track,k track
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WelshMatt		#10 Posted : 28 October 2008 11:52:24(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 06/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,345 Location: ,		And people wonder why I've just bought a 6022...
		Matt from Wales. When you pay Range Rover prices, don't accept Lada quality
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Bigdaddynz		#11 Posted : 28 October 2008 11:58:57(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,768 Location: New Zealand		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Legless <br />Sorry to hear the hassle of your new CS2 Nev, again thats why I'll stick to my CS1 and upgrade to V3.0. Same here, for now!
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Bigdaddynz		#12 Posted : 28 October 2008 12:01:01(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,768 Location: New Zealand		Oooops more bad news from Nev........I'll let him say what it is, but before I sign off for tonight, I'll say 'Bad Luck my friend'.[xx(][xx(][xx(]
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mascagni		#13 Posted : 28 October 2008 12:20:26(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 826 Location: Tallahassee, FL USA		So sorry to hear, I hope that you get some happy resolution with a minimal hassle. Good luck!!--MM
		Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
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nevw		#14 Posted : 28 October 2008 12:32:42(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Right the smoke escaped. DEAD Peter if the Parcel has an AUD Value of over $1000 (they are being a bit lenient due to wild fluctuations in the FX Rate.) If over $1000 for have to pay 10% GST and a $48 lodgement fee as well as qualify for the 100 Points test. this happens for each parcel. As leaving the country tomorrow I got a refund. N
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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nevw		#15 Posted : 28 October 2008 12:34:19(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by laalves <br />Wow.... You were way more unlucky than I was. Mine is currently operating perfectly, except for the known issues (and I've left it on for many hours to see if it burns again!). You probably got a low S/N of which some are known to have knob problems (the menus popping up). From what I've read in stummi and here, there's no way around that but to send it back for hardware repair. I haven't experienced any mfx recognition problems with any CS2 I tried (I've used 4, I think), but I've read about similar problems to yours in stummi, although some of them showed up to be wrong wiring, i.e., CS1 wired plugs. Remember the CS2 muat have the cables reversed, compared to the CS1. Better luck next time.... Cables were wired as per the diagram that came with the Unit. as I say , box and Pictures were good. No next time unless the cS2 behaves about 12 months in hte future. N
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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jeehring		#16 Posted : 28 October 2008 14:06:38(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/09/2003(UTC) Posts: 2,786 Location: ,		Ihave just noticed something : some people have a good knowledge in computing , programming and all things about computers ( which is not my case , i'm completely useless about computers, programming etc..;etc..) Readding the forums , it seems that a majority of people who got problems with the CS2 are people havinginitially a good knowledge about the use of PC or mastering all those things about computing... Strange Not so strange...
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mascagni		#17 Posted : 28 October 2008 14:31:58(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 826 Location: Tallahassee, FL USA		Hi: With the (minimum of two) spectacular failures that we are reading about, I wonder what the real failure rate of the CS2 is. Would the webmaster be interested in running an informal poll of all the CS2 early adopters to see what the polled failure rate is? I suspect you hear about the failures in the forum without fail, but that people happily using the new CS2 are too busy having fun to mention it on the forum.--MM
		Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
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Goofy		#18 Posted : 28 October 2008 15:31:42(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC) Posts: 9,273		I wonder now if Marklin has been to hurry up by selling CS2,when they should been make sure by finish CS2 first at all...!? So CS2 can been in function first... Too bad nevw...! Better luck with an new CS2...!(if that happens so...!) Goofy
		H0 DCC = Digital Command Control
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WelshMatt		#19 Posted : 28 October 2008 16:05:24(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 06/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,345 Location: ,		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by jeehring <br />Ihave just noticed something : some people have a good knowledge in computing , programming and all things about computers ( which is not my case , i'm completely useless about computers, programming etc..;etc..) Readding the forums , it seems that a majority of people who got problems with the CS2 are people havinginitially a good knowledge about the use of PC or mastering all those things about computing... Strange Not so strange... Well if you want to see if something will break, give it to an expert! Seriously, it would have benefited Marklin hugely if they'd offered various modellers the chance to be beta testers - they'd get a discounted CS2 on the understanding that they were to give regular reports and keep a log of what they'd done with it. It needs to be indestructible at the price charged, with cut-outs and similar so that short circuits and overloads will just cause it to shut down and flash lights at you.
		Matt from Wales. When you pay Range Rover prices, don't accept Lada quality
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Webmaster		#20 Posted : 28 October 2008 20:19:01(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC) Posts: 11,165		Arrghhh... Nev, you are the most unlucky CSx owner I have ever seen... [xx(]
		Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service... He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
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Bigdaddynz		#21 Posted : 28 October 2008 21:33:11(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,768 Location: New Zealand		Must be something to do with that gammy arm........[:0][B)][8)]
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dntower85		#22 Posted : 28 October 2008 22:40:19(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 2,218 Location: Shady Shores, TX - USA		If this web site had theme music it would half to be "another one bites the dust" by queen sorry Nev
		DT Now powered by ECoS II unit#2, RocRail era - some time in the future when the space time continuum is disrupted and ICE 3 Trains run on the same rails as the Adler and BR18's.
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nevw		#23 Posted : 28 October 2008 23:19:25(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Darrin THats Ok. MAtt Yes Marklin has Beta Testers, Lutz is one. he has had a cs for some months but nothing has gone wrong with his. well we have asked him of any problems and how many times it had to go back and have had no response, ergo: he has had no problems. Notice no posts listing problems. Michael, I think the failure rate of low Serial numbered units below about 2500-3000 is about 50 % Taking Lius 's dealer as an example 50% failure of first shipment. very expensive exercise to rush something onto the Market Yes Juhan, had my share of luck with CS, sent back after upgrade without Software, instead of sending software insisted it go back to germany, then they sent 2 new replacements. when the one I am now using played up a bit I sent it away. really did not take long, sent back a new unit. biggest drag was that it sat in Stuttgart Post office for 19 days. Oh well, no CS 2 for some years.
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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mmervine		#24 Posted : 28 October 2008 23:48:17(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 30/01/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,893 Location: Keene, NH		Hopefully, with development in house, Marklin will get the updates done quickly. Except for those of you with hardware failures, I would urge patience. It has really taken ESU a couple of years to make ECoS solid and there are still a few bugs. I am sure that they will introduce a few more with the 3.0 update and we will need 3.1, 3.2, etc. to correct. Hopefully, a little patience will pay off...
		Märklin C-track, Marklin Digital & ECoS, multi-era French & Swiss http://www.ete-ene.org/m...mervines-layout-gallery/
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nevw		#25 Posted : 28 October 2008 23:51:07(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mmervine <br />Hopefully, with development in house, Marklin will get the updates done quickly. Except for those of you with hardware failures, I would urge patience. It has really taken ESU a couple of years to make ECoS solid and there are still a few bugs. I am sure that they will introduce a few more with the 3.0 update and we will need 3.1, 3.2, etc. to correct. Hopefully, a little patience will pay off... Mark, with postge and insurance approaching $100 a pop. I am going to give the CS2 a big miss. starts a one way journey today. I am totally P***ed off with Marklin. they knew that there were big problems with low serial numbered units. they should have never released them into the US. now dealers have to wear the cost. The FD who sees things in simple eyes has said just decreed no more MArklin. Hag, Brawa etc OK but not Marklin. Quality gone and full of problems. N
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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WelshMatt		#26 Posted : 29 October 2008 01:40:40(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 06/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 1,345 Location: ,		Maybe they need some more enthusiastic testers then - people who will actively try to kill it with short circuits, pressing all the buttons at once, switching it off at inopportune moments, etc. At €600+ it needs to be bomb-proof from the day it reaches the owner. Obviously I don't expect it to survive being dunked in seawater or thrown off a roof, but the hardware should not be harmed by just leaving it powered up with nothing running for a while. I was vaguely hoping the CS II would lead to a glut of cheap 6021s on ebay but I somehow suspect people will hang onto them for a while yet!
		Matt from Wales. When you pay Range Rover prices, don't accept Lada quality
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nevw		#27 Posted : 29 October 2008 07:23:03(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Webmaster <br />Arrghhh... Nev, you are the most unlucky CSx owner I have ever seen... [xx(] Juhan, the blame for this fiasco with the Cs2 can be laid directly at LUtz's feet. I had decided as this was new there would be problems so told myself to stay away. I looked, listened at the problems some members were having Lutz never made a comment about those so I presumed (Wrongly as it turded out) that they were exaggerations. LUTZ kept on saying that all was Good and these were only isolated incidents. I trusted Lutz as he inferred that there were no problems. BUT I forgot he was talking as the Marklin Sales Rep at a revivalist meeting , swearing that it was the truth on a stack of Marklin Year books and a pile of rejected CS2 Boxes. I allowed myself to be seduced by his honeyed lying tongue and accepted the falsehood that all was Good. How wrong we were. 6 hours later and I owned an expensive pile of junk On day it will be all good news. To Those with high Serial numbers I hope all goes well. NN
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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mmrcnzjohn		#28 Posted : 29 October 2008 07:55:28(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 558 Location: ,		I will admit that I find this whole thread strange. I think it is obvious that there is an issue concerning component failure with some low serial numbered units, however Marklin took a big brave step by announcing the CS II and releasing it within a 6 week time frame. Personally I wonder why they did not wait until the toy fair, but no doubt there is a strategic reason why not. So Marklin would appear to be somewhat of a victim of its own success. It appears to have got some faulty parts that are causing the problem. Would the same distress and gnashing of teeth be applicable if say the same thing was to have happened in 12 months time? Now if this was a software producer would the same thing happen in terms of a core operating system? Except for the component failures, it would appear that once people have got it working it is a great controller. As the price has risen by about NZD200-300 in the last few weeks, I think I will hang off buying one. Not because of component failure but because of the cost.
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nevw		#29 Posted : 29 October 2008 08:15:42(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		mmrcnzjohn , Yes there are both Hardware and software issues. In time they will be overcome and It will be a great controller. The biggest gripe is that M knew that most of the early production had faults but still pushed them out onto the market. That is Wrong and caused a lot of anti Marklin feeling. turns FDs against Marklin.
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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mmrcnzjohn		#30 Posted : 29 October 2008 08:55:54(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 558 Location: ,		But Nev, The question is whether they shipped under the belief that they were ok and have subsequently found out that there is a problem. One of the issues with buying via mail order is the return issue. Thats something that we have to deal with. Not everyone is lucky enough to have a dealer within driving distance. John
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Bigdaddynz		#31 Posted : 29 October 2008 22:43:16(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,768 Location: New Zealand		Still hugely annoying when something does go wrong. I guess it means we need to be more circumspect about what we commit our cash to!
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Webmaster		#32 Posted : 29 October 2008 23:14:14(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC) Posts: 11,165		To be honest, at our company we ship mobile hardware that we think is ok - loaded with OS & software made by yours truly... We've had situations where have had to repair whole batches of mobile units due to poor components as eg bad touch screens from 3M and such... We also have had batches with some hardware glitches like USB ports not working correctly with a certain kind of printer, display inverters that are not up to spec from the subcontractor so they let out the smoke and such... Unfortunately I have to admit there may have been SW issues as well when some customer has tried to use our products in a way we did not foresee... But we always fix the problems as warranty to satisfy the customer, since the customer expects to have a unit that works for the premium cash they paid... Sorry for this off-topic rant, but M are not the only ones having early series faults - it's actually quite common with "special" stuff...
		Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service... He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
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nevw		#33 Posted : 29 October 2008 23:21:56(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mmrcnzjohn <br />But Nev, The question is whether they shipped under the belief that they were ok and have subsequently found out that there is a problem. One of the issues with buying via mail order is the return issue. Thats something that we have to deal with. Not everyone is lucky enough to have a dealer within driving distance. John T is my belief that they were shipped with Marklin knowing that there were faults. Luis returned his to his dealer on 13/10. Dealer had been in contact with M and told to return 4 faulty units. (50% of his stock). Before that date others were being returned. The US shipment probably arried at Walthers at a guess about 20th and Distribution began about 24 October. Plenty of time to make an honourable decision to recall that shipment and send new ones. Greed and Marketing got in the way of Ethics.
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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mvd71		#34 Posted : 29 October 2008 23:33:44(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 09/08/2008(UTC) Posts: 1,919 Location: Auckland,		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:M are not the only ones having early series faults - it's actually quite common with "special" stuff... And in many respects, we are our own worst enemies, because we keep demanding more from the manufacturers.[B)] Cheers..... Mike.
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nevw		#35 Posted : 30 October 2008 00:08:27(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by Webmaster <br />To be honest, at our company we ship mobile hardware that we think is ok - loaded with OS & software made by yours truly... We've had situations where have had to repair whole batches of mobile units due to poor components as eg bad touch screens from 3M and such... We also have had batches with some hardware glitches like USB ports not working correctly with a certain kind of printer, display inverters that are not up to spec from the subcontractor so they let out the smoke and such... Unfortunately I have to admit there may have been SW issues as well when some customer has tried to use our products in a way we did not foresee... But we always fix the problems as warranty to satisfy the customer, since the customer expects to have a unit that works for the premium cash they paid... Sorry for this off-topic rant, but M are not the only ones having early series faults - it's actually quite common with "special" stuff... sending goods out with unknown defects is one thing, making a shipment with KNOWN hardware defects/faults is business practices at its worst
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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rhtastro		#36 Posted : 30 October 2008 04:55:18(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 19/11/2007(UTC) Posts: 2,835 Location: Northern California,		So sorry Nev, you deserve better. I'm afraid I see this sort of thing all the time as I live close to Silicon Valley. It gets in the local news quite often. CNET is a good source for that. That's why I never, never buy anything new when it's first released for sale. It's a gamble and sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. My decision to wait a while for a CS-2 was based on that. The idea of having a beta version out there should have been done if it wasn't. All major electronic co's do that as a rule. Even so, there can be a lot of glitches in new production models. Cheers, Bob
		Robert's trains insured by Colt 45--Marklin Club of NorCal, Founder and Sole Member--- Robert's photos may be used as public domain-all copyrights waved "All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent"-T.Jefferson
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nevw		#37 Posted : 30 October 2008 05:54:14(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Bob, it was a big let down. I had made the decision , as it was new technology NOT to get one this year. Somehow , possibly under the influence of Smoke Oil or some other mind altering substance I had a turn around and ordered one. If the company "spokesman" on this forum had been more forthcoming about the odd 1 to 2000 units were going to be distributed with all of their faults said something we all would have been the wiser and made decisions on safer ground, not a minefield of mis-information. He has to learn to deliver the bad news as well as good news. and not tell porkies. Unfortunately he has to follow the Company Mantra or not get free goodies
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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mmrcnzjohn		#38 Posted : 30 October 2008 08:01:39(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 558 Location: ,		Sorry Nev while I can understand your frustration I cant see how you can be so convinced that Marklin sent them out knowingly. Luis dealer had a 50% failure rate, or a 50% acceptance rate. Did it cost Luis anything more except time to get his replaced? To me it sounds like there is a problem with some componentary. I have to believe that Marklin shipped them all at the same stage with no idea there was an issue. Simple time lines would suggest that it would take 1 to 2 weeks for the units to arrive at their destination and then a further 2-3 days for the units to be sold. The question is how many of the units had been sold before Marklin were aware of the faults. Take Lutz, nothing is wrong with his. On this board Lutz is potentially in the minority, but in terms of the first 2000 he is potentially in the majority. For all we know by the time Marklin found out there was a problem, those first 2000 units had been sold. We do not know whether Marklin asked it dealers to test the ones they still had in stock to see if there was a problem or not. The fact that your dealer in the US sent you a defective unit cannot and should not be pinned on Marklin. If you had purchased it direct from Marklin then that is a fair comment, but it is ultimately your dealer in the US who has let you down. Your dealer should be refunding your postage cost to send it to them, and paying for it to be sent back to you.
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nevw		#39 Posted : 30 October 2008 08:36:58(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mmrcnzjohn <br />Sorry Nev while I can understand your frustration I cant see how you can be so convinced that Marklin sent them out knowingly. Luis dealer had a 50% failure rate, or a 50% acceptance rate. Did it cost Luis anything more except time to get his replaced? To me it sounds like there is a problem with some componentary. I have to believe that Marklin shipped them all at the same stage with no idea there was an issue. Simple time lines would suggest that it would take 1 to 2 weeks for the units to arrive at their destination and then a further 2-3 days for the units to be sold. The question is how many of the units had been sold before Marklin were aware of the faults. Take Lutz, nothing is wrong with his. On this board Lutz is potentially in the minority, but in terms of the first 2000 he is potentially in the majority. For all we know by the time Marklin found out there was a problem, those first 2000 units had been sold. We do not know whether Marklin asked it dealers to test the ones they still had in stock to see if there was a problem or not. The fact that your dealer in the US sent you a defective unit cannot and should not be pinned on Marklin. If you had purchased it direct from Marklin then that is a fair comment, but it is ultimately your dealer in the US who has let you down. Your dealer should be refunding your postage cost to send it to them, and paying for it to be sent back to you. Sorry I cannot agree with you. AFAIK not all units left at the same time but over a period of several weeks. Units for the US Market were distributed in the US from the US Distributors Walthers on the 24th well and truly after Marklin knew of the faulty Units. and not all of the US units were above 2000. so not all of the below 2000 had been sold. MY dealer has not let me down. at all, The fault is still with MArklin as it should have never sent faulty units out for distribution. I am not going to get a replacement but refund. UNfortunately when you are not close to a dealer it takes , time, money and inconvenience to return an item for warranty repair. I will wait at least 12 months to get one, then most of the bugs may have been worked out. You say that LUTZ has a Low Serial Number unit and has no problems. Unfortunately we can only take that with a grain of salt. LUTZ will never never admit that he has a problem with any Marklin piece of equipment. He has been asked many times on the forum, if he had experienced any problems, did it have to go back to the factory for mods and the answer to the questions was complete silence. My dealer and I have a good relationship and at the moment he is bracing himself for a flood of units being returned for warranty repairs. All of which will most likely have to go back to Germany. He is not a happy chappy.
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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Bigdaddynz		#40 Posted : 30 October 2008 08:43:09(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,768 Location: New Zealand		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mmrcnzjohn <br />... but it is ultimately your dealer in the US who has let you down. Hey, what's this bagging of a fellow forum member? I'm sure Mike (plavnostruev) will have some comments to make re all of this!
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mmrcnzjohn		#41 Posted : 30 October 2008 09:52:10(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 558 Location: ,		To be fair I did not know that the dealer was a member on here. Lets see what Mike has to say. US dealers deal with Walthers who deal with Marklin Germany. So before it gets to the dealer in the US, it has been shipped twice. Maybe I am a bit simple and know nothing about trade, but it seems obvious to me that it is going to take longer to get to the dealers in the US because it is going through a distributor. Of the 2000 suspect units we know about 10 that have problems. Would you recall 2000 units on the basis that there is a problem with 10 of them? I have to believe that Marklin shipped the units in good faith unaware that there was a problem. When the problem was discovered, was it worthwhile to issue a general recall? I can understand them advising their dealers that there may be an issue and that they (Marklin) will replace the units free of charge. But to recall the entire 2000 because 50-100 of them have a problem does not make sense to me at all.
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nevw		#42 Posted : 30 October 2008 11:15:10(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: quote:Originally posted by mmrcnzjohn <br />To be fair I did not know that the dealer was a member on here. Lets see what Mike has to say. [size=2]when did you get out of nappies[red] US dealers deal with Walthers who deal with Marklin Germany. So before it gets to the dealer in the US, it has been shipped twice. Maybe I am a bit simple and know nothing about trade, but it seems obvious to me that it is going to take longer to get to the dealers in the US because it is going through a distributor. Of the 2000 suspect units we know about 10 that have problems. Would you recall 2000 units on the basis that there is a problem with 10 of them? I have to believe that Marklin shipped the units in good faith unaware that there was a problem. When the problem was discovered, was it worthwhile to issue a general recall? I can understand them advising their dealers that there may be an issue and that they (Marklin) will replace the units free of charge. But to recall the entire 2000 because 50-100 of them have a problem does not make sense to me at all. John, Grow up. Marklin NEVER Issues a General recall. Sorry John more than 50-100. marklin knew the exact number of faulty units that were dispatched. all in one batch from a subbie. Maybe DB will teach you the facts of Life on Friday. [;) On another point did you notice that your beloved Lutz has not assisted your defence ??????] therefore it is true. re the bold bit we have 10 members where who have CS2, we have 1800 members. 2 out of eight say they are Ok that is a 75% failure rate. [^][^][^][^][^][^][^][^][^]
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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mmrcnzjohn		#43 Posted : 30 October 2008 13:01:36(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 15/10/2006(UTC) Posts: 558 Location: ,		When a discussion reverts from a factual basis to an emotional basis objectivity becomes blurred. Nev you have your opinion and no matter what anyone says you will not change your opinion. There is only black, no white let alone a grey area. If you had purchased the CS II from an Australian dealer would your objectivity be the same. Would you have asked to check the serial number or just blindly taken it home? Either way in your eyes Marklin have done wrong and nothing that anyone says will change your mind.
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mascagni		#44 Posted : 30 October 2008 13:27:12(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 826 Location: Tallahassee, FL USA		It would be interesting to figure out what the real failure rate of the CS2 is. But I think that the fact that there is so much critical discussion at this point leads me to conclude that Maerklin should have either been much more thorough with quality control, or should have waited in releasing the CS2 so that the inevitable problems with items barely past the prototype stage could be contained internally. Please note that from a sales and marketing perspective, Maerklin HAD to release the CS2 at about the time it did to get it into it's product line for Christmas. However, I suspect that in reality, the bad news that we all read about here about the CS2 has discouraged people from purchasing the CS2 for Christmas 2008. Your thoughts, comments, disagreements, scorching flames?--MM
		Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
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pa-pauls		#45 Posted : 30 October 2008 13:27:49(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 08/06/2002(UTC) Posts: 1,843 Location: Norway		Exactly Someone never comes out of the kindergarden you know
		Pål Paulsen Märklin Spur 1 Digital, epoche 3
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laalves		#46 Posted : 30 October 2008 13:42:01(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 10/02/2004(UTC) Posts: 2,162 Location: Portugal		Just to establish a few facts: my CS failed and and my dealer's has the knob problem. Also, another forum member here that bought one from my dealer had problems but my dealer told me the buyer did something wrong in the update process. It may be user related. These were out of the first batch of 8, AFAIK all under S/N 2000. He has now received a batch of 6, AFAIK all above S/N 3000, and I know of no further problems. My sample is now fine and dandy, everything is working fine, except for the known and reported issues. I'm fully hoping they will be solved in the near future. As I said before, it is the best controller I have tried yet, bar the issues. Mind you that it still is an incomplete product, given that at least one of the initially announced features does not yet work: uploading loco icons into its memory.
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mascagni		#47 Posted : 30 October 2008 13:52:15(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC) Posts: 826 Location: Tallahassee, FL USA		Luis: Thanks for the information, it seems, anecdotally, that above S/N 3000 things are working. However, does that mean that there are hundreds of low S/N units that are not very reliable. Your sample seems to indicate that that might be the case.--MM
		Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
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ciric		#48 Posted : 30 October 2008 20:43:21(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 14/10/2008(UTC) Posts: 8 Location: Elvas,		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by laalves <br />Just to establish a few facts: my CS failed and and my dealer's has the knob problem. Also, another forum member here that bought one from my dealer had problems but my dealer told me the buyer did something wrong in the update process. It may be user related. These were out of the first batch of 8, AFAIK all under S/N 2000. He has now received a batch of 6, AFAIK all above S/N 3000, and I know of no further problems. My sample is now fine and dandy, everything is working fine, except for the known and reported issues. I'm fully hoping they will be solved in the near future. As I said before, it is the best controller I have tried yet, bar the issues. Mind you that it still is an incomplete product, given that at least one of the initially announced features does not yet work: uploading loco icons into its memory. hi to all Luis, the dealer is comb.. .com is not? [8)] My CS2 was repairing today for Germany [:(] I just load the program that came in cs2 backups "reset.tgz" and CS2 ran out of the TFP Track format processor [xx(] Perhaps some bug in the program or the processor, or malfunction in the electrical system, since CS2 was not until the voltage output for the lines. Before loading the backup "reset.tgz" the CS2 worked perfectly.
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nevw		#49 Posted : 31 October 2008 00:00:11(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC) Posts: 11,071 Location: Murrumba Downs QLD		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by mmrcnzjohn <br />When a discussion reverts from a factual basis to an emotional basis objectivity becomes blurred. Nev you have your opinion and no matter what anyone says you will not change your opinion. There is only black, no white let alone a grey area. If you had purchased the CS II from an Australian dealer would your objectivity be the same. Would you have asked to check the serial number or just blindly taken it home? Either way in your eyes Marklin have done wrong and nothing that anyone says will change your mind. John, Australian dealers will not be stocking the Cs2 until some time next year. one has indicated that he will not be ordering for some months. YES if I had of got one here on OZ I would have been checking the serial number before taking home. From information received the US shipment would not have any low serial numbered units but that they did. Nev
		NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders and a hose pipe on the aorta Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
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Bigdaddynz		#50 Posted : 31 October 2008 01:35:24(UTC) Retweet
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC) Posts: 18,768 Location: New Zealand		Quote: [size=1" face="Verdana" id="quote]quote:Originally posted by pa-pauls <br />Exactly Someone never comes out of the kindergarden you know Settle Pål, no need for those sorts of comments. Nev actually quite likes the CS2, but he is 'hot under the collar' because his CS2 failed after a few hours of use, and he feels that that could have been prevented through better quality control. Remember, in this part of the world we don't have Marklin dealers a few kms from where we live, like you do in Europe. Therefore anything that requires servicing usually involves expensive postage and a lot of time for issues to be resolved. Given that and Nev's recent problems with his CS1, and you can start to understand his frustrations. I'm sure you would be as upset if this had happened to you. I know I would be.
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