Sorry, only picture or really, attachment.
I try to use pictures in my topic, but it seems to be difficult.

I´ll get back with my question, or better, proposal after I have managed to get real pictures in my topic.

Jukka

Hello Jukka

I found some good help in this post:

https://www.marklin-user...e---Tips-and-tricks.aspx

I was struggling with my switching-yard and found really good help in a translated document by "Laxman" in post #18.

Take a look, there are some good tips in this post.

Regards
Nicky6

Thank You Nicky6 and Peter.

Peter, your "the contents of the list" is good start. I´ll start to read all information from Nicky6´s link, it is quite long.

This will be a very big project, and I'm going to focus on the MEMORY. I will clip many texts from here and there in this forum and ofcourse write own text also.
I hope that if somebody feels that it is not fair to copy piece of texts from various topics, it is time to say it now, PLEASE.

I start today and spend few hours per day for the work.

All ideas are welcome during this work.

By the way, is there somewhere help for easy way to get pictures into my posts. I have tried som that I yeterday foud, but for some reason I didn´t manage to get pictures, only attachement.


Thank you all

Jukka

Hello,

I am not a expert with the memory but I know some things:

In the pics that you have upload there's route A1, A2.....A8, B1....B8 etc, thas has a meaning

routes A are set and release by the first s88 module
routes B are set and realease by the 2nd s88 and so on

In each single s88 the contacts 1, 2, 3 etc sets the routes 1, 2, etc, and the contacts 9, 10, 11 etc releases the routes 1, 2, 3 accordingly..

The time between a route is set and release the route is locked, thats mean that none othe route can change any element of the route set.

One route can exist inside othe route,

A long time ago, there was some very interesting articles in magazine märklin insider, in the numbers 4/98 , 6/98, 3/99, 5/99 this magazin was edited in english, french, maybe dutch, so I think that you should look for this numbers, maybe in ebay.

Best regards

Hi amartinezv,

Just to avoid confusion , you should qualify you comments as referring to the Marklin 6043 Memory


The CS2-Memory function may be a modern variant with similar intent, but it does operate quite differently in most areas

Edited by user 14 February 2015 10:42:33(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Hi!
When you deep-link pictures from the M* product database, you will see the pictures correctly - everybody else will see just the Märklin logo ...

Yes, my comments refer to old memory 6043, there has never been much documentation about the operation of the memory, in the manuals of the new CS only mention of this function is done. I guess the operating principles are the same, although they may be different and I may be wrong.

best regards

Hi Peter,
Thank you for your post, you take up the important issue of writing.

You can see easily that people who wrote that article in Märklin magazin are not Englis spoken people. To write foreign language text is not easy if you are not used to write much.
You can see from my text that my mother language is not English. That is why I prefer to write with pictures.
I think that the difficulty of writing right kind of English text is due to the fact that Märklin don´t produce decent instructions in English languages.

The basic idea of my writing is to use you-expression as a target and self-expression as a source. This is so, because I do not know how to use the English phrases, I do not know more than a few saying in English. Keep it simple, it is my motto.

I will put one really good file in this post, it is in German. If you want to use it then you can use the google translator web page to help.

It is now morning in Finland, when I write this, Iĺl put my next version of my instruction into next post this evening.

Regards
Jukka

Ps. Peter Wrote:

When you are loged in to mu, refer to the the "My Dashboard" section at the top of the page , and then "Manage/Upload my pictures"

I still did not manage to transfer pictures, because I cannot find that "Manage/Upload my pictures" in my Dashboard. Ther are only PROFILE, LINKS and STATISTICS

I use Internet explorer 11

Hi all,

I´m really sorry for my mistype in this evenings document.

Here is corrected document.

Thank you Peter!!

I saw there was a three part series in the German version of the Marklin Magazine in issues 5/2014. 6/2014, and 1/2015 on upgrades to the Memory/Routes of the CS2. Tried using Google Translate to get them to English but that didn't work too well.

If anyone has the English version of these issues and wouldn't mind scanning them to PDFs and emailing them to me, I would appreciate it. I would like to try and understand what these updates can do.

Thanks in advance!!

Robert

Jukka,

If I may suggest a caption and "Fig xx" ref, with each image to enable succinct reference from the text anywhere in the document (not just the adjacent paragraph).

Maybe a similar glossary of the button images (like pg 14 of the http://medienpdb.maerkli.../1/pdf/60215_betrieb.pdf manual) choosing just the memory related ones, but elaborating (considerably) on each with ...
- a succinct name (again for concise reference) - e.g. "Sequence Activation Mode" button
- describing where it is located / what it relates to - e.g. On the Memory Programming pages, to the right of each row of 8 sequence buttons
- what it does - e.g. toggles between the triggering of the 8 sequences from Manual and Auto+Manual mode
- describing when to use it - e.g. to enable/disable the 8 sequences in the row for automatic S88 triggering
- indicating the section in the document where it is discussed
Note, the images can be sourced from your own CS2 library or from the install location of the CS2-PC via xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx/config/sysicons/

Extending this further, I think having specific names for pages and tabs panels would also make text references more succinct
I submit as suggestions ..
- Memory Operation Page
- Memory Programming Page
- - Sequence selection Pane
- - Sequence Builder Pane
- - Sequence Basic Settings Pane
- - Sequence Advanced Setting Dialogue

Re: ... Green button ( I don´t kno the name)
I would call this a "tick" or "check" ("check mark")

The reference to left and right clicking on the CS2-PC may be a bit confusing (for someone just looking at their own hardware CS2)
Maybe some indication like
- right click on CS2-PC-... is the same as what you see on a PC
- left click is unique to the CS2-PC and opens additional ...

I think the page2 image and panel description should be after the first paragraph on page one.
Jumping straight into dot colour meaning and manual/automatic mode description is running before you can walk.

P.S. along with the version, you might want include your name as author, and maybe acknowledgements/bibliography(especially if you are cutting from the Marklin manuals)

Jukka,

I offer my personal suggestions as tips

Tip: Preparation: Install a master switch between CS2 and layout.
The CS2 must be on (Go not Stop) for the programming of components. This can be a good feature if you are in "learn" mode where you are recording your actions in switching routes or driving a locomotive around the layout, however more often than not you do not want to upset the actual state of the layouts points and signals while you are entering or editing sequences.

Tip: Preparation: Ensure your Keyboard items are named and preferably loaded onto a layout configuration
This will facilitate setup and, more importantly, editing.

Tip: Usage: The Delete/Trash function will act on any object with a dark blue boarder
It is possible to get frustrated if you see an object that you want to delete and simply click on it and then delete.
If you haven't UN-highlighted the previous object you were working on , it will be deleted also

Tip: Awareness: Don't drag the stylus when changing locomotive speed when programming
Doing this will generate numerous intermediate commands in the sequence.
A corollary to this is that the artificial acceleration/delay settings that you may configure for a locomotive will do the same thing. The recommendation is to leave these set to 0 (except for 6080 generation decoders) and let the decoder do the acceleration for you

Tip: Suggested Practice: Name the sequence meaningfully
Personally I prefix the name with the sensor number - so I don't have to enter edit mode and select a sequence to find its details.

Tip: Suggested Practice: Printout your sequences
Especially when debugging sequences that are interacting, being able to refer to all sequences on a document is far more effective than using the screen to pop in and out of each sequence individually

The /config/fahrstrassen.cs2 file on the CS2 contains the details of your routes. It may not be the easiest to read as it is but at least it can be read. Alternatively Running the file through a spreadsheet macro or using a small App will make things a lot clearer.

Tip: Usage: The same sequence may be used for multiple locos when placed as a Fx icon
While a sequence may be built (e.g. lights on,wait,station announcement,wait,whistle,wait,go) using a specific locomotive ID, if that sequence is loaded as a FX button for a different loco then running the sequence will use that locos ID instead.

Warning. (This might be a bug) the sequence cannot be run on more than one loco at a time

Tip: Awareness: Ensure the pulse for a moment function (e.g. horn) is not too short
The Sequence programming is quite literal when you press(pulse) a momentary function for a locomotive. it sends an "on" command when you press the key and an "off" command as soon as you release the key. If you do this too quickly then the delays in the sequence may mean that this function will appear not to work when you run the sequence.

Don't be shy in holding the button down for half a second when programming

Hello again

AT this point I want to add something to Peters exellent TIP-collection.

Tip: Preparation: Install a master switch between CS2 and layout.
The CS2 must be on (Go not Stop) for the programming of components. This can be a good feature if you are in "learn" mode where you are recording your actions in switching routes or driving a locomotive around the layout, however more often than not you do not want to upset the actual state of the layouts points and signals while you are entering or editing sequences.
Do you mean that master switch like unplug the wire or somethin like that?

Tip: Awareness: Don't drag the stylus when changing locomotive speed when programming
Doing this will generate numerous intermediate commands in the sequence.
A corollary to this is that the artificial acceleration/delay settings that you may configure for a locomotive will do the same thing. The recommendation is to leave these set to 0 (except for 6080 generation decoders) and let the decoder do the acceleration for you
And remember here, that pressing the RED BUTTON is also action which wil be recorded, you can edit that recording aftewards thoug. Red knob is not recommended to rotate for increase or decrease the speed. Instead use stylus to poit exact speed on the screen.



Tip: Suggested Practice: Printout your sequences
Especially when debugging sequences that are interacting, being able to refer to all sequences on a document is far more effective than using the screen to pop in and out of each sequence individually

The /config/fahrstrassen.cs2 file on the CS2 contains the details of your routes. It may not be the easiest to read as it is but at least it can be read. Alternatively Running the file through a spreadsheet macro or using a small App will make things a lot clearer.

Printing something from CS2 is quite easy:
Connect the device to you pc one way or another, and write CS2`s address into your web-brouser, then open config tab to see what is in there. Here is example to take out the fahrstrassen.cs2

196.254.35.12/config/fahrstrassen.cs2. You can see, that my CS2 in connected via the cross-linked cable to my PC an Windows has took an privat address for this connection.

Very good Peter, We can see already now that the basic meaning of this topic is goin to right direction.

When YOU GUYS comment and ask something always our knolendge of Mysterious CS2 Memory will increase.

Jukka

Folks,
can someone explain why the Cs2 behaves like this?

I create a very simple route; start, run for 5 seconds, stop. The route looks like this:



The upper box shows I have set the sped to F403 (whatever that means...) and the lok runs for 5.5 seconds.
The lower box tells us the lok has stopped (speed = F0)

Now I want to edit the route, switching on the lok lights when it stops. I highlight the upper box, switches to "control" and pushes the "light" button. A third box appears, showing "Lights on"



Now to my question; Why has the running time in the upper box changed from 5.5 to 16 seconds?

All the best to Jukka and everybody else!
//Stefan, Östersund, Sweden

In learning mode, any object you add will cause the previous one to be updated with how long you delayed in selecting the object.
In this case by the time you got round to turning the lights on, 16 seconds had elapsed

This can be good to capture what you did, but the chances are that what you physically did (delay-wise) is not what you wanted because you were thinking through the process and having to navigate to different pages. Therefore you are more than likely going to edit the object and tweak the times

Selecting Edit Mode will curtail ALL sequences.

Be warned - if a train was in the middle of something, pending a stop or reverse command - it will just keep going

Hi, I agree with Peter. . . mainly,
but before we totally abandon the use of Memory, I put a little more philosophizing.

If we want to automate our model envinronment, we need PC with sofisticated program for steering that layout and we still need something smart to connect layout and PC. Commercial programs, which are really versatile, are build for using several brands. Therefore they are quite complicated. I have used WinDigipet and I have seen it to be very good. It is huge and it´s functions are good, but it is too complicated for me and it is quite expensive.
You have to know yourself what you want from you model railway environment and automated functions.

CS2 itself is computer and MEMORY part of it with latest software version is interesting. Not yet ready at all, but the direction is right, at least I think so. The CS2´s way of programming is ment for people who are not so good to use computers and therefore I like the idea of Marklin people.

I have seen few this kind of programming tools, for example LEGO Mindstorm EV3. It is ment for young people who are not IT-persons but will make some automatic things with computer. EV3 brick is also LINUX computer.
There programming environment is very good eventhoug it has to be installen into normal PC. I think Marklin people should look at it and look at that kind of environmet in their CS2-PC program.

Back to MEMORY programming.

I just tested timing behavior and it behaves just like Peter wrote. I think it is not problem if you use several small sequences ( only few action per sequence) for automate a part of you whole attempt "route". Make simple sequences, be avare of timing when you use CS2`s automatic learning. Study it, realise when learning will start and how to stop learning during programming.

Kedep doing and write here your experiences, ideas, questions etc.

I have seen this topic very usefull, very good observations, very good tips etc. At least I have learned much and I will continua fter short break my writings, hope some day we will see written instructions.

Thank you all for all yours comments and ideas
Have a cheerfull training

Jukka

Ok, I will try that next time, thanks!
/stefan

Hello all,

Peter wrote the right thing. I am exactly on the same line again after few hours testing the CS2. I also test CS2-PC program and now I realise that PC program is not yet ready at all.

PC program behaves in a strange way in many places while memory programming. Not always at the same way, so if you use CS2-PC, you have to be patient and carefull.

While I programmed memory sequence I couldn´t find answer to following thing, hope you can help me:

When I use EXT. conditions in triggering sequences how should I use them. I have tried to translante this German text:

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"Fahrstraßen können von einem Ereignis, dem Auslöser, in Abhängigkeit
des Zustandes weiterer Rückmeldekontakte geschaltet werden. Ein Auslöser
ist ein Ereignis, die Bedingungen sind Zustände. Bei einem Auslöser
kann ein steigendes (belegt) oder fallendes (frei) Ereignis bestimmt werden.
Bei den Bedingungen kann festgelegt werden, ob ausgelöst (belegt)
oder nicht ausgelöst (frei) sein soll."
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

This text is from latest CS2 German version manual, they have not yet translated it for English spoken people.

I don´t understand how to use this conditional way to handle triggering. I have found that condition is like OR- in the trigger-execute-command inside CS2. There should be also AND-

I hope that there is some time in near future one new condition handling in S88 triggering, which is written in the CS2;

I would like to have flag or several flags so that whe flag is up I could put this information in memory and all behaviors in memory sequences would be depend on that flag. When Flag is up then all items will work and when flag is down nothing happens in that sequence.
I have made several flags with K84, but I cannot handle the effects via memory.

It should be so that one Flag would influence as many sequences as we need at that time.


With CS2 and its memory you can do quite complicated manuvers though.

Just remember that sef-learning feature is deceptive and that naming of all over memory items is really important.
Still one thing would be very usefull: If I only could toggle from inside of sequence, MANUAL/AUTOMATIC-button by which I choose should i use S88 triggering or not in sequences in that row to which that button refers.

Iĺl see you

Regards

Jukka

I agree, but suspect the response will be rather shortsighted with the expectation that "Conditioning" will do the same job.

Hello,
Peter, The Flag is just that. I have used it for some time, but how to handle it automatically.

I have been thinking a bit further to combine flag and K84 for current handling. Cut current in certain points in yourlayout with K84 via memory sequence.


And of course you can connect contact wire to K84 and use " in a way" two lewel contact handling. This is handy, but you need expensive devices.
Sorry my English, but I think you all understand what I mean.

I will write these thinking all into my document with pictures, so everybody can see These quite complicated connections.

I´m very happy, this topic is going always for the better and better.

Jukka

Hi,
What about the condition, what are it´s effects, how to use condition(s), Trigger is quite easy to understand

Jukka

This Peter´s post is the most important part of the whole topic. I do not want to underestimate anyone other comments and / or observations.
Thank you Peter, very much.

Jukka

Hi Jukka,

Well done - I think it's a good working document you have started which summaries the memory function very well.

Brgds Lasse

Re:
Here is picture 3: inside of item BR94 53:

Suggest rephrasing to something like ...

The individual parameters of a "Route Element" shown in the sequence builder window may be accessed and edited by pressing and holding the "Route Element" icon for for a couple of seconds.
- Picture 3 shows the "Edit Route Element" window for the first Route Element ("BR94 53") seen in Picture 2
- Picture 4 shows the "Edit Route Element" window for the second Route Element ("8/2 K84") seen in Picture 2