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Offline Janne75  
#1 Posted : 08 January 2015 20:15:53(UTC)
Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Hi all,

I got today a phone call from my fellow Märklinist who only collects analog Märklin trains. He had won in auction this train set 28590 SNCF "Le Capitole" and wants to get it as analog. He offered me a swap of his 28590 loco to my 3165 SNCF BB 9280. We will change the loco bodys and also grey plastic parts near the wheels as in his opinion those plastic parts are lighter grey color in 28590 than in 3165 or 3038 which have same color parts. In my Koll's 2012 compact catalog there reads it has fx decoder and I think it's without sound(s). Only lights are controllable and acceleration/braking delay can be controlled.

I assume it has a "normal" fx decoder with programmable acceleration and braking delay, top speed and digital address. I also assume it has 5-pole DCM motor and LED lights. I haven't seen it's technic yet and it would be great to know these details about it's technic.

I think it's a good deal to get a factory digital technic even if it's fx decoder and 5-pole DCM and give him analog 3165 technic. Cool I was going to digitalise my 3165 soon anyway... This is very easy "conversion". Wink RollEyes

Regards,
Janne

EDIT: This "28590 version" had wrong type of motor installed = 3-pole analog DCM and old 6080 "mousepiano" decoder. It was not original and we did not swap the technics... ThumbDown

Edited by user 09 January 2015 16:53:58(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Janne75
Offline foumaro  
#2 Posted : 08 January 2015 20:49:35(UTC)
foumaro

Greece   
Joined: 08/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 4,420
Location: Attiki Athens Greece
I have the 28590 set,it is perfect.The locomotive have a simple decoder and it is possible to control lights and it have the trusty five pole motor.Very good runner,the pulling power is great.No problem at all with this perfect locomotive.LOL ThumpUp
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Offline Janne75  
#3 Posted : 08 January 2015 21:05:53(UTC)
Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Thanks, good to know this ThumpUp .
Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
Offline jvuye  
#4 Posted : 08 January 2015 22:42:59(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,881
Location: South Western France
Originally Posted by: Janne75 Go to Quoted Post
Thanks, good to know this ThumpUp .


Yes I can confirm!
Good old technology.
Our model RR club owns that set.
During the open season it runs on and on for 5 hours/day, 6 days a week for 4 months...2014 was teh second year of operation.
Only brushes and traction tires have been changed (completely normal!) and the train it pulls is 10 coaches long.
Go for it! ((-;
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
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Offline Janne75  
#5 Posted : 09 January 2015 03:27:12(UTC)
Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Originally Posted by: jvuye Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Janne75 Go to Quoted Post
Thanks, good to know this ThumpUp .


Yes I can confirm!
Good old technology.
Our model RR club owns that set.
During the open season it runs on and on for 5 hours/day, 6 days a week for 4 months...2014 was teh second year of operation.
Only brushes and traction tires have been changed (completely normal!) and the train it pulls is 10 coaches long.
Go for it! ((-;


Thanks for information. It seems to be a very reliable and good loco. Good old DCM 5-pole motor can do miracles BigGrin .
Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
Offline RayF  
#6 Posted : 09 January 2015 10:15:07(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,838
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
I ask myself why your "analogue friend" didn't just operate the loco from the set in analogue mode and avoid all the hassle of the loco swap?
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by RayF
Offline cookee_nz  
#7 Posted : 09 January 2015 10:36:33(UTC)
cookee_nz

New Zealand   
Joined: 31/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 3,949
Location: Paremata, Wellington
Originally Posted by: Janne75 Go to Quoted Post
Hi all,

I got today a phone call from my fellow Märklinist who only collects analog Märklin trains. He had won in auction this train set 28590 SNCF "Le Capitole" and wants to get it as analog. He offered me a swap of his 28590 loco to my 3165 SNCF BB 9280. We will change the loco bodys and also grey plastic parts near the wheels as in his opinion those plastic parts are lighter grey color in 28590 than in 3165 or 3038 which have same color parts. In my Koll's 2012 compact catalog there reads it has fx decoder and I think it's without sound(s). Only lights are controllable and acceleration/braking delay can be controlled.

I assume it has a "normal" fx decoder with programmable acceleration and braking delay, top speed and digital address. I also assume it has 5-pole DCM motor and LED lights. I haven't seen it's technic yet and it would be great to know these details about it's technic.

I think it's a good deal to get a factory digital technic even if it's fx decoder and 5-pole DCM and give him analog 3165 technic. Cool I was going to digitalise my 3165 soon anyway... This is very easy "conversion". Wink RollEyes

Regards,
Janne


Hi Janne,

Sounds like a win-win all round. But, how critical do you and your friend want to be about colours? (he says with a grin)...

I have original parts sheets for the 3038, 3059 & 3165 and they paint an interesting picture

The two parts concerned are;
Drehgestellrahman - the plastic Bogie housings (with simulated bearings, brakes etc)
Kessel - Tank / Boiler

3038 - (1967 & 1973)
Drehgestellrahman = 21757
Kessel = 21759

3038/3165 - (1983)
3038 Drehgestellrahman = 21757
3165 Drehgestellrahman = 24567
Both - Kessel = 24566

3038 - (Marklin.de - current)
Drehgestellrahman = 217570
Kessel = 217590

3059 - (1969) - * no listing on Marklin.de
Drehgestellrahman = 21757
Kessel = 21759

3165 - (Marklin.de - current)
Drehgestellrahman = 245670
Kessel = 245660

28590- (Marklin.de - current)
Drehgestellblende = 217570
Kessel = 217590

So as you can see from the listings, 3038, 3059 and 28590 share the same bogie housing part no 21757 or 217570 , but the 3165 one is different with a unique number, 245670.

3038 = 21757
3059 = 21757
3165 = 245670 (old nr 24567)
28590 = 217570 (Drehgestellblende)

Yet the Tank also seems different. On the the 3038 & 3165 they have the same part, but a different one on the two Le Capitoles
3038 = 24566
3165 = 245660
3059 = 21759
28590 = 217590

So is it colour or some other difference? Or indeed, a printing error on the parts sheets?

I got my two Le Capitoles, my 3038 & 3165 together for comparison.

The 3038 and 3165 are a darker grey than the two 3059's. The two darker ones appear to be the same as each other and the lighter 3059's appear to be the same as each other.

My pick is a printing error, but the only way to confirm for sure would be to order the parts and see what turns up.

Yeah?, Nah.

Flapper
Cookee
Wellington
NZ image
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Offline Janne75  
#8 Posted : 09 January 2015 16:45:14(UTC)
Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
I ask myself why your "analogue friend" didn't just operate the loco from the set in analogue mode and avoid all the hassle of the loco swap?


Hi Ray, all,

My friend wants to have good old reversing unit if possible. He only collect Märklin and test them on "rollerstand", but never runs his locos on a layout etc.... Blink I went today to his place and we were going to do the swap of the loco technics..... BUT:

As my friend has no interest in digital technic he had not understand some things why we did NOT swap these locos:

1. It was a private auction from France about this "mint" 28590 set. BUT it was externally like new inside there was a normal 3-pole DCM analog motor and old "mousepiano" Märklin 6080 digital decoder... Cursing Angry My friend paid with PayPal and I said he could get some money back as it wasn´t like it should be, but he is not going to ask any money back... he don´t run this loco anyway as he only displays it in his vitrines etc. Blink

2. This 28590 has darkened wheels (someone had installed only older motor and decoder in this one as it had still led lights etc). MY 3038 and 3165 has black wheel sides and shiny "chromed" wheels. The original old 3059 has also different wheels than this 28590.

3. Like "Cookee" writed in his very detailed previous posting there are many other differences.

So it was too good to be true and I kept my analog like new 3165 technic (with nowadays ball bearings in it´s DCM 3-pole motor) and he kept his "28590". It was not so nice to find this out in his place as I was going to get a new or like new loco technic with fx decoder and DCM 5-pole motored (with permanent magnet). This was not obviously one of my best days... ThumbDown I will digitalise my 3165 myself later ThumpUp .

Regards,
Janne
Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Janne75
Offline RayF  
#9 Posted : 09 January 2015 19:26:44(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,838
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Hi Janne,

Sorry to hear about the disappointment around this loco.

I digitised my 3038 with a delta decoder from another loco, but I will probably eventually swap this for a proper 5 pole 6094x conversion like I did recently on my 3040 E40.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by RayF
Offline Janne75  
#10 Posted : 09 January 2015 22:38:38(UTC)
Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Hi Ray,

My 3165 waits also for a proper 5-pole DCM motor/decoder set 6094x or 60760.

Today I installed LED front light in my 3038. It has 6090 decoder that is a little damaged. It only feeds continuosly without control other light output (grey wire) and the other light output (yellow wire) has no function at all. I grounded this LED front light to the "secret" soldering point on the decoder PCB near the red wire (+ to current pick-up shoe) to get flickering free light. It's not a big deal that the front light is continuosly on in both driving directions.

My Märklin fellow saw today for the very first time a DCM motor with ball bearings and he liked the way I had done this modification to my 3165 technic.

My favorite model from these locos is the 3038 as I really like it's color ThumpUp .

Regards,
Janne
Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Janne75
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