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Offline Nielsenr  
#1 Posted : 31 August 2014 20:11:36(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
As many of you may know, I have acquired a number of MTH 3 rail locos. And I also acquired some MTH freight cars that come with Kadee style couplers. I am going to get some Kadee couplers to put on the locos but I have been trying to find some Marklin style couplers to replace the Kadee stylle coupler on the at least one of the MTH frieght cars to create a "conversion" car. Has anyone found such a coupler? And btw, I am aware of the other differences between 2 rail cars and 3 rail cars, such as non-cunducting wheels, etc ....

Also, since some of the MTH locos are passenger locos, I will probably be looking for some 2 rail passenger car sets to convert to 3 rail. What have others done to convert 2 rail passenger cars to 3 rail? Are there current conducting couplers that will fit into a Kadee style coupler pocket? I guess one solution would be to use some small connectors between cars to pass power between cars. Any ideas would be appreciated.

Thanks!!

Robert
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Offline blid  
#2 Posted : 31 August 2014 22:33:40(UTC)
blid

Sweden   
Joined: 02/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 228
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
I have tried Marklin 3-rail wheels on a MTH freight car. The axels were too short. I have also tested a Kadee coupler in the NEM pocket of an MTH engine. The coupler was what Marklin sends along with Trix items for the American market. Don’t know if it is a #17. It was too high for the MTH car.

Bjorn
OneGauge Marklin and MTH, ESU ECoS 2.1 on LGB tracks. MTH 3-rail 0-gauge, DCS on GarGraves tracks. Z: Rokuhan tracks, analog or DCC+TC Gold.
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Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#3 Posted : 01 September 2014 04:13:47(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,861
Location: CA, USA
Hi Robert, I'd assume these all have NEM coupler sockets, so the Marklin couplers should pop right in. The height could be an issue, but I'd be surprised if MTH wasn't using the NEM specs on both the engines and cars?
SBB Era 2-5
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Offline blid  
#4 Posted : 01 September 2014 11:43:29(UTC)
blid

Sweden   
Joined: 02/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 228
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Hi,
I didn’t find this picture yesterday. If the car has a Kadee pocket,
a coupler of the” Underset shank type” might do the trick.


Regards,
Bjorn
blid attached the following image(s):
P1030284.JPG
OneGauge Marklin and MTH, ESU ECoS 2.1 on LGB tracks. MTH 3-rail 0-gauge, DCS on GarGraves tracks. Z: Rokuhan tracks, analog or DCC+TC Gold.
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Offline Nielsenr  
#5 Posted : 02 September 2014 03:54:52(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
As an update, I acquired some Kadee #18 couplers and have some #17 couplers on the way. This afternoon I took one of my MTH GP 35s and installed the Kadee coupler. It seems to connect to my MTH freight cars ok. I then took a Marklin US tank car and installed a Kadee coupler and it too seemed to connect ok with the MTH freight car. Tonight I ran them on my test layout in the garage and it all worked well. I will now have to try my other MTH locos and see if they work also.

I also took the axles/wheels off a Marklin freight car and put them in the MTH freight car. That wasn't as successful. Something is not right. I will have to get my calipers out and check the dimensions between the two sets. Maybe the Marklin axle is a smaller diameter than the MTH axle.

Robert
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Offline sudhir36  
#6 Posted : 02 September 2014 04:51:01(UTC)
sudhir36

United States   
Joined: 06/01/2011(UTC)
Posts: 93
Location: Richmond
Hello Robert,

I asked several MTH dealers if it was possible to use MTH freight cars on Marklin 3-rail by changing the wheel sets. Most of them either didn't know or haven't tried as of yet!!!

If you could find a way to put wheel sets from Marklin freight car to a MTH freight car, please let me know. I would like to experiment too!!! Count me in..........

Nakul
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Online H0  
#7 Posted : 02 September 2014 07:40:02(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,251
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: sudhir36 Go to Quoted Post
If you could find a way to put wheel sets from Marklin freight car to a MTH freight car, please let me know.
Märklin, MTH, Roco, Fleischmann, Piko, ... - there are many ways to get "AC" wheelsets of different sizes.
I think the calliper is the way to go.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#8 Posted : 02 September 2014 07:54:57(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,861
Location: CA, USA
I may be wrong, but I think the Marklin wheelsets have a slightly different gap between the wheels. Jacques has mentioned this elsewhere, and I have found the same issue on other rolling stock. A quick reqauge and they run fine on Marklin track. (don't have specs handy as its been a few years- sorry!)
SBB Era 2-5
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Online H0  
#9 Posted : 02 September 2014 08:03:15(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,251
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: 5HorizonsRR Go to Quoted Post
I may be wrong, but I think the Marklin wheelsets have a slightly different gap between the wheels.
"AC" wheelsets usually have larger flanges and a different spacing and they conduct electricity.
Sometimes it is enough to adjust the spacing to prevent cars from derailing. Silver paint can be used to achieve conductivity if needed for contact tracks. The flanges will remain small and may lead to wobbly driving over turnouts though.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline jvuye  
#10 Posted : 02 September 2014 09:18:55(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,881
Location: South Western France
Hi all!

The endless conversation on wheel specs and compatibilities!

On Märklin track 13.8 mm between the inside of the flanges is the norm, 14.2 for so called 2-rail track.
However, on C-track I have noted that 14.0 mm will do the job too without any trouble.
Best yet: I just recently bought 20 Athearn (RP25 axles) UP 40' livestock cars and they rolled **perfectly** ThumpUp Smile on my C-track layout *as is* !

So the key here is: try them first , wheel change is not always required on cars and coaches (in fact it's often the opposite!!)
But if they derail, time to look for alternatives.

Regauging is the first thing to try. I use this handy tool from Fohrmann:
http://www.fohrmann-werk...urmass-lehre-fur-h0.html

Just make sure the wheels are placed symetrically along the axle (the stub on the outside should be the same length)

This little tool has saved me many $$ and headaches Cursing , just re-using and re-gauging the original wheels!

As Tom says, contrary to two rails vehicles, Marklin wheel are *not* insulated.

Unless you use some kind of track detection system that requires all the axles of the train to be conductive, you shouldn't worry about it.

But if you do, there is an alternative: replacing the insulating plastic spacer on the insulated wheel(s) with a brass insert.

A for Kadee Coupler, I always carry a stock of # 17, 18 and 19 Kadees so I am ready to convert the various NME 362 spec'd vehicles

FYI: All of my US style rolling stock (including Märklin) is progressively migrated to Kadee couplers...the choice of solutions they offer is so wide , there is virtually always a solution....but that would be worth a totally separate topic!!

Hope this helps



Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
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Offline Nielsenr  
#11 Posted : 03 September 2014 06:24:47(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Thanks for every ones' comments. I was aware of the flange dimension differences. The one MTH freight car that I did run around the test layout did perform well. Now I need to just find where I stored my caliper.

I did do a conductive test on the MTH axle/wheel assembly. One wheel is isolated with an insulated bushing. I found some Busch conductive paint and applied it around the insulated bushing. If I remember, I wasn't too happy with the product the last time I used it. We will check it tomorrow after the paint has dried.

Robert
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Offline blid  
#12 Posted : 10 September 2014 12:58:09(UTC)
blid

Sweden   
Joined: 02/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 228
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
I have some photos of an MTH GP-35 and a Maklin 3-bay hopper with original couplers and Kadee #17 on R1 track. I also include Pictures of an MTH 2-rail 2-bay hopper. On the last Picture the differens of flanges realy shows.

Bjorn
blid attached the following image(s):
P1030304 M Top.jpg
P1030306 K Top.jpg
P1030307 K Side.jpg
P1030308 2-rail Top.jpg
P1030310 2-Rail Side.jpg
P1030311 2-rail 3-rail Side.jpg
OneGauge Marklin and MTH, ESU ECoS 2.1 on LGB tracks. MTH 3-rail 0-gauge, DCS on GarGraves tracks. Z: Rokuhan tracks, analog or DCC+TC Gold.
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Offline Nielsenr  
#13 Posted : 15 September 2014 07:26:38(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 883
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
I have been rather busy so I have not had time to post an update until now.

The conductive paint seemed to work. I measured the resistance and it was around 300 ohms. I was concerned this was too much for the S88 module. But I hooked things up yesterday and sure enough, the contact tracks worked through the conductive paint!!

I also finally found my inexpensive digital calipers and compared the Marklin wheel sets to the MTH freight car wheel sets. The dimensions are in inches:


MTH Marklin

Axle Length 1.007 .076

Axle Diameter .096 .076

Wheel Diameter .379 .378

Flange Diameter .428 .482

Robert
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