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Offline H0  
#1 Posted : 31 August 2014 10:13:46(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
On July 31, 2014, bundesanzeiger.de published a “Konzernlagebericht” about the financial situation of the Märklin Holding in 2012. The report is dated May 13, 2013 and bears the name Michael Pluta.
While the key facts about 2012 are already known for a while, the report still reveals a few interesting details.
To see the report, go to bundesanzeiger.de, enter “märklin” into the search field and select the report published “31.07.2014”. You have to pass a Captcha, therefore I cannot link to the document directly. The report is in German, but some browsers integrate a translator.

Sales reached 107.0 M€ in 2012 (108.8 M€ in 2011).
The EBIT was 10.8 M€ (12.4 M€ in 2011). Reasons given in the report are lower profit margins in new distribution channels, higher prices for purchases from China, and higher prices for material (electronics, nickel silver).

As markets are changing, they try to sell more in department stores and toy shops.

They critically observe the development of labour costs in China. In 2012 they again reduced the co-operation with suppliers in China.

They write that development and production of premium models will remain primarily at Göppingen, while core production will remain at Hungary. In the medium term (“mittelfristig”), further product lines will be transferred from China to Europe.

The appendix indicates the sales by brand:
Märklin 86,387 T€ (87,678 T€ in 2011)
Trix 10,326 T€ (8,673 T€ in 2011)
LGB 8,274 T€ (8,184 T€ in 2011)
Total 106,956 T€ (108,771 T€) [list above is not complete]
Stefan Löbich announced this on Märklin TV already: Trix and LGB grew, but Märklin did not.



And now some figures compiled from several documents found at bundesanzeiger.de and from older issues of Eisenbahn-Journal.


Märklin sales per year (note that sums for 2000 and earlier are Deutsche Mark, but Euro values are also given (own calculation))
1998: 300.4 Mio. DM - EJ 12/1999, page 92
1999: 318.7 Mio. DM, +6.4% - EJ 12/2000, page 71
2000: 288.1 Mio. DM, -9.9%, "red figures" (loss) at Märklin - EJ 12/2001, page 57
=> Converted to Mio. Euro: 147.30 (2000), 163.46 (1999), 153.59 (1998)
2001: 163.9 Mio. Euro - EJ 12/2002, page 4
2002: 170.461 Mio. Euro, +4% - EJ 01/2004, page 54
2003: 164.4 Mio. Euro - EJ 12/2004, page 57
2004: 148.539 Mio. Euro
2005: 122.978 Mio. Euro, Märklin 97.6 Mio. Euro (2004: 125.1 Mio. Euro), Trix 15.6 Mio. Euro (2004: 17.9 Mio. Euro)
2006: 123.827 Mio. Euro
2007: 125.398 Mio. Euro
2008: 128.3 Mio. Euro
2009: 111.2 Mio. Euro
2010: 105.7 Mio. Euro, EBIT 10.1 Mio. Euro, +2 Mio. Euro
2011: 108.77 Mio Euro, +1,64%, EBIT 12.36 Mio. Euro, +12.6%
2012: 107.0 Mio. Euro - Bundesanzeiger.de, 31.07.2014
2013: 105 Mio. Euro - http://www.stuttgarter-n...a-8a7b-27b4eeca486d.html
2014: So far we only know that pre-orders in Q1/2014 were “a single-digit percent value” lower than pre-orders in Q1/2013.


Märklin work force
Some sources give the values for December 31st of that year, some sources give the average for that year, some sources are not qualified.
2001: 2423 (GP 1381, N 114, So 401, Märklin Hungary 484, distribution 43) (as of December 31st)
2002: 2408 (GP 1377, N 111, So 348, Märklin Hungary 529, distribution 43) (as of December 31st)
2003: 2112 (GP 1232, N 74, So 326, Märklin Hungary 437, distribution 43) (as of December 31st)
2004: 1929 (average of that year)
2004: 1493 (GP 797, N 68, So 243, Märklin Hungary 352, distribution 33) (as of December 31st)
2005: 1431 (average of that year)
2005: 1379 (GP 705, N 65, So 232, Märklin Hungary 344, distribution 33) (as of December 31st)
2006: 1339 (average of that year)
2007: 1252 (average of that year)
2008: 1141 (average of that year)
2009: 944 (average of that year)
2010: 984 (average of that year)
2011: 998 (average of that year)
2012: 1025 (average of that year)
2013: ? (GP 480, Märklin Hungary 600) - Stuttgarter Nachrichten (link given with the sales figures)
Legend: GP = Göppingen, N = Nuremberg, So = Sonneberg


So far for the facts.
And now for something completely different: if you care to read some of my conclusions and personal reflections feel free to press the Spoiler button.
Warning: Happy Märklin users who want to keep their sweet dreams should not press the Spoiler button.


Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline RayF  
#2 Posted : 31 August 2014 11:03:05(UTC)
RayF

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Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Thanks Tom. All good information!

I agree with most of your conclusions too.

I think it's inevitable that the model railway industry will continue to shrink as it becomes less relevant to today's children. I hope that Marklin survives for as long as possible, though it can't be guaranteed in a world where the train set is no longer top of most children's Christmas list. Those of us adults who remember our trains from our childhood with nostalgia will continue to support Marklin and other brands until we become extinct.

The "China problem" is common to many companies these days. Many were lured into taking their production to the Far East by low wages and costs, but as those markets continue to thrive the costs will get closer to those at home, making it uneconomical. The same will probably happen with factories in Eastern Europe.

Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline H0  
#3 Posted : 31 August 2014 16:27:09(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Many were lured into taking their production to the Far East by low wages and costs, but as those markets continue to thrive the costs will get closer to those at home, making it uneconomical.
There also were some teething problems with products from Far East coming late or in poor quality, leading to delayed shipping of products.
Products that don't get shipped in the year of announcement bind hobby budgets and lead to lower sales in that year.

IIRC they had a high availability in 1999 and also high sales. Availability was lower in 1998 and 2000.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Goofy  
#4 Posted : 31 August 2014 16:57:51(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,985
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Thanks Tom. All good information!

I agree with most of your conclusions too.

I think it's inevitable that the model railway industry will continue to shrink as it becomes less relevant to today's children. I hope that Marklin survives for as long as possible, though it can't be guaranteed in a world where the train set is no longer top of most children's Christmas list. Those of us adults who remember our trains from our childhood with nostalgia will continue to support Marklin and other brands until we become extinct.

The "China problem" is common to many companies these days. Many were lured into taking their production to the Far East by low wages and costs, but as those markets continue to thrive the costs will get closer to those at home, making it uneconomical. The same will probably happen with factories in Eastern Europe.



Crap ****!
It has been lot of new manefacture which are producing three rail locomotivs and wagons too since 15 years.
No wonder why Märklin loss three rail market.
Just in Scandinavian,swedish customer are not interested of german locomotivs anymore,since there is lot swedish models to choise for three rail system instead.
It´s not relevant to Children.
The biggest market of train models are middle aged men with money.

H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline RayF  
#5 Posted : 31 August 2014 18:53:15(UTC)
RayF

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Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
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Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Those middle aged men with money will be dead in a few short years. I know, I'm one of them. The younger generation don't have the same legacy of toy trains we had. They will probably collect old computer games when they're 50.

The loss of sales is not unique to Marklin. I'm sure Roco, Fleischmann, Liliput, Rivarossi, Lima, etc. will all agree with that.

Nevertheless, you are welcome to your own opinion, and I am welcome to mine, so please use language which does not involve the word "Crap"!
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline Goofy  
#6 Posted : 31 August 2014 19:30:35(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,985
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Those middle aged men with money will be dead in a few short years. I know, I'm one of them. The younger generation don't have the same legacy of toy trains we had. They will probably collect old computer games when they're 50.

The loss of sales is not unique to Marklin. I'm sure Roco, Fleischmann, Liliput, Rivarossi, Lima, etc. will all agree with that.

Nevertheless, you are welcome to your own opinion, and I am welcome to mine, so please use language which does not involve the word "Crap"!


Producer of the two rail have same problem.
We discuss right now about Märklin and three rail.
Just in case to keep in the mind...for past 15 years it has become more manefacture which are produce three rail models too.
Yours attitude is wrong Ray!

H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline RayF  
#7 Posted : 31 August 2014 22:35:26(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
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Posts: 15,837
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Ok, your theory is that Märklin are doing worse because there are more manufacturers making models for 3 rail. It might have a small effect, but I doubt it is the main cause. The larger manufacturers like Roco have been making 3 rail for years, and the smaller companies are very specialised.

So the problem is with my attitude, is it? Well, I'm not the one who calls others "fool" and what they write "crap".

There's just no way to have a decent conversation with you is there?
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline H0  
#8 Posted : 31 August 2014 23:54:57(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
Märklin make three-rail products in H0 scale.
They also make two-rail products in various scales (Z, N, H0, 1, 2m) using three different brands (Märklin, Minitrix, Trix, LGB).

Around 2008/2009 they tried to grow in the two-rail H0 market with uncompromised full-length models (only announced were bay S 3/6 and ICE 1, they made TRAXX (BR 185.2), RAm, BR 120.1, BR E 19.0/119, ET 56). So far they only used the TRAXX mould for three-rail models - with a delay of five years.

Eisenbahn-Journal wrote in 12/2004: "Kaum ein Märklin-Modell der letzten zehn Jahre fand in den Tests der Fachzeitschriften ungeteilten Beifall. Warum? Nicht, weil Märklin-Prügeln „in“ ist. Sondern wegen vermeidbarer Schlampereien wie Elektrolaternen an Epoche-I-Loks und ähnlichem. Oder ganz einfach, weil es andere Firmen besser machen."

Hand-optimized Google translation: "Hardly a Märklin model of the past decade found in the tests of MRR magazines unanimous approval. Why? Not because Märklin-bashing is "in". But because of avoidable sloppiness such as electric lanterns on era I locomotives and the like. Or simply because other companies make it better."
The author of these lines signed with "Wechselstromfahrer seit 40 Jahren" => three-rail user since 40 years.

Now we have 2014 and Märklin is still famous for avoidable sloppiness (aka Märklinisms). And some of the new Trix moulds were very sloppy - like the new RAm or the ET 56.

Long story short: Märklin are strong in three-rail H0 and tried to grow in two-rail H0. Other companies produce primarily for two-rail H0, but with little modifications they can make additional profits with three-rail H0.

Another Märklin problem: CEOs come and go, master plans come and go, strategies come and go.
They need continuity. I guess with Sieber and Bächle there will be continuity for years now. I'm afraid they are heading in the wrong direction, so continuity could do harm this time. But I do not have inside information and so I just have to watch how Märklin will develop.


Back in 1996, Märklin already spake about 360 mm pieces of C track. It didn't take long and already in 2011 they appeared in the catalogue. So just give them time to work it out.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline sjlauritsen  
#9 Posted : 01 September 2014 07:38:27(UTC)
sjlauritsen

Denmark   
Joined: 18/08/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,081
Location: Denmark
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Around 2008/2009 they tried to grow in the two-rail H0 market with uncompromised full-length models (only announced were bay S 3/6 and ICE 1, they made TRAXX (BR 185.2), RAm, BR 120.1, BR E 19.0/119, ET 56). So far they only used the TRAXX mould for three-rail models - with a delay of five years.

It is my impression that this idea died with the insolvency. I do not consider Trix an "uncompromised product" anymore. I was very excited about some of the new models they announced back then, the TRAXX, the class 120, the ICE and the dostos. Unfortunately, as you mention, only a few arrived. I am very happy with my TRAXX models though.

The main issue with Trix I think, is the fact that they try and make it a "2-rail Märklin". I think it scares some potential customers away.

Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Back in 1996, Märklin already spake about 360 mm pieces of C track. It didn't take long and already in 2011 they appeared in the catalogue. So just give them time to work it out.

I guess this means that I will get my Trix C-track DKW just in time before the Sun explodes... Wink
Søren from Denmark
Blog: https://railway.zone/ | Danish Model Railway Forum: https://baneforum.dk/
Offline H0  
#10 Posted : 01 September 2014 07:58:28(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: sjlauritsen Go to Quoted Post
I do not consider Trix an "uncompromised product" anymore.
As I wrote: CEOs come and go, masterplans come and go.
That masterplan is long gone.
The models that came added to the bad reputation of Trix. MRR magazines showed how to improve the RAm (using Roco truck frames was one point) and the ET 56.

The current propulsion strategy of Märklin and Trix didn't improve Trix's reputation amongst two-rail users.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Goofy  
#11 Posted : 01 September 2014 09:26:56(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,985
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Ok, your theory is that Märklin are doing worse because there are more manufacturers making models for 3 rail. It might have a small effect, but I doubt it is the main cause. The larger manufacturers like Roco have been making 3 rail for years, and the smaller companies are very specialised.

So the problem is with my attitude, is it? Well, I'm not the one who calls others "fool" and what they write "crap".

There's just no way to have a decent conversation with you is there?


Right now you fool! Angry
In past 15 years there has been happens lot of model railway by produce train models.
Also accessorios like Viessmann produce very nice street lighting and slow motion semaphore,which did makes sucess!
Märklin did keep on by produced old semaphore and very ugly street lighting and result...Märklin loss.
It´s the fact that counts!
Yes Ray...yours attitude about "relevant to children" was stupid writed.
Even Roco of today are produce almost all locomotivs for three rail too.
That is big difference from 15 years ago.
Also Brawa offer to customer three rail locomotivs and theirs new model V100 has fan motor installed and very nice telex couple.
I believe it will become sucess in both 2 and 3 rail.
Let´s see if Märklin can sell V100 with 3 pole crap motor and mfx decoder... Flapper

H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#12 Posted : 01 September 2014 11:34:38(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
'Fool', 'Stupid', 'Crap'! Those are pretty harsh words to be using Goofy. Please desist from doing that. I'm sure you can make your point without using those terms.
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Offline steventrain  
#13 Posted : 01 September 2014 16:07:05(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
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Posts: 31,594
Location: United Kingdom
I hope Marklin must push more production to make turnover/profits rise.
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
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H0
Offline H0  
#14 Posted : 01 September 2014 16:59:13(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
Märklin gave up "pushing" last year: lowering prices to make items irresistible for bargain hunters to reach their turnover goals.

Now they have to "pull" customers into the shops by making irresistible products with good quality, fine details, and good motors for affordable prices.

They also try to find new customers by using new distribution channels (with lower profit rates) and new marketing (MyWorld and MyWorld Club, StartUp and StartUp Club, Märklin Insider Club).
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline RayF  
#15 Posted : 01 September 2014 21:04:48(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,837
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Sounds like a plan! ThumpUp
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline Goofy  
#16 Posted : 02 September 2014 12:31:44(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,985
No it´s not good plan.
There is still a problem...competitors.
That´s way Märklin loss money in model rail market.
And besides...what has children to do with the competitiors!?
For past 20 years it has been only plummeted down for Märklin.
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#17 Posted : 02 September 2014 12:39:09(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
Here's a thought Goofy! What are you personally doing to help Märklin's financial position?

Have you purchased any new Märklin locos this year, or are you just sitting on the sidelines waiting for Märklin to go bust? What is your solution to the problem, and what are you going to do about it?
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Offline H0  
#18 Posted : 02 September 2014 14:07:55(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Goofy Go to Quoted Post
No it´s not good plan.
It's an old "game": companies decide what they offer for sale, customers decide which company gets their money.

Märklin is a shrinking company in a shrinking market. Other MRR companies also had problems with losses and bankruptcies. AFAIK Märklin is still the market leader.

CEOs decide the strategy. CEOs check the order books every day. CEOs may revise their strategy from time to time.

Märklin have to reduce the average age of their customer base. Children are the future - not just for Märklin, not just for the MRR industry, but for the world.


Do you have any ideas what Märklin could do better in the future?
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline H0  
#19 Posted : 02 September 2014 14:18:45(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
Have you purchased any new Märklin locos this year, or are you just sitting on the sidelines waiting for Märklin to go bust?
This year I ordered 0 new Märklin locos and 1 new Trix loco. I'm not waiting for them to go bust, I don't hope they go bust.

Months ago I wrote to CEO Sieber and CEO Bächle what I think about their strategy and why they lose my money. I can't help 'em with my money as long as they do not sell items that appeal to me.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline biedmatt  
#20 Posted : 02 September 2014 14:24:08(UTC)
biedmatt

United States   
Joined: 09/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,343
Location: Southwest Ohio
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post


Do you have any ideas what Märklin could do better in the future?


The 64 thousand dollar question. Honestly, I think it is doomed. Not just Marklin, but model railroading in general. I see model railroading reverting back to what we had here in the US in the 30s and 40s, mostly small maker kits and lots of scratchbuilding for those who carry the torch. There are people much more knowledgable than I running these companies and they have not found an answer. The survival of their company depends on what they will do, that they are still shrinking suggests to me there is no good answer. The toy/hobby market has moved on. Just as the tin ships from the Edwardian period faded into obscurity, so will model railroading. I think the best they can do now is provide the service their current customer base wants so they can keep who they have happy. An unfortunate situation to be in if you are a manufacturer. Hopefully they can be profitable enough to keep the show going. In the end, the only assets you will have will be those that will transfer to other manufacturing processes. Your tooling and intellectual property will be worth very little. I hate to be a downer, but recent history suggests this is the direction the hobby will go.
Matt
Era 3
DB lokos, coaches and freight cars from across Europe
But I do have the obligatory (six) SBB Krocs
ECoS 50200, all FX and MFX decoders replaced with ESU V4s, operated in DCC-RailCom+ with ABC brake control.
With the exception of the passenger wagens with Marklin current conducting couplers, all close couplers have been replaced with Roco 40397.
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Offline Goofy  
#21 Posted : 02 September 2014 17:41:50(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,985
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
Here's a thought Goofy! What are you personally doing to help Märklin's financial position?

Have you purchased any new Märklin locos this year, or are you just sitting on the sidelines waiting for Märklin to go bust? What is your solution to the problem, and what are you going to do about it?


Did you stand same question to other customer which also buys others manefacture who produce three rail locomotivs too!?
Yes...i did bought an Märklin BR64,but already after 15 minutes locomotiv do react strange in the speed up when the sound is on.
My locomotiv is now at Märklin factory to repair under warranty.
What you know David,you don´t know! Cursing
And you also stand unfair questions,since it´s competitors which are problems for Märklin.

H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#22 Posted : 02 September 2014 18:38:52(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
To be honest Goofy, I don't really care too much about the other MRR companies - I don't very often purchase any of their products (KM1 1 Gauge locomotives not withstanding). In this thread we are talking about the financial performance of Marklin, not other companies.

I don't think you can exclusively say that all of Marklin's problems are due to other manufacturers, there will also be other issues to contend with. And as Tom points out, they are still the market leader so where does that leave the others? - Performing worse than Marklin I suspect.

As for me, I've purchased 2 new Marklin locos this year, and 1 second hand one. There may be a couple of others that I have my eye on as well.
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Offline Danlake  
#23 Posted : 02 September 2014 19:30:06(UTC)
Danlake

New Zealand   
Joined: 03/08/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,571
Quote:
Do you have any ideas what Märklin could do better in the future?


The model rail road hobby has one advantage other hobbies don’t have...

Many people are fascinated by trains (similar to planes and cars)!

As long as we have trains commuting people and carrying freight I think there will always be a market, all though smaller than previously.

The new generation have most likely not felt the sheer force and noise of a steam locomotive.

But may have been on a Japanese bullet train.

I agree with Tom that is the children who will have to carry the hobby forward and it will most likely not look like anything we are building today.

I think carpet bahns and computer control with various gadgets is how the new generation will play with trains. Not spending hours building a realistically layout with obscure details.

Layout will not only be controlled locally but also through a network on the internet. Network of tracks and trains being merged into a virtual world where it can be play it as a computer game. Some will be play the role as trafic control other will be the loco driver.

I think the strategy for Marklin should be:

1. Skip all analogue and full steam ahead on digital with new innovations and thinking outside the box. Minimize wiring to tracks by using wireless technology.
2. Stick to one gauge for cost saving.
3. Put more resources into locomotives (quality, performance) and save money on wagons and coaches.
4. Keep a small side of the business dedicated to the old hard core fans (e.g. inside models or models made to order).

Most importantly you cannot satisfy all groups so you have to find what is your target group and what they want. Lego was on the brink of bankruptcy 10 years as they did not understand what their customers wanted. Now it has been turned around and it’s one of the leading toy makers growing every year (see link: http://www.businessinsid...huge-turnaround-2014-2). I think Marklin could learn from them how they manage to keep the basic "building blocks"! but bring it into the future. And yes I am a great fan of the new lego movieThumpUp

Personally I am still old fashioned and will continue to build my layout as realistically as I can manage and find great satisfaction converting an old analogue loco to digitalBigGrin

Brgds - Lasse
Digital 11m2 layout / C (M&K) tracks / Era IV / CS3 60226 / Train Controller Gold 9 with 4D sound. Mainly Danish and German Locomotives.
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Offline Goofy  
#24 Posted : 02 September 2014 20:55:18(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,985
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
To be honest Goofy, I don't really care too much about the other MRR companies - I don't very often purchase any of their products (KM1 1 Gauge locomotives not withstanding). In this thread we are talking about the financial performance of Marklin, not other companies.

I don't think you can exclusively say that all of Marklin's problems are due to other manufacturers, there will also be other issues to contend with. And as Tom points out, they are still the market leader so where does that leave the others? - Performing worse than Marklin I suspect.

As for me, I've purchased 2 new Marklin locos this year, and 1 second hand one. There may be a couple of others that I have my eye on as well.


Yours opion what you think...and suppose.
What i did clear for other,is that Märklin lose more with poor sale.
That´s what Tom did verified by show list of the economic results.
It´s the fact that counts,when Märklin have competitors which also produce train models for the three rail.
Even accessories like Viessmann did hurted against Märklin for past 20 years.
Some members here use and buy Roco,Hag,Brawa with pick up shoes for the three rail.
When Märklin was bankrupt,they was not market leader and still of today not.



H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline Yumgui  
#25 Posted : 02 September 2014 23:42:51(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
First, I'm amazed at the 15 year steady financial Märklin plunge Tom has posted here ... had no idea !

Second, I appreciate your effort Goofy to be civil here once and for all; please abide by it, it will make all our lives a LOT easier, and yours too !

Third, Lasse I totally agree ... "layouts" as we see them will be very has-been soon, no doubt ! Realism, as a "relative" concept depending on who looks at it at a given time (archeologists, amongst others, fight all the time over this ...), is a never ending and evolving question, imho ...

Working on real 1:1 commuting urban projects here, I cannot think that this reality will not fascinate our youth one day in its miniaturized version, all their virtual temptations aside ...

Very interesting debate here ... ^^

Y ThumpUp
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
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Offline Goofy  
#26 Posted : 03 September 2014 07:02:19(UTC)
Goofy


Joined: 12/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 8,985
Originally Posted by: Yumgui Go to Quoted Post


Second, I appreciate your effort Goofy to be civil here once and for all; please abide by it, it will make all our lives a LOT easier, and yours too !


Y ThumpUp


I present realism about Märklins standing position of today.
It´s big difference from me and inverete märklinist.
The problem with inverete märklinist,is that they confuse problems about Märklin.
Märklinist are scare today,because the sale of result today is worse before Märklin was bankrupt.
I did saw Toms list:
1998=158 million euro
2013=105 million euro
It´s difference in about 53 millions euro per each year! Blink
H0
DCC = Digital Command Control
Offline H0  
#27 Posted : 23 October 2014 08:35:21(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
Hi!

Some more information from the article linked in the first post:
http://www.stuttgarter-n...a-8a7b-27b4eeca486d.html

They write: 'Derzeit verlagert Märklin rund zehn Prozent der Produktion von China zurück nach Europa. [...] „Wir werden zusätzlich zu den bestehenden 600 Arbeitsplätzen weitere 50 Jobs schaffen“, sagt Sieber.
'In Göppingen entstehen wegen der Rückverlagerung der Produktion keine neuen Arbeitsplätze.'

Translation: Märklin are transferring 10 percent of their production from China to Europe. [...] This will lead to 50 new jobs in Hungary. There won't be additional jobs in Göppingen.


Are they transferring 10 percent of the total production? Or just 10 percent of the Chinese production? They don't say this explicitly, so let's do some calculations.


Assumption 1: Transferring 10 percent of the total production.
At the end of 2013 there were about 1080 workers in Europe. Based on the assumption they do not handle more than 90 percent of the production. So to bring 100 percent of production to Europe, they would need about 1200 European workers - 120 new jobs.
But they announced only 50 new jobs, so this does not compute and the assumption is wrong.

Assumption 2: Transferring 10 percent of the Chinese production.
If the transfer of 10 percent of the Chinese production leads to 50 new jobs in Hungary, then I assume that we have 1080/500 at the end of 2013 and 1130/450 at the end of 2014.
With estimated 450 Chinese workers remaining of an estimated total of 1580 workers, we still are at 25+ % Chinese production.
The "it's all over now" Märklin lovers will not like this assumption, but to me these figures are plausible.
They match the information published on bundesanzeiger.de where they write about reduction of Chinese production.


And I presume that items purchased by Märklin (power supplies, motors, ...) are not included in the "production".
Even if they transfer 100 % of the production of rolling stock and MRR items to Europe, these items will remain "Made in China". But probably not even the US laws will require an "Made in China" sticker for a loco where only the motor was made in Far East.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline leahcim  
#28 Posted : 26 October 2014 02:04:02(UTC)
leahcim

Australia   
Joined: 12/08/2014(UTC)
Posts: 40
Location: QUEENSLAND, BRISBANE
Interesting set of figures and analysis Tom. What I am wondering is where are they at these days with their debt level. I know it was at around 70 million at one time. How much has that been reduced? if at all.

regards
michael
Offline H0  
#29 Posted : 26 October 2014 09:09:18(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
There is an own thread about insolvency and recovery:
https://www.marklin-user...-Updates.aspx#post468245

At the end of the insovency, Märklin paid all their debts 100%.
Well, they paid 100% of what was left at the end of insolvency. Debts were reduced due to insolvency regulations (reduced interest rates &c.).

I haven't seen any information about their current debt level.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline leahcim  
#30 Posted : 26 October 2014 10:17:07(UTC)
leahcim

Australia   
Joined: 12/08/2014(UTC)
Posts: 40
Location: QUEENSLAND, BRISBANE
Hi Tom, I imagine now that they are a private company again, any debts they have will only be known when they get too large to handle again.

regards
michael
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