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Converting HAG Models to Märklin 3 Rail
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Offline GlennM  
#1 Posted : 18 August 2014 15:35:25(UTC)
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GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,886
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
I am not sure if this topic has been raised before, I did search on HAG conversion and got over 20 pages of results.

I have seen some nice older HAG models which are pristine condition but are two rail analog DC, and I have no knowledge whatsoever about this brand and the technicalities of running it on 3 rail, although through this Forum I see a lot of people have HAG conversions, and so;

a) Is the conversion to 3 rail analog a simple process;
b) Is the conversion to 3 rail digital (for use with Märklin CS) a simple process, and does this require changing motors etc, and is it possible to have digital sound as well?

Finally, if I am not confident enough at the moment to undertake the conversion, can anyone recommend a dealer or individual in Europe who can undertake the conversion preferably to digital on my behalf?

Thanks for your help

Best Regards

Glenn
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
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Offline Oliver SBB-CFF-FFS  
#2 Posted : 18 August 2014 16:56:36(UTC)
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Oliver SBB-CFF-FFS

Sweden   
Joined: 22/06/2011(UTC)
Posts: 544
Hi Glenn,

I think that the easiest way to convert would be using a lokpilot with the same motor that is currently in the loco. I know it will not always be the case but there should be a DC motor in there that should run well with a lokpilot. You could of course go full sound and add swiss light changeover etc. It all depends on which loco and what it is equipped with today and/or how much time you want to put into it.

I just finished a conversion of a VI Trains Minuetto from DC to AC märklin. The hardest part was figuring out how to mount the slider. It was fun, but difficult. I am happy with the result and will probably create a thread for it soon here on the forum. It might give you some tips or inspiration.

However, I think the hardest part in an 2r to 3r conversion is mounting the slider. On some locos there simply is no space to mount it. On others it requires grinding and even exchanging boogies. It depends from model to model. Another factor is wheelsets. Some change from DC to AC wheelsets. Not only because of the conducting capabilities, but also because of the wheel profiles. I have never had to change when I made 2r to 3r conversion before, but I might just be lucky.

I know this is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to 2r to 3r conversions, but it might give you an idea of what lies ahead.

SBB Era IV - VI
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Offline GlennM  
#3 Posted : 18 August 2014 17:08:07(UTC)
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GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,886
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Originally Posted by: Oliver SBB-CFF-FFS Go to Quoted Post
Hi Glenn,

I think that the easiest way to convert would be using a lokpilot with the same motor that is currently in the loco. I know it will not always be the case but there should be a DC motor in there that should run well with a lokpilot. You could of course go full sound and add swiss light changeover etc. It all depends on which loco and what it is equipped with today and/or how much time you want to put into it.

I just finished a conversion of a VI Trains Minuetto from DC to AC märklin. The hardest part was figuring out how to mount the slider. It was fun, but difficult. I am happy with the result and will probably create a thread for it soon here on the forum. It might give you some tips or inspiration.

However, I think the hardest part in an 2r to 3r conversion is mounting the slider. On some locos there simply is no space to mount it. On others it requires grinding and even exchanging boogies. It depends from model to model. Another factor is wheelsets. Some change from DC to AC wheelsets. Not only because of the conducting capabilities, but also because of the wheel profiles. I have never had to change when I made 2r to 3r conversion before, but I might just be lucky.

I know this is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to 2r to 3r conversions, but it might give you an idea of what lies ahead.



Thanks Oliver for your thoughts. I would like to see your thread on conversions if you get round to doing one.

I have answered your PM, and know that the items I have chosen are available in 3 rail versions (which may mean slider positioning could be simpler ?), but they are hard to find, and the models I am looking at are in pristine condition, which makes the investment worthwhile in having them converted for future use.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Best Regards

Glenn
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
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Offline Oliver SBB-CFF-FFS  
#4 Posted : 18 August 2014 17:26:13(UTC)
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Oliver SBB-CFF-FFS

Sweden   
Joined: 22/06/2011(UTC)
Posts: 544
Hi again Glenn,

Answered your PM.
I believe you are right, since the models are availible in a 3r version mounting the slider will be easier.

I will post some pictures on the forum tonight with some pictures to give you an idea of what har to be fine to get the minuetto to work with 3r.

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Offline jcrtrains  
#5 Posted : 18 August 2014 19:17:47(UTC)
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jcrtrains

Canada   
Joined: 31/10/2009(UTC)
Posts: 597
Location: Toronto, Ontario
I hate to state the obvious, but the easiest thing to do is buy a Hag 3-rail model. You will find that they make a higher volume in 3 rail vs 2 rail. All models are available in 3-rail. A search of ebay or ricardo will also show that there is a higher volume available in 3 rail vs 2 rail.

Thanks
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Offline GlennM  
#6 Posted : 18 August 2014 20:16:44(UTC)
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GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,886
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Originally Posted by: jcrtrains Go to Quoted Post
I hate to state the obvious, but the easiest thing to do is buy a Hag 3-rail model. You will find that they make a higher volume in 3 rail vs 2 rail. All models are available in 3-rail. A search of ebay or ricardo will also show that there is a higher volume available in 3 rail vs 2 rail.

Thanks


Hi,

I would if I could find what I have been looking for. The initial three items I am looking to convert are in 'like new' condition and therefore hard to find in such condition period. One loco I have been looking for for almost 3 years on ebay. As they are all 30+ years old, they would need converting from 3 rail AC to digital anyway, and so if the conversion is easy then why not.

BR

Glenn
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
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Offline GlennM  
#7 Posted : 18 August 2014 20:18:15(UTC)
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GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,886
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Originally Posted by: Oliver SBB-CFF-FFS Go to Quoted Post
Hi again Glenn,

Answered your PM.
I believe you are right, since the models are availible in a 3r version mounting the slider will be easier.

I will post some pictures on the forum tonight with some pictures to give you an idea of what har to be fine to get the minuetto to work with 3r.



Thanks Oliver
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
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Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#8 Posted : 18 August 2014 21:17:58(UTC)
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5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,865
Location: CA, USA
Originally Posted by: GlennM Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Oliver SBB-CFF-FFS Go to Quoted Post
Hi again Glenn,

Answered your PM.
I believe you are right, since the models are availible in a 3r version mounting the slider will be easier.

I will post some pictures on the forum tonight with some pictures to give you an idea of what har to be fine to get the minuetto to work with 3r.



Thanks Oliver


With all the somewhat modern HAG's, going from 2 rail to 3 rail digital is actually really easy. Bolt on a pickup shoe, solder in a decoder and you are done BigGrin Its actually cheaper and easier then converting a 3 rail loco to digital since you don't need the motor parts
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Offline Unholz  
#9 Posted : 18 August 2014 21:31:26(UTC)
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Unholz

Switzerland   
Joined: 29/07/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,394
Location: Switzerland
Originally Posted by: GlennM Go to Quoted Post

I have seen some nice older HAG models which are pristine condition but are two rail analog DC (...)


Specific help would be very much easier and far more reliable if an indication regarding the model types were provided. Some HAG models can be converted from DC to AC in about thirty minutes if the right spare parts and/or tools are available - others require a slightly greater effort, and one or two are a challenge. But nothing is impossible.
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Offline GlennM  
#10 Posted : 19 August 2014 14:39:50(UTC)
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GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,886
Location: Somewhere, But Nowhere Near Manchester, England
Thanks to everyone for their thoughts and advice, especially the PM's from Oliver.

I am now confident that the items I am interested in can be converted and so I intend to buy them and go through the conversion process with pictures in this thread.

Thanks Guys ThumpUp ThumpUp ThumpUp ThumpUp

BR

Glenn
Don't look back, your not heading that way.
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thanks 1 user liked this useful post by GlennM
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