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Offline mb300e4m  
#1 Posted : 08 March 2014 16:40:17(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Greetings from sunny Florida,

I have a Marklin 7186 and a Fleischman 1780 Turntable and I want to convert one or the other to use with 2 rail and 3 rail locos, both AC and DC types. Some 3 rail locos will have insulated axles (Trix types) and others (Marklin and Hornby types) will have un-insulated axles. Some 3 rail types will use the center rail and both outer rails, while others will use the center rail and one or other of the outer rails for power pick up.

I have experience converting 2 rail track to 3 rail and so on, so any changes necessary to the stock track on the turntable bridge should not be a problem for me. The Marklin 7186, already having a center rail, may be the best starting point but I am open to any and all suggestions.

If the stock rail does not have a high enough profile to accommodate course wheel flanges, I have plenty of code 124 rail that I can use. Making any necessary wiring changes will also be no problem.

Does any member have any experience with such a conversion?

Thanks in advance for any help. Smile

Peter B.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline kbvrod  
#2 Posted : 08 March 2014 18:22:59(UTC)
kbvrod

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,597
Location: Beverly, MA
Hi Peter,all,
I think your challenge is in the wiring of the 7186 to switch from AC to DC (and back again) you'll also need a reverser in DC mode.

Dr D
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by kbvrod
Offline mb300e4m  
#3 Posted : 14 March 2014 01:03:46(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
I surveyed both and came up with the following which summarizes the differences and changes needed.

1) Neither have Nickel Silver rail although the Marklin rail height is closer to code 124 than the Fleischmann. Both would need the outer rails replaced with Code 124 Nickel Silver rail to accommodate course flanged wheels.

2) The Fleischmann has insulated outer rails, the Marklin does not. Replacing the Fleischmann outer rails with code 124 NS rail should be easier than on the Marklin because the Marklin rails would also need to be insulated from the metal bridge decking whereas the Fleischmann rails are attached to an insulated decking.

3) Marklin has a center rail. The Fleischmann does not and would require the addition of a center rail to the insulated bridge decking.

4) Some rewiring would be needed on both.

5) The Fleischmann was cheaper than the Marklin and I do not plan on ever building a pure Fleischmann layout.

Based upon the above findings, it looks like the turntable of choice for conversion is the Fleischmann. However this is subject to change as I get into the project. I will give the whole thing a great deal more thought before starting and will also do a simulated bench-top walkthrough and see if there are any issues as yet undiscovered.

Peter B.
mb300e4m attached the following image(s):
P3134249.JPG
P3134243.JPG
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline mb300e4m  
#4 Posted : 21 November 2014 16:40:02(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Go to Quoted Post
I surveyed both and came up with the following which summarizes the differences and changes needed.

1) Neither have Nickel Silver rail although the Marklin rail height is closer to code 124 than the Fleischmann. Both would need the outer rails replaced with Code 124 Nickel Silver rail to accommodate course flanged wheels.

2) The Fleischmann has insulated outer rails, the Marklin does not. Replacing the Fleischmann outer rails with code 124 NS rail should be easier than on the Marklin because the Marklin rails would also need to be insulated from the metal bridge decking whereas the Fleischmann rails are attached to an insulated decking.

3) Marklin has a center rail. The Fleischmann does not and would require the addition of a center rail to the insulated bridge decking.

4) Some rewiring would be needed on both.

5) The Fleischmann was cheaper than the Marklin and I do not plan on ever building a pure Fleischmann layout.

Based upon the above findings, it looks like the turntable of choice for conversion is the Fleischmann. However this is subject to change as I get into the project. I will give the whole thing a great deal more thought before starting and will also do a simulated bench-top walkthrough and see if there are any issues as yet undiscovered.

Peter B.


I started recently with the conversion of the Fleischmann 1780 turntable. The project is actually easier than I thought it would be. I will post a group of pictures when I get done with it.

The mechanical work is done for the most part, I will convert the short sections around the rim as the need arises, I will do 2 or three initially just to prove the process.

I do not have any documentation on the turntable and have been operating it using 12 volt DC power for the motor and latch mechanism. Can anyone tell me what the power supply specs should be as recommended by Fleischmann? Is it 12 volt DC, 14 volt AC or some other? I have not been able to find this information on line, which surprises me.

I am used to using 14-16 volt AC for model railway accessories, but would like to know the recommendation for this turntable. I have not yet tried it on AC, but note that the turntable uses what looks like a fairly common Fleischmann loco motor type with a ring-field magnet. But that does not necessarily mean the power supply should be DC. I shall be taking a close look at the motor to see if there are any diodes installed somewhere in the wiring.

Peter B.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline mb300e4m  
#5 Posted : 21 November 2014 18:49:57(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
I have the answer by experimentation.

If I apply 14 volt AC directly to the turntable, the motor just buzzes. If apply 14 volt AC to the control box, the motor runs and the turntable works fine. In fact it works better than it does if I use DC connected to the control box. There must be some diodes in the control box.

QED.

Peter B.

P.S. I will post some pictures soon.
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by mb300e4m
Offline mb300e4m  
#6 Posted : 10 December 2014 18:09:18(UTC)
mb300e4m


Joined: 07/06/2013(UTC)
Posts: 424
Location: Florida
Originally Posted by: mb300e4m Go to Quoted Post
I have the answer by experimentation.

If I apply 14 volt AC directly to the turntable, the motor just buzzes. If apply 14 volt AC to the control box, the motor runs and the turntable works fine. In fact it works better than it does if I use DC connected to the control box. There must be some diodes in the control box.

QED.

Peter B.

P.S. I will post some pictures soon.


Here are a few pictures of the conversion. It is complete as far as I need to this point. The table and three of the connecting tracks are now three rail, others I will do as needed. The first picture shows it undergoing bench testing, the track is supported by some pieces of 1x2 but is not needed when the hole is cut in the module to accommodate the turntable. That will be after Christmas.

Peter B.
mb300e4m attached the following image(s):
PC015172.JPG
PB245169.JPG
PB205162.JPG
Peter B.
In Sunny Florida most of the time.
Marklin, Trix Express, Trix Twin, Fleischmann, Liliput, Hornby Dublo, and Others, 2 & 3 Rail, AC, DC and Digital, Course Scale Wheels & Fine, 1935 to 1960s usually.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by mb300e4m
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