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Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#1 Posted : 30 April 2012 22:50:44(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,862
Location: CA, USA
See this link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/...&hash=item4ab6ddd7b7

My vote is fake, painted on a railbox donor car. Well done though!

Edited by user 04 May 2012 20:27:00(UTC)  | Reason: added#

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Offline kbvrod  
#2 Posted : 30 April 2012 23:05:12(UTC)
kbvrod

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,597
Location: Beverly, MA
Hi John,all,
No M number,.....Sneaky Still very nice.ThumpUp

Dr D
Offline Iamnotthecrazyone  
#3 Posted : 30 April 2012 23:46:10(UTC)
Iamnotthecrazyone

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,044
There is nothing wrong with that car and doesn't look repainted at all. I believe it may have come in a set of American cars in the last 15 years or so. It is likely to be worth less than the original brown -even if rarer- but that's just my guess.
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#4 Posted : 01 May 2012 00:06:25(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,862
Location: CA, USA
I just took a closer look. It has clearly been painted over the yellow railbox car. Look on the floor in the image where the door is open, and the tape mark between the main "N" and "H", andso there is yellow showing in a few other spots.

A very well done car! Just not Marklin factory as advertised so beware...
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Offline Iamnotthecrazyone  
#5 Posted : 01 May 2012 00:47:34(UTC)
Iamnotthecrazyone

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,044
Originally Posted by: 5HorizonsRR Go to Quoted Post
I just took a closer look. It has clearly been painted over the yellow railbox car. Look on the floor in the image where the door is open, and the tape mark between the main "N" and "H", andso there is yellow showing in a few other spots.

A very well done car! Just not Marklin factory as advertised so beware...


I can see the yellow you are referring to but to me that's just the undercoat. Otherwise why would they have bothered to dissasemble it (look at the tabs under the floor) reasemble it scratching the tabs too and not bother painting the inside of the wagon instead of leaving it yellow? I don't see anything wrong between the N and the H. The only thing that does bring some doubt to me are the plastic ends. One seem to be painted on both sides and one seem to be yellow on the inside but I have seen enough weird stuff and mistake problems with original Marklin trains that I still feel this is original.

Hopefully someone else who has it could shed some light on it but to me that one came on a set of wholesale box cars or a set of cars in the last few years but I just don't remember exactly when.

Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#6 Posted : 01 May 2012 08:01:53(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,862
Location: CA, USA
Originally Posted by: Iamnotthecrazyone Go to Quoted Post


I can see the yellow you are referring to but to me that's just the undercoat. Otherwise why would they have bothered to dissasemble it (look at the tabs under the floor) reasemble it scratching the tabs too and not bother painting the inside of the wagon instead of leaving it yellow? I don't see anything wrong between the N and the H. The only thing that does bring some doubt to me are the plastic ends. One seem to be painted on both sides and one seem to be yellow on the inside but I have seen enough weird stuff and mistake problems with original Marklin trains that I still feel this is original.

Hopefully someone else who has it could shed some light on it but to me that one came on a set of wholesale box cars or a set of cars in the last few years but I just don't remember exactly when.



Marklin used stamped metal in solid colors and didn't spray over it except for the lettering. If you look on the bottom of the N you will see that previously mentioned paint/tape line, it isn't a machine line as its not even.

Also, for the same solid color metal reasoning there wouldn't be paint flaking on the interior if original, and there a few bubbles on the side when you zoom in.

Lastly, the lettering on the car is either a decal or a transfer, Marklin's was not

Couple that with the fact that Marklin never made the metal boxcars in a wholesale set, and no New Haven except the original brown one, and its a faker

(not trying tho raise doubt, just point this out to potential bidders, two of whom have reached out to me about this car)
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Offline 3rail4life  
#7 Posted : 03 May 2012 09:22:31(UTC)
3rail4life

United States   
Joined: 23/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 426
Location: Northern California
I remember a bit about when this car was produced but most of the details escape me now. I know there are a few of them out there and they were done in the late 1980's or early 1990's as some kind of special edition car for who knows who? I somehow thought they were from Märklin Inc./USA or maybe just painted by Marklin Inc. for a dealer as a one off promotional item, maybe?. I really wish I could remember all the details as I had totally forgotten about it until I saw it again in the ebay auction. I am sure there has to be someone else on here from the states who was collecting or selling back then that remembers who commissioned or sold this repainted car.

Gordon
Offline Iamnotthecrazyone  
#8 Posted : 04 May 2012 00:28:41(UTC)
Iamnotthecrazyone

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,044
I don't know about the rest but one thing I was wrong about and that was my guess about the price. Still four hours to go and it is up to $133 with lots of interest from different bidders.Woot
Offline Yumgui  
#9 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:17:07(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
Hmm,
Before even reading this thread, I had decided that this car was mine ... and now it is ! BigGrin

Why pay such a nutty price for a possibly "fake" Märklin USA freight car ? Well first, just have a look at my avatar ... ^^ LOL

Second, I have always been left a bit hanging with the 3 "official" brown versions I have; even going to the extent of recently buying 3 Branchline Trains "Yardmaster Series" very nicely detailed orange NH cars ... to be fitted soon with AC wheels and trucks !

While the quality of the paint job, whatever the process (I'll know more when I receive the item), convinced me to go for it ... I am now very curious following this discussion to know if this item was part of some Märklin "sondermodell" program, or not ...

I certainly haven't found anything in Koll's (yet?) ...

Any info would be greatly appreciated, and of course I'll post here any that I may find ... this could be a quiz.

Yum Tongue
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
Offline jvuye  
#10 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:31:36(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,881
Location: South Western France
Originally Posted by: Yumgui Go to Quoted Post


I certainly haven't found anything in Koll's (yet?) ...

Any info would be greatly appreciated, and of course I'll post here any that I may find ... this could be a quiz.

Yum Tongue


Hi "Yum"!
I can tell you already it is *no* Märklin original, albeit a very nice job!
If in the future, your fantasy brings up *any* paint scheme, let me know by MP
I have found a guy in Belgium who does wonders...at very decent rates!
See example below, for the Rio Grande "B" unit (which accidentally, is a repaint of a NH B-unit...sorry to hurt you!Scared BigGrin )
Cheers
jvuye attached the following image(s):
liteDRG F7 ret.jpg
liteDRG F7 ret.jpg
LITE299163.jpg
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by jvuye
Offline igf2  
#11 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:33:54(UTC)
igf2


Joined: 29/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 268
Location: France
Hi Yum

I was one of the two who raised the auction at that level (133,33 USD)... But you won it. Well done. I am happy it's you who beat me !

Best regards

Jean-Pierre
Offline jvuye  
#12 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:37:46(UTC)
jvuye

Belgium   
Joined: 01/03/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,881
Location: South Western France
Originally Posted by: igf2 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Yum

I was one of the two who raised the auction at that level (133,33 USD)... But you won it. Well done. I am happy it's you who beat me !

Best regards

Jean-Pierre


Sort of like : "Staying within the French relatives"BigGrin Wink ThumpUp
Jacques Vuye aka Dr.Eisenbahn
Once a vandal, learned to be better and had great success!
Offline Yumgui  
#13 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:39:03(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
Jacques !

Originally Posted by: jvuye Go to Quoted Post
See example below, for the Rio Grande "B" unit (which accidentally, is a repaint of a NH B-unit...sorry to hurt you!Scared BigGrin )


Hahaha LOL ... this does hurt ^^ , how could anyone favor Rio Grande over New Haven ??? Confused Confused Confused Woot

Anyway, I am certainly not against good craftsmanship, on the contrary I seek it out !
In fact have some beautifully strange wagons which I mean to post soon for help with identification ...

And your suggestion for the Belgian craftsman is noted ^^

Will PM soon ^^ ThumpUp

Y Tongue
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
Offline Yumgui  
#14 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:41:08(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
Hah, Jean-Pierre :

Originally Posted by: igf2 Go to Quoted Post
I was one of the two who raised the auction at that level (133,33 USD)... But you won it. Well done. I am happy it's you who beat me !

You are nuts to pay so much for such an item ^^ ! LOL

We will have to talk soon, I hope ...

Y Tongue

PS: Btw ... I messaged the owner asking if he has any info on the origin of this car .. no answer yet, not even an invoice !
Dude is prolly on vacation ... hmpf ;P
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
Offline Webmaster  
#15 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:56:22(UTC)
Webmaster


Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC)
Posts: 11,161
I recognize the paint scheme from some old M catalog, presumably from my youth in the 60's-early 70's... Have seen it before...
Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service...
He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
Offline Yumgui  
#16 Posted : 04 May 2012 19:58:40(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
Mr J,
If you find that reference, I'll fly to your house and buy you a beer ! ThumpUp

Y Tongue
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#17 Posted : 04 May 2012 20:10:22(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,862
Location: CA, USA
Congrats! Enjoy the car and the craftsmanship- remember the price isn't crazy at all if you value the labor time that went into painting it!
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thanks 1 user liked this useful post by 5HorizonsRR
Offline 5HorizonsRR  
#18 Posted : 04 May 2012 20:12:04(UTC)
5HorizonsRR

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2004(UTC)
Posts: 2,862
Location: CA, USA
Also- I forgot to mention- it did come in these colors from Marklin- but in Z gauge! BigGrin
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Offline Yumgui  
#19 Posted : 04 May 2012 20:22:53(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
Hiya 5HRR !

Originally Posted by: 5HorizonsRR Go to Quoted Post
Congrats! Enjoy the car and the craftsmanship- remember the price isn't crazy at all if you value the labor time that went into painting it!

You're right, you just made me feel better about this latest folly ^^ ! Woot

See PM plz ... BigGrin

Yum Tongue
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
Offline igf2  
#20 Posted : 04 May 2012 21:08:17(UTC)
igf2


Joined: 29/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 268
Location: France
Hi Jacques

You are right : it seems to be a club within the club !

Dear Yum

I Will soon show you a few special issues.
Offline steventrain  
#21 Posted : 04 May 2012 21:22:30(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 31,601
Location: United Kingdom
Originally Posted by: 5HorizonsRR Go to Quoted Post
See this link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/...&hash=item4ab6ddd7b7

My vote is fake, painted on a railbox donor car. Well done though!


I have never see it before.
Large Marklinist 3- Rails Layout with CS2/MS2/Boosters/C-track/favorites Electric class E03/BR103, E18/E118, E94, Crocodiles/Steam BR01, BR03, BR05, BR23, BR44, BR50, Big Boy.
Offline Iamnotthecrazyone  
#22 Posted : 04 May 2012 22:21:08(UTC)
Iamnotthecrazyone

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,044
Originally Posted by: Yumgui Go to Quoted Post
Hmm,
Before even reading this thread, I had decided that this car was mine ... and now it is ! BigGrin




Haha, I was wondering if all this silence before meant some people here were interested and wanted to keep it as quiet as possible.

Congratulations on a very nice car, once you get it I'd like to hear your opinion about the originality. Even if it isn't it is a very good job and you would have paid that money to have it done by someone else.

During the auction I did contact the seller and he said he couldn't find any reference to it either. It's a shame I don't remember anymore but a couple of years ago I thought it was released in one of those multipackage 20 or 40 american cars that most dealers tend to split up. I did some research and it doesn't appear on the ones I can find listed. I have a Koll spezial items but it is too old and it does not appear there either, I should probably by a more recent one. I prefer New Haven to Rio Grande too!

Enjoy!

BTW:Do you know there is a different NH in this set?HERE
Offline igf2  
#23 Posted : 04 May 2012 22:22:39(UTC)
igf2


Joined: 29/04/2010(UTC)
Posts: 268
Location: France
Hello Jum

Here are some pictures of 3 very special New Haven Marklin items which are in my collection...

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

I hope you will enjoy this first extract.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by igf2
Offline Iamnotthecrazyone  
#24 Posted : 04 May 2012 22:36:14(UTC)
Iamnotthecrazyone

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,044
Nice, I was actually planning to buy the Fleischmann version of that loco whenever I can pick up a cheap example.
Offline kimballthurlow  
#25 Posted : 04 May 2012 23:12:22(UTC)
kimballthurlow

Australia   
Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,653
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Hi Yum,
Congratulations on buying the metal NH car.

As you say, regardless of the origins, it is a nice addition to your NH items.
The fact that it is a real metal car,makes it a purchase that has intrinsic value anyway.

regards
Kimball
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge.
Offline 3rail4life  
#26 Posted : 06 May 2012 02:23:42(UTC)
3rail4life

United States   
Joined: 23/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 426
Location: Northern California
Congratulations Yum on winning the auction!

I can not believe no one here knows the origins of this car and that I have forgotten them, there is such a powerhouse of knowledge here you would think someone here remembers this car when it was being offered back in the day. I was thinking maybe Scott at Helmut's Hobbies might remember it, he was selling special items back then. Had I purchased it back when I had the chance, you can be sure I would know every detail even if had to make some of them upSmile , but since it was not a catalog item or ma. special imprint, I passed, I guess that was a mistakeCursing
Offline Iamnotthecrazyone  
#27 Posted : 22 May 2014 09:17:30(UTC)
Iamnotthecrazyone

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,044
Originally Posted by: Yumgui Go to Quoted Post
Hmm,
Before even reading this thread, I had decided that this car was mine ... and now it is ! BigGrin

Why pay such a nutty price for a possibly "fake" Märklin USA freight car ? Well first, just have a look at my avatar ... ^^ LOL

Second, I have always been left a bit hanging with the 3 "official" brown versions I have; even going to the extent of recently buying 3 Branchline Trains "Yardmaster Series" very nicely detailed orange NH cars ... to be fitted soon with AC wheels and trucks !

While the quality of the paint job, whatever the process (I'll know more when I receive the item), convinced me to go for it ... I am now very curious following this discussion to know if this item was part of some Märklin "sondermodell" program, or not ...

I certainly haven't found anything in Koll's (yet?) ...

Any info would be greatly appreciated, and of course I'll post here any that I may find ... this could be a quiz.

Yum Tongue


Hi,
I wonder if it might be easy to post a photo of this New Haven car, I'd like to see it again. If too much trouble don't worry about it.
Thanks
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Iamnotthecrazyone
Offline Yumgui  
#28 Posted : 24 May 2014 23:45:29(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
Originally Posted by: Iamnotthecrazyone Go to Quoted Post

Hi,
I wonder if it might be easy to post a photo of this New Haven car, I'd like to see it again. If too much trouble don't worry about it.
Thanks

OK Iam,

My apologies for letting this post, and a few others, "get away" ... no excuse !

Will respond asap ...

Y Glare
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Yumgui
Offline Iamnotthecrazyone  
#29 Posted : 25 May 2014 05:22:53(UTC)
Iamnotthecrazyone

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,044
Thanks, I remember I like it but I couldn't remember if it was nicer than the 2013 release.
IBlink
Offline Frankenbahner  
#30 Posted : 25 May 2014 10:18:32(UTC)
Frankenbahner


Joined: 15/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 625
Location: Nuremberg, Bavaria
I would prefer the term "repaint" for models like this: someone invested a lot of work to create a very special car.

Another way to add to your fleet of American Märklin cars means fitting cars from American brands with Märklin bogies.

Not those plastic cars, but those with classic tin-plate (such as Varney) or wooden car bodies (such as Ambroid), like this one:

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

Or these Model Power Metaltrain cars, which come with die-cast car bodies:

UserPostedImage

Regards,
Florian
H0 3-rail AC with DCC, MM and mfx, 2-rail DC streetcars, and N gauge
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