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Offline NewMB  
#1 Posted : 26 April 2012 18:52:39(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Sometime in winter, we will be moving into our new home and of course there is space reserved for a new large Märklin layout in the basement

The problem is that I am not so good at using WinTrack (even though I have a paid for version) as it drives me crazy trying to figure everything out….

Perhaps womeone on here would be interested in helping me? I have already made some plans for the tables etc and have some ideas of what to run and have etc.

Below is a picture of my proposed table layout. The room is 11.44m x 4.5m and only one part of the room needs to be left free for some furniture. No windows (they are all placed high) are in the way and the door stands right in the middle of the bottom wall.

The following is my wishes etc:

1. Märklin C-track, Digital (using CS).
2. I haven’t yet decided if I should run digital turnouts or not. Not done this one before.
3. I plan to run everything from Epoche 1-5.
4. One part of the layout will be completely in Sweden (my idea being the section far right).
5. I think I can fit in 4x Stations, one being “Bonn” from Faller which should be the main station.
6. I were hoping to fit a large, long bridge from Faller across the floor (1.0m) from one section to the next.
7. One Turntable.

A few wishes hehe….. I have also posted a quick drawing I made earlier to show you my idea of a trackplan. Obviously not to scale!!

Another thing that I do not understand is how to connect Boosters, if I need them! I will run all buildings-, streel- and turnout lights etc on a separate transformer anyway.

I would be very greatful for any input, suggestions, criticism etc etc.

Thanks!!

Patrik

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

Edited by user 30 April 2012 16:54:12(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline mikeinfrisco  
#2 Posted : 27 April 2012 01:44:25(UTC)
mikeinfrisco


Joined: 24/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 26
Location: Frisco, TX
I noticed that no one responded yet, perhaps because we're all overwhelmed with the scope of your question BigGrin

I have a few thoughts on this subject, as I have struggled with track planning software and a good size space to fill. Let me try to help you by asking some additional questions...

1. What's the purpose of your train layout? - Build a museum piece to be admired by all? Build to operate the layout with some friends? Build it to sit in front of it and watch the trains go round?
2. Have you ever built a train layout before? What did you enjoy or dislike about it?
3. How high are you going to build your layout and have you considered the overall accessibilty?

These questions in turn will lead to more questions...

however, two hopefully constructive comments. One, I would not build a bridge across an open space like that. Make your bridge span two sections along the wall. You will bang into the bridge all the time, unless it's WAY up high where you can walk under it without stooping. Two, build a small layout. Just start building and see where it takes you. Stop at any time and start over. Don't be afraid to experiment and try different things.

I built my first real layout and it took me 2 years to build. I finished it completely with scenery and everything. As soon as it was done, I played with it for a few weeks then tore it down and started over. I discovered that as I was building it, my desires for a layout changed completely. So just go for it. I use track planning software mostly to figure out small details these days.

Viel spass und alles gute beim planen und bauen.

Mike
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Offline NewMB  
#3 Posted : 27 April 2012 06:40:19(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: mikeinfrisco Go to Quoted Post
I noticed that no one responded yet, perhaps because we're all overwhelmed with the scope of your question BigGrin

I have a few thoughts on this subject, as I have struggled with track planning software and a good size space to fill. Let me try to help you by asking some additional questions...

1. What's the purpose of your train layout? - Build a museum piece to be admired by all? Build to operate the layout with some friends? Build it to sit in front of it and watch the trains go round?
2. Have you ever built a train layout before? What did you enjoy or dislike about it?
3. How high are you going to build your layout and have you considered the overall accessibilty?

These questions in turn will lead to more questions...

however, two hopefully constructive comments. One, I would not build a bridge across an open space like that. Make your bridge span two sections along the wall. You will bang into the bridge all the time, unless it's WAY up high where you can walk under it without stooping. Two, build a small layout. Just start building and see where it takes you. Stop at any time and start over. Don't be afraid to experiment and try different things.

I built my first real layout and it took me 2 years to build. I finished it completely with scenery and everything. As soon as it was done, I played with it for a few weeks then tore it down and started over. I discovered that as I was building it, my desires for a layout changed completely. So just go for it. I use track planning software mostly to figure out small details these days.

Viel spass und alles gute beim planen und bauen.

Mike


Hi Mike,

Thanks for your comments. Some answers for you....

1. I think the answer is "all of the above". Personally I like landscape alot and find it to be very satisfying to build and show.
2. Yes, I have built a layout before. Took me a year to plan and 2 years to build. A small one at 200x120 + 120x80 in "L" shape and two floors. I loved building it but ued to many tracks and it become overwhelming in such a small space (this was done during my 15 yrs of living in Britain and UK houses are quite limited in space). I have also built a 200x100 layout back in the 80's with my father in Sweden which did not have to many details.
3. Height is always a good question, but I think around 1 metre or so. I haven't thought of a "hidden storage yard" this time but perhaps this is a good idea as I have approx 90 loks and approx 200 wagons and obviously can't use them all at once RollEyes .

The bridge across idea came from the fact that when one build along the walls only I think it becomes a little small considering the space I can use so I simply created an idea that I can have one very long run with 2 loops and one smaller one that goes round and round. Then there are 2 smaller lines that goes A-B only. I have thought about this bridge and agree, it is not the best idea as you say, people will knock it all the time! Perhaps it's possible to make this layout with a hidden yard and also two loops - so no bridge to knock down?!

Here's some pics of the layout I built back in 2005-2007.

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

This is the hidden yard before the next floor came on...
UserPostedImage

Offline Ian555  
#4 Posted : 27 April 2012 07:58:50(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 18,809
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

I hope you enjoyed your time living in Britain.

Great looking layout you had. ThumpUp

With the space you have available to you, I would build a u shaped layout in the middle of your room, full sized hidden station below, this way you get to view your layout from 360 degree's, easy access to nearly all the layout, does away with all the (well nearly) 180 degree change of directions on your original plan and allows longer smooth running of your Loco's.

Sounds a bit like the plans for my own new layout.Smile ThumpUp

What ever you decide, have fun building it.

Ian.



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Offline NewMB  
#5 Posted : 27 April 2012 08:06:02(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

I hope you enjoyed your time living in Britain.

Great looking layout you had. ThumpUp

With the space you have available to you, I would build a u shaped layout in the middle of your room, full sized hidden station below, this way you get to view your layout from 360 degree's, easy access to nearly all the layout, does away with all the (well nearly) 180 degree change of directions on your original plan and allows longer smooth running of your Loco's.

Sounds a bit like the plans for my own new layout.Smile ThumpUp

What ever you decide, have fun building it.

Ian.





Thanks alot Ian!

Your idea sounds very interesting indeed Smile Would it be possible for you to show me what you mean??

Offline Ian555  
#6 Posted : 27 April 2012 09:54:13(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 18,809
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

Me and my layouts..Baden-Württemberg Part III Post 24.

Some sketches of my proposed new layout.

My layout will be built sitting in the middle of the room, roughly the same size as your own (9m by 6.6m), so will be able to walk right round the layout and the U shape creates the access walkway up thro the middle.

Maybe you can work something around that, so you could fit your own plans to it.

Ian.

Online steventrain  
#7 Posted : 27 April 2012 09:57:29(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 27,578
Location: Northern Ireland
Big layout, Thanks for sharing the pictures.
Largest Marklinist Layout with Central station 2/Mobile station 2/60174 boosters/C-Tracks/K-Tracks/M-tracks/Favorites class BR01, BR23, BR50, E103, E120/Insider Club membership since 2004.
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Offline NewMB  
#8 Posted : 27 April 2012 10:43:08(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Thank You both Ian and Steven.

Offline NewMB  
#9 Posted : 27 April 2012 13:46:54(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Another update..... after considering the ideas on this forum and others that I have found I came up with a new plan that may actually work better Smile No 1m long bridge to worry about.

Again, I would be very greatful for any input, comments etc.

Oviously this plan is NOT to scale but give some idea's on how many trains I can run. Planned below is 5 stations and 2 trains that can run non-stop and 2 trains that run on it's on line. Again, no plans made for any hidden storage yards. Table can also be adjusted to accomodate more space. Lots of track missing too.

UserPostedImage
Offline NewMB  
#10 Posted : 30 April 2012 17:02:02(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Made a new trackplan for my future project and would really like your opinion pls.

As you can see, on the plan there is 5 routes (3 loops & 2 A-B rotes) that can be operated. I have also planned in wide turnouts here and there, bridges, tunnels, mountains and different levels. I am planning to have 3-4 stations + industry + towns. The rectangular box represents "Bonn" Station from Faller. Not 100% happy with it though.....


UserPostedImage
Offline BrandonVA  
#11 Posted : 30 April 2012 17:12:34(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,065
Location: VA
How do you access the opening in the top left of the drawing? Do you have to crawl under the table? I like the detail and waviness in the track. I wonder if that long straight section in the top left could be modified to make it a little more wavy for consistency. Of course, I don't know your landscape/building plans for this area, so I may be out of context.
Offline petestra  
#12 Posted : 30 April 2012 17:20:05(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 26/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 4,264
Location: washington,dc
Hi Patrik, I really like the layout. The only thing I would change is the loop of track around the round house area.
I would start elevating it at each end (by the Bonn station and the other end and have the track raise to the
most you can with tunnels around the curved areas and maybe two smaller ones along the straight section of track.
This would give the impression of the train travelling in and out and thru a hilly area. The mountains/hills along the straight
track section could rise up to a backdrop board (don't know if you want that area open or not). Anyway, those were
my thoughts. Oh, by the way, I started my current layout in '09 but for two years I was planning it on Wintrack
and then had the difficult decision to pick a layout to build out of five. Since you have time still, play around some more.
Good luck,PeterThumpUp
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Offline NewMB  
#13 Posted : 30 April 2012 18:26:37(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: BrandonVA Go to Quoted Post
How do you access the opening in the top left of the drawing? Do you have to crawl under the table? I like the detail and waviness in the track. I wonder if that long straight section in the top left could be modified to make it a little more wavy for consistency. Of course, I don't know your landscape/building plans for this area, so I may be out of context.


The top left is only accessed by crawling under the table. I made it this way so that I can get a full 140cm width to have enough space for roundhouse, station, tracks etc.

I agree re some "waves" aw it is to straight at the moment. Will work on it for some time and see what I can come up with. Thanks alot!


Originally Posted by: petestra Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik, I really like the layout. The only thing I would change is the loop of track around the round house area.
I would start elevating it at each end (by the Bonn station and the other end and have the track raise to the
most you can with tunnels around the curved areas and maybe two smaller ones along the straight section of track.
This would give the impression of the train travelling in and out and thru a hilly area. The mountains/hills along the straight
track section could rise up to a backdrop board (don't know if you want that area open or not). Anyway, those were
my thoughts. Oh, by the way, I started my current layout in '09 but for two years I was planning it on Wintrack
and then had the difficult decision to pick a layout to build out of five. Since you have time still, play around some more.
Good luck,PeterThumpUp


Hi Peter,

Thanks alot for your suggestions. I think I will raise the track a bit to show it off more and perhaps also give it some "curves" like Brandon above suggested. This section is not standing up against a wall though so may be tricky with hills/tunnels there.

This is my 3rd or 4th attempt and the first one I am starting to like..... BigGrin
Offline BrandonVA  
#14 Posted : 30 April 2012 18:48:22(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,065
Location: VA
Access is certainly a plus! I can understand that.
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Offline NewMB  
#15 Posted : 01 May 2012 07:54:40(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Some changes made, ie tunnels and raised track at the back. Also some other minor changes.

One thing I can not get my head around if the big empty space all the way to the right...... any ideas???

UserPostedImage
Offline RayF  
#16 Posted : 01 May 2012 08:49:53(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,976
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Hi Patrik, sorry I hadn't seen your post until today. Your plan is looking good!

You could use the empty space on the right hand end to make a small country terminus station, or an industry of some kind, with track branching off the upper main line. Alternatively you could reduce the size of the upper loop somewhat so that you can expose more of the lower loop, and have a small station on the lower loop. It could be a harbour station, or something similar.
Ray

Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline NewMB  
#17 Posted : 01 May 2012 09:17:39(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik, sorry I hadn't seen your post until today. Your plan is looking good!

You could use the empty space on the right hand end to make a small country terminus station, or an industry of some kind, with track branching off the upper main line. Alternatively you could reduce the size of the upper loop somewhat so that you can expose more of the lower loop, and have a small station on the lower loop. It could be a harbour station, or something similar.



Hi Ray,

Very good idea! As it happens, I work in the transport industry and even have a H0 Freight terminal so I can see if I can put that it there somehow..... Smile

Offline GlennM  
#18 Posted : 01 May 2012 09:32:11(UTC)
GlennM

United Kingdom   
Joined: 09/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,511
Location: Somewhere Near Manchester, England
A nice big layout, great, please do not forget to keep us posted with lots of progress photos.

Good luck with your fantastic project

Thanks


Glenn
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Offline NewMB  
#19 Posted : 01 May 2012 09:40:42(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik, sorry I hadn't seen your post until today. Your plan is looking good!

You could use the empty space on the right hand end to make a small country terminus station, or an industry of some kind, with track branching off the upper main line. Alternatively you could reduce the size of the upper loop somewhat so that you can expose more of the lower loop, and have a small station on the lower loop. It could be a harbour station, or something similar.



Like this perhaps..... here I have made the loop smaller and now included some branch line with industry. The tunnel in the background is slightly smaller to create more space for the new tracks.

I will also experiment with a different layout at the top - ie to connect the middle top seperate line with the industry in the top right.

UserPostedImage

Offline NewMB  
#20 Posted : 01 May 2012 09:42:20(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: GlennM Go to Quoted Post
A nice big layout, great, please do not forget to keep us posted with lots of progress photos.

Good luck with your fantastic project

Thanks


Glenn



Hi Glenn, thanks alot. It will be at least 1.5-2 years I think before I even start building....our new house does not even have the basement built yet.

Offline RayF  
#21 Posted : 01 May 2012 10:00:48(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,976
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik, sorry I hadn't seen your post until today. Your plan is looking good!

You could use the empty space on the right hand end to make a small country terminus station, or an industry of some kind, with track branching off the upper main line. Alternatively you could reduce the size of the upper loop somewhat so that you can expose more of the lower loop, and have a small station on the lower loop. It could be a harbour station, or something similar.



Like this perhaps..... here I have made the loop smaller and now included some branch line with industry. The tunnel in the background is slightly smaller to create more space for the new tracks.

I will also experiment with a different layout at the top - ie to connect the middle top seperate line with the industry in the top right.

UserPostedImage



That's exactly the type of plan I was thinking of! ThumpUp
Ray

Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline petestra  
#22 Posted : 01 May 2012 10:27:35(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 26/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 4,264
Location: washington,dc
I really like it a-lot now, Patrik. PeterThumpUp ThumpUp ThumpUp
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Offline NewMB  
#23 Posted : 01 May 2012 11:01:15(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
So here we go with a new version.....this time I have made the loop smaller and extended the seperate line to create another longer and more involving industry area. Total track lenght is now 105.32m! I've also added some stations BigGrin


UserPostedImage
Offline hennabm  
#24 Posted : 01 May 2012 14:01:59(UTC)
hennabm

Scotland   
Joined: 22/09/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,580
Location: Edinburgh,
Hi Patrik

that looks excellent ThumpUp

If it is some time before you even start to build, if you are like me then your ideas will change before you put any screw to the wood.

Good luck. I look forward to watching the progress.

Mike
1957 - 1985 era
What's digital?
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Offline Ian555  
#25 Posted : 01 May 2012 15:17:18(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 18,809
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

Good track plan, all you need to do now, is move it into the middle of the room. Wink Smile

Plenty time to do that, you building the house yourselfs or thro' a company.

Ian.

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Offline NewMB  
#26 Posted : 01 May 2012 15:51:49(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

Good track plan, all you need to do now, is move it into the middle of the room. Wink Smile

Plenty time to do that, you building the house yourselfs or thro' a company.

Ian.




Thanks Ian. I am sure I'll change this plan a few more times, or at least create a couple more to compare with.

A company is doing the work for us, but we have designed the house ourselves Cool Hopefully we can start in June!
Offline petestra  
#27 Posted : 01 May 2012 16:57:54(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 26/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 4,264
Location: washington,dc
Hi Patrik, I just noticed one thing which I think is important. The three main line tracks at the Bonn
station have points/double slip switch going in to the inner loop but you should have the same thing
coming out so that trains leaving the inner loop can switch onto the center or outer tracks too. PeterSmile
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Online steventrain  
#28 Posted : 01 May 2012 17:05:50(UTC)
steventrain

United Kingdom   
Joined: 21/10/2004(UTC)
Posts: 27,578
Location: Northern Ireland
Very good trackplan, It is a Big layout!
Largest Marklinist Layout with Central station 2/Mobile station 2/60174 boosters/C-Tracks/K-Tracks/M-tracks/Favorites class BR01, BR23, BR50, E103, E120/Insider Club membership since 2004.
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Offline Ian555  
#29 Posted : 01 May 2012 17:06:34(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 18,809
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

It's a very exciting time having your own house built.....enjoy it. ThumpUp

Ian.

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Offline BrandonVA  
#30 Posted : 01 May 2012 17:10:47(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,065
Location: VA
Patrik - looks better all the time. Since I seem to be obsessed with the top left, I would suggest display cases could go on the wall at the top here...if you have a desire for such a thing. Just make sure to leave enough room for it (if there is not already).

-Brandon
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Offline scraigen  
#31 Posted : 01 May 2012 18:50:27(UTC)
scraigen


Joined: 29/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 75
Location: Sheffield,
Hi

A couple of suggestions/questions if I may.

I'd give the station area much bigger prominence, you have so much space, but don't seem to have given much of it to the station. What is the longest train you'd like to fit in your station? One suggestion might be to flip the turntable and sidings so that the turntable is over at the left as far as it will go, with the sidings extending behind the station, with the station moving more towards the centre of that section, or maybe even simpler, could you afford a little more depth and put the station building on the outside of the loop in the centre such that as a viewer you'd see the station from the passengers entrance and then you're looking beyond it to the yard area.

There are three tracks running past the station area - is there space for a platform between them or are you having platforms at two tracks with a straight through in the middle?

Also I'd add a pair of points so that once a train has entered the loop that goes around the station and turntable going clockwise it can get out again without reversing.

Huge space you have there, it'll be really interesting to see how it turns out.

Good Luck

Stu

Marklin - Sheffield S6 - Snooker table plus modest Marklin layout or no snooker table and HUGE layout??????
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Offline NewMB  
#32 Posted : 01 May 2012 19:02:39(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: petestra Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik, I just noticed one thing which I think is important. The three main line tracks at the Bonn
station have points/double slip switch going in to the inner loop but you should have the same thing
coming out so that trains leaving the inner loop can switch onto the center or outer tracks too. PeterSmile




Oops! Thanks for pointing it out. I'll have a go at it!

Offline NewMB  
#33 Posted : 01 May 2012 19:06:22(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: steventrain Go to Quoted Post
Very good trackplan, It is a Big layout!



Thanks Steven. It has always been my dream since childhood to have a BIG Märklin setup Smile


Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

It's a very exciting time having your own house built.....enjoy it. ThumpUp

Ian.




Oh yes. I'll be my 3rd house so very exciting times indeed. Just had a nice email today from the solicitor saying "exchange on 18th May".... can't wait!
Offline NewMB  
#34 Posted : 01 May 2012 19:18:23(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: scraigen Go to Quoted Post
Hi

A couple of suggestions/questions if I may.

I'd give the station area much bigger prominence, you have so much space, but don't seem to have given much of it to the station. What is the longest train you'd like to fit in your station? One suggestion might be to flip the turntable and sidings so that the turntable is over at the left as far as it will go, with the sidings extending behind the station, with the station moving more towards the centre of that section, or maybe even simpler, could you afford a little more depth and put the station building on the outside of the loop in the centre such that as a viewer you'd see the station from the passengers entrance and then you're looking beyond it to the yard area.

There are three tracks running past the station area - is there space for a platform between them or are you having platforms at two tracks with a straight through in the middle?

Also I'd add a pair of points so that once a train has entered the loop that goes around the station and turntable going clockwise it can get out again without reversing.

Huge space you have there, it'll be really interesting to see how it turns out.

Good Luck

Stu



Thanks Stu for the suggestions!

The longest train may be the 8 wagons ICE train have and some other ones of similar lenghts.

I'll have a look at the extra turnouts and also placing the station in the middle to see if that's better. The only "problem" I see with all this is my big wish to have long turnouts to add elegance to the layout. Perhaps only a silly idea, but I think they look so much better than the normal (but easier to work with) turnouts.

Yes, there are approx 50-51mm between the 3 tracks and are specifically planned to have Faller platsforms between them. You may be able to see them on my pictures of my former layout posted in this thread. I believe they are 48mm wide. There's also some 7-8cm in either side of the other loop in the middle table so there is room for manouver if necessary.



Offline NewMB  
#35 Posted : 01 May 2012 19:23:53(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: BrandonVA Go to Quoted Post
Patrik - looks better all the time. Since I seem to be obsessed with the top left, I would suggest display cases could go on the wall at the top here...if you have a desire for such a thing. Just make sure to leave enough room for it (if there is not already).

-Brandon


I have looked at them but for some reason are unable to find them at "normal prices. Paying €500 on a display cabinet is a bit to much IMO.... especially when I can get another nice new Märklin loco for that Laugh

Seriously though, any idea's where I can find some nice, at normal price, display cabinets??

Btw, where in VA are you?? I've spent alot of time around Aquia Harbour, Woodbridge and DC (one of my fav US cities) and just love it there. Except the heat in July..... never forget one 4th July....

Offline scraigen  
#36 Posted : 01 May 2012 19:37:00(UTC)
scraigen


Joined: 29/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 75
Location: Sheffield,
Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post

I'll have a look at the extra turnouts and also placing the station in the middle to see if that's better. The only "problem" I see with all this is my big wish to have long turnouts to add elegance to the layout. Perhaps only a silly idea, but I think they look so much better than the normal (but easier to work with) turnouts.


Yes the wide radius turnouts look great don't they, I've toyed with the idea on my layout but much as I try they're awkward to fit in - Am I missing something but when I've tried to plan using them they only seem to suit the spacing between radius 4 and 5 curves which is different to the spacing of R1, R2 and R3 which is the geometry of the rest of the layout - is there an adjustment piece that spaces them out to R1/R2 spacing?


Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post

Yes, there are approx 50-51mm between the 3 tracks and are specifically planned to have Faller platsforms between them. You may be able to see them on my pictures of my former layout posted in this thread. I believe they are 48mm wide. There's also some 7-8cm in either side of the other loop in the middle table so there is room for manouver if necessary.


Good news, it was difficult to gauge from the plan image if there was enough room for platforms or not.

Seeing how people's layouts progress is the bit that I find most interesting on this forum, so I'll look forward to seeing the plan evolve.

Cheers

Stu
Marklin - Sheffield S6 - Snooker table plus modest Marklin layout or no snooker table and HUGE layout??????
Offline NewMB  
#37 Posted : 01 May 2012 19:44:48(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: scraigen Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post

I'll have a look at the extra turnouts and also placing the station in the middle to see if that's better. The only "problem" I see with all this is my big wish to have long turnouts to add elegance to the layout. Perhaps only a silly idea, but I think they look so much better than the normal (but easier to work with) turnouts.


Yes the wide radius turnouts look great don't they, I've toyed with the idea on my layout but much as I try they're awkward to fit in - Am I missing something but when I've tried to plan using them they only seem to suit the spacing between radius 4 and 5 curves which is different to the spacing of R1, R2 and R3 which is the geometry of the rest of the layout - is there an adjustment piece that spaces them out to R1/R2 spacing?


Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post

Yes, there are approx 50-51mm between the 3 tracks and are specifically planned to have Faller platsforms between them. You may be able to see them on my pictures of my former layout posted in this thread. I believe they are 48mm wide. There's also some 7-8cm in either side of the other loop in the middle table so there is room for manouver if necessary.


Good news, it was difficult to gauge from the plan image if there was enough room for platforms or not.

Seeing how people's layouts progress is the bit that I find most interesting on this forum, so I'll look forward to seeing the plan evolve.

Cheers

Stu



In order to use the wide turnouts (24711/24712) one also have to use 2 24071 at the end. All I did was to add one more 24071 in between to get the space I wanted. Of course this does not corresponce with R1, R2 etc but its close enough and makes the platforms look good.

However, while experimenting with K-Track they do offer a wider selection of track pieces to better suit the wide turnouts.




Offline kbvrod  
#38 Posted : 01 May 2012 20:21:33(UTC)
kbvrod

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,596
Location: Beverly, MA
Hi all,
Patrik,looks great and you have time to make it even better!ThumpUp Keep planning and if you haven't do so,read what others have wrote(here and other forums) on track/layout planning.


Dr Dirt.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by kbvrod
Offline H0  
#39 Posted : 01 May 2012 20:53:49(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 9,318
Hi!
Originally Posted by: scraigen Go to Quoted Post
Am I missing something but when I've tried to plan using them they only seem to suit the spacing between radius 4 and 5 curves which is different to the spacing of R1, R2 and R3 which is the geometry of the rest of the layout - is there an adjustment piece that spaces them out to R1/R2 spacing?
The distance between R1/R2 and R2/R3 is 77 mm, the distance between R3/R4 and R4/R5 is 64 mm.

To compensate for the difference, you need a 24064, a 24077 and a 90° curve (see attachments).

I wouldn't try this with R1/R2 because 64 mm could be too little for long coaches.
I'd avoid R1 anyway. If possible, use R4 and R5 for visible areas - or even R9 and DIY R10.

I'd also avoid 24630 and 24624 on all main lines.

So far all Märklin coaches can run on R1 - but for S shaped curves, some already require a 400 mm radius. So if you build a new layout and can avoid R1, it cannot hurt to do so.

Patrik, nice layout. I get an error message when I click on your pictures. From the pictures I see I cannot tell for sure if R1 is used, but I guess it is.
It's your decision - I would avoid it.

Do you ever attend the MIST5 club meetings at Bedburg? That should be less than 20 km from Erftstadt.
I won't be there on Star Wars day (May the Force/fourth) but hope to make it for the June meeting. See www.mist5.de

Edited by user 01 May 2012 20:59:33(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

H0 attached the following image(s):
064to077.PNG
064to077b.PNG
Regards
Tom
---
Happy customer of Roco, Piko, Fleischmann, ESU, Brawa, Liliput, Rivarossi, Lima, ... - and will happily continue to buy locos that run well out of the box. I'm also happy with 95% of my Märklin items, but will avoid a few cost-optimized items made 2011 or later.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by H0
Offline NewMB  
#40 Posted : 01 May 2012 21:26:20(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Hi!
Originally Posted by: scraigen Go to Quoted Post
Am I missing something but when I've tried to plan using them they only seem to suit the spacing between radius 4 and 5 curves which is different to the spacing of R1, R2 and R3 which is the geometry of the rest of the layout - is there an adjustment piece that spaces them out to R1/R2 spacing?
The distance between R1/R2 and R2/R3 is 77 mm, the distance between R3/R4 and R4/R5 is 64 mm.

To compensate for the difference, you need a 24064, a 24077 and a 90° curve (see attachments).

I wouldn't try this with R1/R2 because 64 mm could be too little for long coaches.
I'd avoid R1 anyway. If possible, use R4 and R5 for visible areas - or even R9 and DIY R10.

I'd also avoid 24630 and 24624 on all main lines.

So far all Märklin coaches can run on R1 - but for S shaped curves, some already require a 400 mm radius. So if you build a new layout and can avoid R1, it cannot hurt to do so.

Patrik, nice layout. I get an error message when I click on your pictures. From the pictures I see I cannot tell for sure if R1 is used, but I guess it is.
It's your decision - I would avoid it.

Do you ever attend the MIST5 club meetings at Bedburg? That should be less than 20 km from Erftstadt.
I won't be there on Star Wars day (May the Force/fourth) but hope to make it for the June meeting. See www.mist5.de



Thanks for the link! No, never heard of them but will for sure check them out. Yes, Bedburg is not far. Currently I live in Balkhausen (Bei Türnich) but Erftstadt (well, Bliesheim actually) is where I will live once the house is finished. Guess the wife would kill me if I tried to convince her to come along to a Märklin meet...hehe, she has enough of my Volvo Bertone Club as it is already (another interest of mine - Volvo!).

There is no R1 on any main lines (fast routes) except a few pcs and these happens to be in a tunnel. Rest is R2, R3, R4 etc. Tried not to use them actually. I will have a look tomorrow and see if I can get rid of them. I have used some R1 curves on service/industry routes. No 24630 or 24624 except on some service/industry routes.

The pics can not be enlarged due my taking of the link from Flicks. I can happy email the file so that you can have a look at it if you wanted to.



Offline H0  
#41 Posted : 01 May 2012 22:17:44(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 9,318
No, thank you, I don't need larger versions of your track plans. They will see some changes before you start building.

It's just that you have a URL element around the IMG element. You can remove the URL tag if it only leads to an error message. The pictures will still show if you only leave the IMG element (from img tag to /img tag).

Some non-Märklin stuff will derail on R1 - nice if R1 is used on tunnels only. Flapper

Get a Big Boy for test runs before you install catenary masts and tunnel portals.

Edited by user 01 May 2012 22:24:33(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Regards
Tom
---
Happy customer of Roco, Piko, Fleischmann, ESU, Brawa, Liliput, Rivarossi, Lima, ... - and will happily continue to buy locos that run well out of the box. I'm also happy with 95% of my Märklin items, but will avoid a few cost-optimized items made 2011 or later.
Offline Nielsenr  
#42 Posted : 02 May 2012 02:22:31(UTC)
Nielsenr

United States   
Joined: 06/10/2010(UTC)
Posts: 820
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
Patrik,

To add another diagram to the one Tom supplied, here is one that shows the tracks required for a siding on a straight run of track to get the wider track spacing when using 247XX turnouts. Hope this helps.

UserPostedImage

Robert
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Offline Mark5  
#43 Posted : 02 May 2012 03:16:42(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 792
Location: Montreal
Welcome to forum NewMB ThumpUp

Great to read the discussion and this thread since I am making plans with constant revisions for my layout.

One thing I am learning is that just trying a layout in different configuration with existing track that I have and seeing and thinking about what I can/could build.

Having the hands on aspect in the planning makes so much sense as some in this forum had suggested to me.
Because you may find that after all the investment and attempts, you may want to do radical changes.
You obviously know a lot from your previous extensive layout.

I totally agree with the suggestion for some slow natural curves, and also if anything radical I might suggest is to consider an underlayer or shadow yard as many others here have. Personally I love to see the multiple layers with bridges and secret places for trains to hide.
Ask yourself, what kind of story/narrative are you creating with your layout.

The other thing I find is that we all have a tendency to put a bit too much clutter on our sets.
As an artist I always ask: "what do you want to look at, where do you want to draw the eye of the viewer"... and that requires visual focus.
Give yourself time to think and do lots of experiments... these are things I am telling myself.
Or course, I have little girls working with me, so my experiments have been carpetbahns!

Cheers and I hope you enjoy the forum and keep us updated with your progress.
If not, the Fat controller aka Topham Hat will come and give you work orders!
- Mark BigGrin
Interested in history of DB, DR and FS from about 1955 to 1965
Fan of signals and catenary; stations and yards. Is there anything else?

thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Mark5
Offline NewMB  
#44 Posted : 02 May 2012 09:09:02(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: MM-MarkMontreal Go to Quoted Post
Welcome to forum NewMB ThumpUp

Great to read the discussion and this thread since I am making plans with constant revisions for my layout.

One thing I am learning is that just trying a layout in different configuration with existing track that I have and seeing and thinking about what I can/could build.

Having the hands on aspect in the planning makes so much sense as some in this forum had suggested to me.
Because you may find that after all the investment and attempts, you may want to do radical changes.
You obviously know a lot from your previous extensive layout.

I totally agree with the suggestion for some slow natural curves, and also if anything radical I might suggest is to consider an underlayer or shadow yard as many others here have. Personally I love to see the multiple layers with bridges and secret places for trains to hide.
Ask yourself, what kind of story/narrative are you creating with your layout.

The other thing I find is that we all have a tendency to put a bit too much clutter on our sets.
As an artist I always ask: "what do you want to look at, where do you want to draw the eye of the viewer"... and that requires visual focus.
Give yourself time to think and do lots of experiments... these are things I am telling myself.
Or course, I have little girls working with me, so my experiments have been carpetbahns!

Cheers and I hope you enjoy the forum and keep us updated with your progress.
If not, the Fat controller aka Topham Hat will come and give you work orders!
- Mark BigGrin


Hi Mark,

Thanks for the Welcome!

Planning a new layout is both daunting and really interesting at the same time. I have now done one I feel quite happy with but need to do a few more to make sure I am really going for the right one! I am sure that while building it, I will make changes. I certainly did so on my previous small (but complicated) layout. Space was the main issue there, not so at this new place as the room is 11.4m long!

Re the shadow yard, I had this before and never used it. Again I believe this to be thanks to the limited space I had and I have considered it for this one. One big problem is to keep it clean though IMO. Of course, a stagging yard does not have to have any special things added to it except tracks.

Yes, I did a mistake by cluttering my smaller layout. I blame this on the fact that size, again, was the problem and the very first time I did my own "proper" layout. But I do believe that the new layout will not be so cluttered due to the size and I from the very outset did/does not want to many tracks.

Of course there will be a nice new thread under the "Me and my Layout" section once I start.

Patrik


Offline NewMB  
#45 Posted : 02 May 2012 09:59:45(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
I have now done some smaller adjustments to the trackplan and the location of the Roundhouse etc. This gives more space to the station.

I have also added some wide turnouts so that all loops can be reached with no reversing.

Again, opinions and comments welcome.

UserPostedImage
Offline NewMB  
#46 Posted : 02 May 2012 10:03:52(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
No, thank you, I don't need larger versions of your track plans. They will see some changes before you start building.

It's just that you have a URL element around the IMG element. You can remove the URL tag if it only leads to an error message. The pictures will still show if you only leave the IMG element (from img tag to /img tag).

Some non-Märklin stuff will derail on R1 - nice if R1 is used on tunnels only. Flapper

Get a Big Boy for test runs before you install catenary masts and tunnel portals.



A Big Boy is on order (on it's way to me now) and the only things I have which are non-Marklin stuff comes from Jeco, Brawa and NMJ.

A lot of test runs will have to be made Smile

Offline petestra  
#47 Posted : 02 May 2012 10:19:48(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 26/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 4,264
Location: washington,dc
It's going to be one super layout, Patrik. The Wintrack software is just such a wonderful planner.
PeterThumpUp Smile
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Offline NewMB  
#48 Posted : 02 May 2012 13:33:01(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 354
Location: Erftstadt
And here's a version with the station in the very middle. Not so sure about this one..... comments pls.

UserPostedImage


And as a "reminder" - here's the original one that now looks pretty much done.

UserPostedImage
Offline petestra  
#49 Posted : 02 May 2012 14:07:34(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 26/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 4,264
Location: washington,dc
Hi Patrick, I like the Bonn station in the center. I think it looks more prototypical to have points upon entering/leaving
rather than just on one side. I have more on one side than the other but I had no choice as individual tracks needed
their climbs/descents to begin at the end of the station. PeterThumpUp
Offline Ian555  
#50 Posted : 02 May 2012 14:47:17(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 18,809
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

Where do you intend to sit/stand to control the layout, or will you be mobile on your iphone. Smile

Ian.

Edited by user 02 May 2012 17:02:59(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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