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Offline NZMarklinist  
#1 Posted : 11 January 2012 12:01:33(UTC)
NZMarklinist

New Zealand   
Joined: 15/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,757
Location: Auckland NZ
Hi All,
I was looking at the Esu Loks on Youtube and found this short vid demonstrating the exhasut smoke feature, very cool, I think I feel a 218 maybe coming to Akl this year, maybe Wink ;

Glen
Auckland NZ

" Every Marklin layout needs a V200, a Railbus and a Banana car", not to mention a few Black and red Steamers, oh and the odd Elok !

CS1 Reloaded, Touch Cab, C Track Modules, K track layout all under construction. Currently Insider
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#2 Posted : 11 January 2012 21:35:11(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
My ESU Br215 arrived a couple of days ago. I've got mixed feelings about it, so far.
Offline river6109  
#3 Posted : 12 January 2012 00:42:40(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,614
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
My ESU Br215 arrived a couple of days ago. I've got mixed feelings about it, so far.


Dave,

when you had a good run and get used to the loco could you elaborate a bit more about the mixed feelings you've got about your locos ?

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline NZMarklinist  
#4 Posted : 12 January 2012 01:45:10(UTC)
NZMarklinist

New Zealand   
Joined: 15/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,757
Location: Auckland NZ
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
My ESU Br215 arrived a couple of days ago. I've got mixed feelings about it, so far.



Dave I'm sure we'll all be interested in your findings.
After looking at a few more youtube vids of the different models and then reading the comments on them I think there are a lot of owners and their friends with mixed feelings, particularly about the smoke operation which is the big interest for me Unsure Glare
Glen
Auckland NZ

" Every Marklin layout needs a V200, a Railbus and a Banana car", not to mention a few Black and red Steamers, oh and the odd Elok !

CS1 Reloaded, Touch Cab, C Track Modules, K track layout all under construction. Currently Insider
Offline rjftrains  
#5 Posted : 12 January 2012 04:07:10(UTC)
rjftrains


Joined: 14/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 58
Location: Katonah, NY
I don't have one of these, but I have seen it in action -- both at the Nurnberg Toy Fair and the Marklin Treff last year (and I'm sure I'll see it in Nurnberg again in a couple of weeks). I've been very impressed with it. I'm not sure what the "issues" are regarding the smoke; it appears to work just fine.

As an ESU dealer, I wish I could import these into the US. Unfortunately, patent infringemnt issues with (of all things) the smoke are keeping these models out of the US market for the time being. I hope ESU gets this settled as I think this is a very, very nice model.
Robert Frowenfeld
RJFtrains@aol.com
www.RJFtrains.com
914-232-5546
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#6 Posted : 12 January 2012 08:55:30(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: rjftrains Go to Quoted Post
I'm not sure what the "issues" are regarding the smoke; it appears to work just fine.


According to reports on Stummis, the exhausts tend to block up, thus preventing smoke. The first (and only) time I tried the smoke function, I could only get one exhaust working, not both.

It seems my Br215 was taken out of the box and played with before it was sent to me. When I got it, it appeared that the loco had not been secured to its base, so the loco had moved around inside the box while being shipped. One of the ladders was twisted, and broke off when I tried to straighten it. One of the rear buffers was broken off, and the other buffer broke off when I was shunting the loco to join up with some passenger coaches.

Even worse was that the pickup shoe had become separated from the copper arms that hold it onto the loco. I still haven't managed to put it back together, and if I did, I think it would break again. I ended up fitting a Marklin slider of similar size to it. The loco is otherwise undamaged, and it's not worth sending it back to the Lokshop. Traction, with 2 rubber tyres (one front, one rear), is not great, as it could only struggle to pull four 24cm tin plate coaches up the inclines on my layout, whereas Marklin locos can easily pull seven. For all the hoppla, the ESU motor has no where near as much torque as a Marklin DCM motor, let alone a C-sine. The loco is certainly heavy enough, but it seems the motor couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding! The gearboxes on each bogie are driven by cardan shafts from the centrally mounted motor.

I have some Bullfrog Snot on the way to me from the US (thanks Mike!), so I will try applying some of that to see if it improves the traction.

The sound on the loco is superb, and the decoder registered all 21 functions on the Ecos. I was able to easily set up DCC running on the CS2 for this loco, with 16 functions.

I suspect the Loksound 4 power pack has been fitted to this loco, as the sound still operates for about 5 seconds after the stop button is pressed on the controller.

Dave Banks sent me some pictures of a ESU Br151 belonging to a friend of his, which suffered similar damage to the pickup shoe as mine, so mine was not an isolated case. Unfortunately, the Br151 also sustained other more serious damage, such that the loco will have to go back to Germany. ESU need to review their packaging and quality standards I think.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Bigdaddynz
Offline river6109  
#7 Posted : 12 January 2012 09:27:03(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,614
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Dave,

So your opionion is, ESU's packaging isn't up to standard to be shipped internationally or is it Lokshop who hasn't put it in a proper box or both ?

Most videos I've seen the smoke generator wans't even activated so one couldn't get an opinion about the time and strenght of the smoke lasting.

Suppose you will give as an review report of the loco in due course.

I was thinking installing a smoke generator into my Marklin Diesel locos but haven't had a proper look if it is possible to do so and secondly it wouldn't be exhailing more smoke by increasing the speed.
Another point could be is it worth the money ?

John

https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#8 Posted : 12 January 2012 09:40:19(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
The ESU boxes look sturdy enough, it's just that in these two instances, the locos haven't been fastened to the base plate in the box. Dave suspects his friends Br151 sheered off its mounting plate, with mine, I'm not sure if it was ever put on it.
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#9 Posted : 13 January 2012 10:57:06(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
UserPostedImage

The box looks sturdy enough......


UserPostedImage

.....but when opened, it was obvious the loco had either come off its mounting point, or had never been put back on the mounting point.


UserPostedImage

Shoe missing from the slider.


UserPostedImage

I didn't notice the paint damage until I saw it on this photo. Probably more damage through the loco moving around in the box. Note the missing rear buffers.


UserPostedImage


UserPostedImage

The loco is quite detailed, but seems to have many parts that could be easily broken off.
Offline NZMarklinist  
#10 Posted : 13 January 2012 12:07:41(UTC)
NZMarklinist

New Zealand   
Joined: 15/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,757
Location: Auckland NZ
Dave,
Thanks for sharing, ThumpUp sorry to hear that things are less than perfect Sad
It is a good looking model tho, Smile but you'd like the smoke to be working as this is the biggy with the model Unsure
Glen
Auckland NZ

" Every Marklin layout needs a V200, a Railbus and a Banana car", not to mention a few Black and red Steamers, oh and the odd Elok !

CS1 Reloaded, Touch Cab, C Track Modules, K track layout all under construction. Currently Insider
Offline RayF  
#11 Posted : 13 January 2012 13:12:52(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,837
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Hi David,

Lovely model! Pity about all the damage, though. Have you sent photos of the damage to the person who sent it to you? I think he owes you at least a refund, if not a replacement.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline river6109  
#12 Posted : 13 January 2012 15:36:04(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,614
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Dave, I would contact ESU and tell them how you've received your loco, it isn't good for the company to have this type of damage being aired without some explanation from the dealer and they would be horryfied to hear they way it was packed.

I know you said it isn't worth sending it back, I would and get a full refund including the freight costs back.

It doesn't give ESU a good name.

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline GSRR  
#13 Posted : 13 January 2012 18:25:13(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Dave,

most unfortunate. I was looking forward to the BR218 but if there is an established problem with the smoke units and the clearly deficient packaging I'll pass for now.

It would seem that the box was designed as a fit all sizes design. Was there any foam insert you pulled out, or is there really that much room inside for the lok to move around in? No wonder parts came off and the paint was scraped.

Hopefully the dealer makes good.



r/Thomas




ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#14 Posted : 13 January 2012 20:49:36(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
Hi Thomas, no there was no foam insert. The loco is supposed to be mounted onto the plastic base with a screw to keep it in place. One of the plastic stays you see in picture #2 helping to support the loco was also bent.


The loco came from Lokshop, I haven't as yet confirmed with them it's arrival.
Offline GSRR  
#15 Posted : 13 January 2012 23:03:08(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Well Dave I hope they do the right thing. As for the box at the cost of pennies they could add some more foam around the lok!


r/Thomas



ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#16 Posted : 17 January 2012 12:39:03(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: NZMarklinist Go to Quoted Post
.....there are a lot of owners and their friends with mixed feelings, particularly about the smoke operation which is the big interest for me.



Originally Posted by: rjftrains Go to Quoted Post
I'm not sure what the "issues" are regarding the smoke; it appears to work just fine.



Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
According to reports on Stummis, the exhausts tend to block up, thus preventing smoke. The first (and only) time I tried the smoke function, I could only get one exhaust working, not both.



Originally Posted by: NZMarklinist Go to Quoted Post
.......but you'd like the smoke to be working as this is the biggy with the model Unsure



Originally Posted by: GSRR Go to Quoted Post
.....if there is an established problem with the smoke units....




I had another play with the smoke function today, while the loco was running on a friend's layout. Firstly, it is important not to completely flood the exhausts with smoke fluid - you should fill it to about 3/4 full max. If after a minute or two of running the loco with the smoke units on (and fluid in the smoke units) there is no smoke being generated, or smoke is coming out of one exhaust only, stop the loco, and give a short sharp blow down the exhausts. This will clear the exhausts of any air bubbles blocking the exhausts, and in my experience resulted in smoke from both exhausts every time.

You get a smoke trickle from the exhausts when the loco is idling, which ramps up to a steady stream when the loco is throttled up. It looks quite impressive, although the smoke is white at all times. If ESU could find a way to make the exhaust smoke black at throttle up, and then whiten up as the loco levels out it's speed, this would be a very impressive achievement. Even so as it is, it is quite an achievement as it is. I ended up having to turn the smoke unit off, as everyone was getting 'high' on smoke fluid fumes!

Getting the smoke working was the highlight of the day. Pity finding out that my 37607 VT 11.5 Tee Railcar has a naff decoder was the lowlight!
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Bigdaddynz
Offline GSRR  
#17 Posted : 17 January 2012 13:39:17(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
.
The loco came from Lokshop, I haven't as yet confirmed with them it's arrival.



So will you be returning this Lok?



ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline GSRR  
#18 Posted : 07 December 2012 16:35:42(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Dave,

any updates with your Lok?


r/Thomas


ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#19 Posted : 07 December 2012 21:45:08(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
Hi Thomas. I told Roland Baer at the Lokshop about the troubles, but I decided not to send it back (I sent them the photos in this thread so that they can talk to ESU about it). Lokshop sent out a replacement slider, and I repaired the paint damage myself, using a DB paint repair kit from Humbrol that a friend owns. The kit is no longer available, but the paint was a direct match to that on the Br215.

I haven't tried the bullfrog snot on the loco as yet to fix traction issues.
Offline GSRR  
#20 Posted : 07 December 2012 22:48:07(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
Hi Thomas. I told Roland Baer at the Lokshop about the troubles, but I decided not to send it back (I sent them the photos in this thread so that they can talk to ESU about it). Lokshop sent out a replacement slider, and I repaired the paint damage myself, using a DB paint repair kit from Humbrol that a friend owns. The kit is no longer available, but the paint was a direct match to that on the Br215.

I haven't tried the bullfrog snot on the loco as yet to fix traction issues.




Hi Dave. I suppose you did not want to deal with shipping it back?

Would you still get another ESU model say the BR218?

On the traction issue, I take it that is on an incline with some wagons?

How does it run on C track and through the turnouts?


r/Thomas


ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#21 Posted : 07 December 2012 23:59:26(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,659
Location: New Zealand
Yes, it was the shipping hassle that stopped me. I'd consider another ESU model. I was looking at the Br151 - johnvandamme had some on ebay, and although they sold ok, he said he wouldn't be stocking them again. Joachim said they were made in South Korea, and he gave the impression that he thought they were crap.

My Br215 runs fine on C and M track, through all types of turnouts (normal, curved, 3 way and slip switches). The traction issue was in regard to inclines.
Offline GSRR  
#22 Posted : 17 December 2012 00:24:44(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
Yes, it was the shipping hassle that stopped me. I'd consider another ESU model. I was looking at the Br151 - johnvandamme had some on ebay, and although they sold ok, he said he wouldn't be stocking them again. Joachim said they were made in South Korea, and he gave the impression that he thought they were crap.

My Br215 runs fine on C and M track, through all types of turnouts (normal, curved, 3 way and slip switches). The traction issue was in regard to inclines.




Thanks Dave. Let us know if the green snot fixes your incline problems, shame not to be able to pull a long train.



r/Thomas


ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
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