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Offline H0  
#1 Posted : 03 January 2011 11:54:55(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 9,166
Central Station 60212 Reloaded V. 3.3.3 (a. k. a. CS1 reloaded or CS1R)

This is a review, this is not an attempt to write a manual.

I only use the CS1 to run my trains and cannot say anything about the Shuttle Train feature, S88 feedback and other areas.
I'm trying to write a neutral review in the first part, giving my personal reflections in the second part.


Here's a photo of the CS1 reloaded:
UserPostedImage
The display is monochrome with orange backlights. Display resolution is QVGA (320 x 240 pixels).
The photo is not very good, in reality the display has a better contrast.

Here's a "faked" screen shot (screen shots come out black on white, orange was added by me):
UserPostedImage

While I think the orange looks better, the remaining screen shots will be black on white:
UserPostedImage

This is an image at the true size of 320 x 240 (but because this is too small on current high-resolution computer displays, the other screenshots are resized to 200 %):
UserPostedImage

So back to the re-sized image: on the left I selected a DCC loco, on the right an mfx loco:
UserPostedImage
I prefer 28 speed steps for locos (for DCC locos I can choose between 14, 28, and 126 speed steps, for mfx between 28 and 126 speed steps).
Functions F0 through F7 can be selected either using the black keys beside the display or with the touch screen. F8 through F15 (F19 for DCC locos) can be activated via touch screen only.

I cleared the right controller and placed an mfx loco on the track (the gauge control in the upper left corner shows the progress of mfx registration):
UserPostedImage
A complete mfx registration takes about one minute because CS1/CS1R reads the whole set of mfx information during the registration; later all settings can be changed without requiring further reading of mfx settings.

Registration has finished and there is an "M4" button next to each controller that can be used to select the loco for that controller:
UserPostedImage
"M4" is the name ESU uses for mfx - same protocol, only different names.

After pressing the "M4" button for the right controller, the new mfx loco is shown there (using 126 speed steps and with the default loco symbol):
UserPostedImage

After switching to 28 speed steps and with a different loco image, it looks like this:
UserPostedImage

One feature I use a lot: the button at the bottom right in the middle (with the two locos and two arrows) allows to swap the locos between the two controller:
UserPostedImage
If there is only one loco running, I normally have it on the right controller. With two locos running: right controller, right track; left controller, left track.

Another nice feature: the Multi Mode: you see speed and direction of five locos and can use the function keys for the selected loco.
UserPostedImage
Very useful when shunting involves more than two locos.

Here I selected an empty slot:
UserPostedImage

The loco selection screen:
UserPostedImage
Here you see locos in a list, either sorted by name (button "ABC"), optionally with active (i. e. running) locos first (button "(A)") or sorted by address (button "123").
This screen provides many different filters: The buttons "1", "2", and "3" are your three favourite lists.
The loco buttons "Steam", "Diesel", and "Electric" filter locos by propulsion.
And the most selective filter is the address field on the right. I entered "85" and the CS1R only shows locos that have this address (mfx locos are selected by there MM address even though the address is not used for running; therefore it's no problem that the BR 85 (mfx) and the BR 185 both have address 85).

Here's the screen with the newly selected BR 185 on the left (using M14 with 14 speed steps because the new hobby decoders do not support more speed steps) and with a BR 120 on the right (it's Märklin #37538, a loco that came with a pre-installed ESU OEM decoder that supports 28 speed steps).
UserPostedImage

Here you see the Edit Loco screen for the BR 120.
UserPostedImage
The check boxes "Loco list 1" through "Loco list 3" are used for filtering in the loco selection; any combination can be set.

The available protocols (part 1 of 2):
UserPostedImage

The available protocols (part 2 of 2):
UserPostedImage

The loco image selection list (showing user-defined locos here):
UserPostedImage

An on-screen keyboard is used to edit the name of the loco:
UserPostedImage

Function keys can be modified here (symbols are selected from the lists):
UserPostedImage
Version 3.3.3 supports 20 functions for DCC locos and 16 functions for mfx locos.

I won't show all loco settings. Here's the screen where you specify acceleration and braking times (shown as seconds, not as register values) and speed:
UserPostedImage

The current monitor of the CS1R, showing current and track voltage.
UserPostedImage
The CS1 reloaded package includes an adjustable wide-range switching mode power supply (input 100 through 240 V AC, output 15 through 21 V DC stabilized, max. 5 A).

The keyboard screen with the four "digital" turnouts I have on my layout:
UserPostedImage
CS1R supports up to 2048 accessories, so I'm not near the limit yet ...

The "layout" I created for my four turnouts:
UserPostedImage

Here's how my turnouts look on the real layout (but I couldn't find a symmetric representation in the CS1R):
UserPostedImage

The General Settings of the CS1R:
UserPostedImage
Brightness and contrast of the display can be adjusted here and the limit of the booster can be set (it's 4 A for CS1R while the CS1 before the upgrade was limited to 2.8 A).

Part 1 of the languages list (German is missing, but is also on the list):
UserPostedImage

Part 2 of the languages list:
UserPostedImage
I only tested German and English.

The devices screen:
UserPostedImage

Connected Mobile Stations are also listed as devices here:
UserPostedImage
CS1R version 3.3.3 supports MS1s only (MS2 cannot be used with CS1 version 3.3.3).

The properties of the Mobile Station where you select the ten locos that will show on the Mobile Station:
UserPostedImage
Loco selection uses the same filters we already saw on the other screen, only the address filter is not available.

Now the locos are selected and the list was sorted using the up and down buttons:
UserPostedImage

This is how the screen looks after selecting a loco that is currently active on the Mobile Station:
UserPostedImage
I can see speed and active functions, but cannot change anything.

By the way: look at function key 5 on the left side:
UserPostedImage
The famous "squealing brakes off" function, sometimes only called "squealing brakes" has caused a lot irritation.
The symbol currently in use with CS1R shows pretty good what this function does (but you still have to activate the operating sounds to hear the brakes).

Back to setup:
UserPostedImage
With "Show numbers of existing functions" you get these small numbers next to each function symbol. Since some locos have 8 or more speaker symbols on the screen for their various sound functions, these numbers make it easier when you reference the loco manual.
And "Immediate stop of DCC locos at direction change" is another "cool" feature (as long as it is turned off): When I change the direction of a running DCC or mfx loco, the loco will stop using its braking delay, will then change direction and accelerate also with its delay.
I love this and use it very often: I wait till the loco is on a turnout, then I change its direction (I use long braking delays so the loco stops behind the turnout) and switch the turnout - and that's all.
MM locos do not support this; so MM locos still must be set to 0, then wait till it stops, then reverse the direction and accelerate again - with DCC and mfx loco a single click does it.
Because the delays are used, I can even change the speed before or after reversing - makes no difference if I do it quickly enough.

The setup screen showing my four turnouts with their German default names (normally my CS1R "speaks" German, but I used English for the review).
UserPostedImage

The Track Signals screen also has new features after the upgrade:
UserPostedImage
mfx (called "M4" here) can be turned off allowing mfx locos to be run with the MM protocol (if you want to do this - for whatever reason you may have (this allows testing locos that won't register automatically)).
"Create assymmetric track signal" (sic) reduces the flickering of lights for locos with 6080 or 6090 decoder (the problem is not the decoder, but the wiring of the lamps but it's a problem that all locos with 6080 or 6090 decoder and light bulbs share).
I never tried Selectrix. All my decoders that support Selectrix also support DCC so I use them with DCC.

The Network settings, here used without DHCP (while I was using a crossed cable between PC and CS1R):
UserPostedImage

After wiring CS1R to my DSL router, I could use DHCP:
UserPostedImage

The Shuttle Train screen:
UserPostedImage
I never tested this feature so I cannot comment it.

This is the setup screen used to program DCC decoders:
UserPostedImage
Works pretty good (but I can still do it faster using the real keys of my Intellibox than using the touch screen of the CS1R).

The screen where you program MM decoders (reading is not supported):
UserPostedImage

CS1R can search for the address of MM decoders (in the range 1 through 255; the motor is turned on to detect the loco):
UserPostedImage

Access Authorization:
UserPostedImage
(I never used this; probably good for trade fairs, shop displays and to prevent "damage" by children)

I never used this screen, either:
UserPostedImage
So far I never had to delete all locos.

And finally the Info screen:
UserPostedImage
The serial number has been faked ...

When connected to a PC or a network, a browser can be used to access the CS1R.
Here's the Start page with an Info screen:
UserPostedImage

CS1R allows to download objects lists (including the loco list) to be downloaded in Excel format:
UserPostedImage

You can upload and/or download your own loco images:
UserPostedImage
CS1R and ECoS 50000 only support small monochrome images, the new ECoS 50200 with colour display supports thumbnail photos.

Here's a part of my user-defined loco image list:
UserPostedImage

Firmware updates are uploaded through the web browser:
UserPostedImage
Usually there is one major upgrade per quarter.

Web browser is also used to create backups:
UserPostedImage

You probably guessed it: the web browser is also used to restore those backups:
UserPostedImage

You can click on "Display" to see the screen contents of the CS1R (embedded in the frame of an ECoS):
UserPostedImage
The contents are update periodically.

Function Mapping
The CS1 supported function mapping for mfx decoders with version 2.0.3 (maybe even earlier).
The function mapping screen is a large grid: at the top are the available functions (function outputs such as lights, ABD on/off, shunting mode, sounds for sound decoders).
UserPostedImage
The "+" buttons at the top row came with CS1R, but even with the "unreloaded" CS1 you could click there to change the intensity and mode of the lights.

For an mfx decoder it looks like this:
UserPostedImage
Light intensity can be set from 0 through 255, 153 is 60 %.

For an ESU DCC decoder it looks like this:
UserPostedImage
Biggest difference: light intensity can only be set in the range 0 through 15.


Additional Information
CS1 is no longer maintained by Märklin. Software version 2.0.4 is the latest release published by Märklin and still available for download.
CS1 us limited to 2.8 A booster output.
The CS1R package includes a crossed Ethernet cable (used for direct connections between CS1 and a PC) and a 90 VA power supply, a plastic pen for the touchpad and a CD-R created for the serial number of your CS1.
The upgrade software supports German only as far as I know. I pushed the CD-R in, pressed "Next" a couple of times, then I had to wait about 15 minutes and the upgrade was done.
Language can be a problem if errors occur during setup (but there are at least two fora in the world where you can ask for help).
CS1R is much faster than CS1 when it comes to switching screens. It brings many new features such a Multi Mode, DCC support, direction change with ABD for running locos, 28 speed steps for mfx locos, easy function mapping for ESU DCC decoders.
I never had batteries in my CS1, that's why you see the battery with the question mark on the screen shots. CS1 won't forget anything without batteries as long as it's always shut down properly. With fresh batteries, you can simply pull the plug and the CS1 will shut down automatically.
Currently a CS1R cannot be used as a slave with a CS2. A CS1 can be the slave of a CS2.
Both CS1 and CS1R can use a CS2 as slave connected to the sniffer port.
MS2s can be used if connected to the sniffer port, they cannot be connected to the Mobile Station ports of the CS1/CS1R.

Comparing CS1R and CS2
Both CS1R version 3.3.3 and CS2 version 1.5.0 support function mapping for mfx decoders.
CS1R also supports function mapping for ESU DCC decoders.
CS1R reduces the flickering of light bulbs in locos with 6080 or 6090 decoders.
CS1R allows mfx decoders to be used with 28 speed steps. mfx can be switched off.
CS1R supports Selectrix.

Personal Reflections
Some say that ECoS, CS1 reloaded, CS1 are for techies. Maybe I'm a techie, but I like the CS1R and I find the UI quite intuitive (with very few exceptions) and could use almost everything without using the manual.
I find the CS2 slightly less intuitive, but I also managed to use it with a little trial and error.

CS1R Features I Miss When Using a CS2
I like the loco selection screen of the CS1/CS1R much better (but I also use the Windows Explorer in Details mode only): all locos in a single row, sorted by name or by address. CS2 shows them in a grid, much like the Icons view of the Windows Explorer. Some may prefer that view, but I know the name of the loco I'm looking for and a sorted list in a single row is the fastest way to find it. The filtering helps a lot: when looking for a Diesel, there are only Diesel locos in the list, same for steam or electric. This makes scrolling much more easy.
When I change the direction of a driving mfx or DCC loco, it will slow down with its braking delay, then reverse the direction, and then accelerate with its delay (does not work for MM locos).
CS2 uses about 64 virtual speed steps for all locos: those with 14 physical speed steps and those with 126 physical speed steps. Some may prefer it that way, but I prefer the way CS1R works: if the loco runs with 14 speed steps, then it takes 14 clicks on the knob from standstill to full speed, with 126 speed steps it takes more clicks (but I never use more than 28 speed steps). This allows me to keep my eyes on the loco and still have good control over its speed by counting the clicks.
Just like with the CS2, speed can be selected by clicking on the dial - the number of speed steps makes no difference then.

CS2 Features I Miss When Using a CS1R
There is nothing that I really miss, but the CS2 has some advantages.
CS2 offers two ways to update the firmware: from an USB stick or live from the Internet (if connected e. g. to a DSL router). CS1 and CS1R allow updates only through the web browser UI.
USB can be used to connect mouse, PC keyboard, and USB sticks (for updates and/or backups).
I never tried a keyboard and prefer pen on the touch screen over mouse (but mouse can be used to rescue a mis-calibrated touch screen).
Clicking on the dial to select the loco speed works slightly better with CS2 than with CS1R.

Conclusions, Recommendations
CS1R and CS2 have much the same features. If you want photo-realistic loco images, go for CS2 or ECoS 50200. If loco names as text are enough for you, then CS1R or ECoS could be affordable alternatives.
If you want direct control over loco speed steps, try CS1/CS1R or any ECoS. If you prefer an UI that tries to hide the differences between decoders, go for the CS2.
CS2 shows locos for selection in a grid (6 columns, 5 rows). You can have either a "most recently used" list sorted by last usage (this is a default) or a full list sorted by name. If you have more than 30 locos, there will be more than one page. The list cannot be filtered, so if you have more than 30 locos you must find the right page, then locate the loco on that page.
A screen shot can be found here:
http://www.andreas-huste...bdd6ffff8130fffffff0.jpg
I find it easier to find the right loco with the CS1R - especially for large collections.

I prefer the CS1R over the CS2. They do basically the same things in similar ways, but I find CS1R more user-friendly and better suited to my needs and my taste - despite the low-res monochrome screen.
CS2 does some things a different way - and it also has it supporters.

But there are many areas I haven't explored yet: I don't use S88 feedback, I don't use the Shuttle Train feature, I don't use PC control.

Edited by user 03 January 2011 13:39:25(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Regards
Tom
---
Happy customer of Roco, Piko, Fleischmann, ESU, Brawa, Liliput, Rivarossi, Lima, ... - and will happily continue to buy locos that run well out of the box. I'm also happy with 95% of my Märklin items, but will avoid a few cost-optimized items made 2011 or later.
thanks 4 users liked this useful post by H0
Offline mmervine  
#2 Posted : 03 January 2011 14:37:11(UTC)
mmervine

United States   
Joined: 30/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,590
Location: Spofford, NH
Tom-nice job! I just upgraded my ECoS to V3.3.3 a few days ago. I had not updated it since 3.0.1 and I was amazed at all of the improvements. Your review does a nice job of describing the features of the CS1 reloaded and ECoS!
Märklin C-track, Digital, ECoS, multi-era French & Swiss
http://www.ete-ene.org/MMLayout.htm
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#3 Posted : 03 January 2011 23:18:08(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 13,853
Location: New Zealand
Thanks Tom, that's a lot of work you've put into that post, much appreciated.

I want to upgrade my CS1 to Reloaded this year, and I also hope to try 'bridging' the CS1R and CS2 together with something like iTrains, which supports multiple controllers.
Offline Webmaster  
#4 Posted : 03 January 2011 23:46:21(UTC)
Webmaster


Joined: 25/07/2001(UTC)
Posts: 9,484
Thanks Tom, very much appreciated! ThumpUp

I am myself "inbetween controllers", either do I keep the CS1 in original format and get a CS2 so I can connect the CS1 without problems, or I upgrade to "reloaded" (actually had it on order but cancelled it sínce it took so long...)...

The perfect thing would be if you could control the CS/Ecos screen from the computer too in the web browser, and just not have it as a display since (to be honest) the original screen does not have the best clarity/visibility around today...
Juhan - "Webmaster", at your service...
He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes. He who does not ask a question remains a fool forever. [Old Chinese Proverb]
Offline DaleSchultz  
#5 Posted : 04 January 2011 00:15:26(UTC)
DaleSchultz

United States   
Joined: 10/02/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,110
I found this interesting as I have not played with any of these controllers. (My Intellibox still does (almost) everything I need).

It does seem that these boxes are still loco controllers, or virtual 'analog' control panels. i.e. the user interface is a virtualization of analog controls - buttons that can be toggled on and odd etc. Including turnouts and accessories. There is also a track layout schematic, which is perhaps a step up from that level. I find that very sad in this modern day of HTML5 and modern portable computing. It is not a layout controller (and perhaps never meant to be one).
Dale
Arrival and Departure signs: http://remotesign.mixmox.com
My first layout: http://layout.mixmox.com
My current layout (under construction): http://cabinlayout.mixmox.com
IB Software: http://bw.mixmox.com
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#6 Posted : 04 January 2011 06:31:00(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 13,853
Location: New Zealand
DaleSchultz wrote:
It does seem that these boxes are still loco controllers, or virtual 'analog' control panels. i.e. the user interface is a virtualization of analog controls - buttons that can be toggled on and odd etc.



The CS2 takes this even further, with a visual representation of the old style Marklin Digital keyboards, complete with 16 virtual buttons!
Offline GSRR  
#7 Posted : 02 February 2011 00:19:09(UTC)
GSRR

United States   
Joined: 01/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,339
Location: USA
Tom,

Great review, I know it took a lot of time, thank you! I just purchased an ECoS 50000 1.3 and updated it to v3.3.1

I was looking at the ECoS color display manual page 34 concerning the Marklin Mobile Station. Aside from the display being color, are all of the details in this newer updated manual pertinent to the older monochrome model?

I understand you can use either model of the MS1, that you need a patch cable 610 479 to connect to the ECoS, and that the ECoS will update the software on the MS1.

Are there any tricks to using the MS1 or any problems?

Regards,


Thomas

Edited by user 02 February 2011 00:29:04(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

ETE UserPostedImage ECoS iTrain TouchCab C-Gleis German Era Id & IIIb USA Era IIIb SBB Era III SJ Era IV GC Era V
Offline Piggy  
#8 Posted : 02 February 2011 17:02:13(UTC)
Piggy

Australia   
Joined: 08/05/2009(UTC)
Posts: 590
Location: Sydney
Great review Tom. I realized how many new features have been added since my version 3.0.1, just downloaded ver.3.3.3 and plan to install it soon.

Thomas: I run the CS1 reloaded with two MS1's, no problems.
Regards
Kenneth

CS1 update - K & C tracks - German Era 3B & 4, with some Swiss and Austrian visitors. - My Layout
Offline H0  
#9 Posted : 02 February 2011 20:05:28(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 9,166
Originally Posted by: GSRR Go to Quoted Post
that you need a patch cable 610 479 to connect to the ECoS

You can take Märklin #60124 or #610479 (two different numbers for the same item).
Some dealers may only have one of those - or may even have different prices.
Regards
Tom
---
Happy customer of Roco, Piko, Fleischmann, ESU, Brawa, Liliput, Rivarossi, Lima, ... - and will happily continue to buy locos that run well out of the box. I'm also happy with 95% of my Märklin items, but will avoid a few cost-optimized items made 2011 or later.
Offline dnerasmus  
#10 Posted : 06 March 2011 05:04:44(UTC)
dnerasmus


Joined: 06/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1
Location: Jupiter
where do I download the 60212 v 3.3.3 reloaded firmware pse?
pse respond to daniel at dnerasmus dot com

Edited by moderator 06 March 2011 06:52:30(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline nevw  
#11 Posted : 06 March 2011 05:43:23(UTC)
nevw

Australia   
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,612
Location: Strathpine QLD
Register on the ESU Forum.
Have to Quote your CS1 (Reloaded) Serial Number.
Will take a day or so to get approved then go to the ESu Website and go to Downloads.

NN
wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now have a new shiny tin Hip that is badly in Need of Repair
Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
Offline Piggy  
#12 Posted : 06 March 2011 10:26:01(UTC)
Piggy

Australia   
Joined: 08/05/2009(UTC)
Posts: 590
Location: Sydney
I was yesterday told from guy in the local train shop, that updating directly from version 3.0.1 to 3.3.3 should be avoided since that will give problems. He said I should install version 3.2.1 before going to 3.3.3.
Regards
Kenneth

CS1 update - K & C tracks - German Era 3B & 4, with some Swiss and Austrian visitors. - My Layout
Offline Caralain  
#13 Posted : 06 March 2011 23:05:51(UTC)
Caralain

United States   
Joined: 15/08/2010(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: Bay Area, California
Hey Tom:

Thank you for the review. Very well done. It must have taken you a lot of time making all these print screens. I have to agree with you. The CS1 reloaded is a great product more user-friendly than the CS2. Like you I haven't tried yet the module S88 but I am likely to give it a shot soon.

Cheers

Pierre
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Caralain
Offline nero328  
#14 Posted : 07 December 2011 14:50:39(UTC)
nero328


Joined: 24/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 20
This is an excellent review. I have a CS1 and am thinking about purchasing the ESU update and this is very helpful.

Question for those in the US who have purchased the ESU update from a foreign (German) dealer - does the package include a US-compatible electrical cord?

General question - will the update allow the CS to operate TRIX (DC) locomotives?

Thanks.

Nero328
Offline H0  
#15 Posted : 07 December 2011 15:57:39(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 9,166
Originally Posted by: nero328 Go to Quoted Post
Question for those in the US who have purchased the ESU update from a foreign (German) dealer - does the package include a US-compatible electrical cord?
I don't know, but the cable from the wall to the power supply ends in a standard two-pole plug, so maybe you have a suitable cable from another device (CD player, battery charger, ...).

Originally Posted by: nero328 Go to Quoted Post
General question - will the update allow the CS to operate TRIX (DC) locomotives?
Yes, if they have a decoder (you cannot operate analogue DC locos with the CS1).
Regards
Tom
---
Happy customer of Roco, Piko, Fleischmann, ESU, Brawa, Liliput, Rivarossi, Lima, ... - and will happily continue to buy locos that run well out of the box. I'm also happy with 95% of my Märklin items, but will avoid a few cost-optimized items made 2011 or later.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by H0
Offline Caralain  
#16 Posted : 07 December 2011 18:12:51(UTC)
Caralain

United States   
Joined: 15/08/2010(UTC)
Posts: 301
Location: Bay Area, California
Hi Nero328:

Mine came with a US plug. I bought the ESU upgrade in the Netherlands, but the store is now closed. I am not sure if it is possible to order this product in the US because the manual wasn't translated in English. However it's not a problem because you can use the instructions for the Ecos 50000 or 50200.

As said by Tom, you can also just replace the cable netween the tranformer and the wall.

Regards,

Pierre
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by Caralain
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