Welcome to the forum   
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Share
Options
View
Go to last post in this topic Go to first unread post in this topic
Offline alexaqui  
#1 Posted : 27 December 2012 04:39:28(UTC)
alexaqui

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2012(UTC)
Posts: 24
After a 20 year hiatus, I received Marklin starter set 29483 for Christmas this year. Unfortunately, the locomotive was damaged during shipping, with part of the front plastic bumperon one side snapped off. I'm trying to determine with the dealer how to proceed. Until then, sadly, everything is staying in the box unused/unpackaged. I do have a question regarding the locomotive. The pantographs open up to to different heights. While I know that the locomotive that comes with the starter set does not have working pantographs, I find it odd that they open up to different heights. Is this normal?

Sadly, I can also see why Marklin is struggling financially. My starter set just reeks of 1980's style German arrogance. It is about as un-user friendly as it gets. Combined with the lack of any reasonable instructions for setting up the basic layout and hooking up the transformer, simple things such as the shipping contents with the set are just flat out wrong. Also, one of the booklets talks about needing to use a lok-card; one didn't ship with the set as it is already pre-configured. Overall, for the cost of the set, everything seems like a giant afterthought.

I find it a shame as, at least in the US, there is a huge resurgence in interest in trains due to shows such as Thomas the Tank. I have a few nephews who are train crazy and will be age appropriate to get into Marklin in a few short years. Sadly, I doubt giving them a starter set is something I could consider given my poor re-entry experience and the fact that Marklin does nothing to make entry into their ecosystem easy.
Offline elfangor103  
#2 Posted : 27 December 2012 06:40:45(UTC)
elfangor103

United States   
Joined: 28/02/2012(UTC)
Posts: 288
Location: New York
I've had a similar problem with marklin's starter sets. A while back I ordered a 29825 starter set, the quality of the trains was horrible, the steam engine wasn't running and the sound functions were also not working. Cursing At such high prices I expected better. I guess the starter sets are cheaply made to cut back on costs. Most of my marklin purchases have been older engines ranging from 1990's to 2007. The older models seem to be made with more care and were made in Germany or Hungary not China. Good luck, I hope your experience with marklin will improve.BigGrin

Daniel
Newly Started Analog Z Layout
Offline H0  
#3 Posted : 27 December 2012 08:37:36(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,271
Location: DE-NW
Hi!
Originally Posted by: alexaqui Go to Quoted Post
It is about as un-user friendly as it gets. Combined with the lack of any reasonable instructions for setting up the basic layout and hooking up the transformer, simple things such as the shipping contents with the set are just flat out wrong. Also, one of the booklets talks about needing to use a lok-card; one didn't ship with the set as it is already pre-configured.
Sad experience for you.
I don't have that set so I cannot say what is included (or should be included).

The loco has mfx and therefore no loco card is included. Maybe some of the paperwork is outdated or is used for multiple starter sets (the glossy four-colour brochure that should come with the set, "Ein Click und los geht's" or something to that effect and with four or eight languages). The colour brochure should include information about setting up the layout and wiring the MS2.

The loco can take power from the pantographs (but they are not motor-driven). Different wipers are used with this model, one for Germany and one for Switzerland. They are not used at the same time, but should reach similar heights. Have to check how it looks with my Re 421.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline RayF  
#4 Posted : 27 December 2012 10:01:49(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,840
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Hi Alex,

I'm not sure what your expectations were, but you are obviously disappointed because of the damage to your locomotive. Don't let this colour your view of the set. While I don't have this particular one, I have bought a couple of recent starter sets and found them very good value.

The instructions contained within the set give a good introduction to the connection and use of the MS2. There will be a learning curve as, for most of us brought up with the traditional train set, the newer digital controllers are rather alien, but give it to your children and they'll have it figured out in about ten minutes! BigGrin

As to the setting up of the track, the booklet included should contain the track layout for this set and also suggestions for expansion and other layout ideas.

I'm sorry you consider your experience of this set "poor". Perhaps the fact that the locomotive is damaged has started you on the wrong foot. Most of us find our first experience of the new digital technology thrilling and addictive. Maybe you will too once you start running it. Smile
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline alexaqui  
#5 Posted : 27 December 2012 20:25:54(UTC)
alexaqui

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2012(UTC)
Posts: 24
Thanks all for the responses. My dealer has offered to repair the locomotive and has ordered parts. Unfortunately, the problems got worse when I decided to actually put the set together today. The locomotive will not register with the MS2.

As a workaround, I manually entered it from the database and can only control functions via pressing the stop button twice. It is as if the locomotive is "deaf" to commands unless it is stopped. Very odd! Any thoughts? Everything else (switches) worked right away.

Thanks in advance.
Offline mascagni  
#6 Posted : 27 December 2012 20:36:14(UTC)
mascagni


Joined: 25/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 826
Location: Tallahassee, FL USA
Not as bad as yours, but I got the Swiss weathered Croc set, 26591, a week ago Friday and the wood carrier only had wheels on one of the two cars connected by the beam. It boggles the mind how a factory with quality control can pack and ship such a thing? The package was not damaged in the least in shipping, and everything was where it was supposed to be except that the two sets of wheels were missing. This is clearly an issue at the factory/point of assembly and not a shipping problem or dealer issue: WTF? I fear this is an indication of a lack of attention to detail that we expected from Maerklin that may not be there anymore.
Michael Mascagni, Tallahassee
If I weren't a Mathematician, I'd be a Violinist.--Albert Einstein
Offline mmervine  
#7 Posted : 27 December 2012 21:21:29(UTC)
mmervine

United States   
Joined: 30/01/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,884
Location: Keene, NH
I just received my 36607 SBB/Railpool e186 lok. It seems fine, but it was made in China! All of my other hobby loks were made in Hungary. Additionally, Marklin had indicated that they we going to minimize production in China. Kind of surprising!
Märklin C-track, Marklin Digital & ECoS, multi-era French & Swiss
http://www.ete-ene.org/m...mervines-layout-gallery/
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#8 Posted : 27 December 2012 21:46:07(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,667
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: mascagni Go to Quoted Post
Not as bad as yours, but I got the Swiss weathered Croc set, 26591, a week ago Friday and the wood carrier only had wheels on one of the two cars connected by the beam. It boggles the mind how a factory with quality control can pack and ship such a thing? The package was not damaged in the least in shipping, and everything was where it was supposed to be except that the two sets of wheels were missing. This is clearly an issue at the factory/point of assembly and not a shipping problem or dealer issue: WTF? I fear this is an indication of a lack of attention to detail that we expected from Maerklin that may not be there anymore.


Mine was OK when I received it, so I guess this is a factory stuff up! You'll need to contact your dealer.
Offline mike c  
#9 Posted : 27 December 2012 22:02:02(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,902
Location: Montreal, QC
Originally Posted by: mmervine Go to Quoted Post
I just received my 36607 SBB/Railpool e186 lok. It seems fine, but it was made in China! All of my other hobby loks were made in Hungary. Additionally, Marklin had indicated that they we going to minimize production in China. Kind of surprising!


As far as I know, the Maerklin Hobby models are made in Hungary, likely with some components that are Made in China.
The problem is that when importing goods into the United States, the country of origin has to be clearly marked.
Some importers may place stickers indicating a country of origin just to simplify the processing, so a shipment might come in with items saying "Made in China" just so that they do not have to complete a whole other set of papers because a few items were made in Hungary or in Germany or elsewhere.
I am not saying that Maerklin/Walthers has done this, but I have seen this on other items (hobby and other) in the past.

US regulations require that the country where the major part of construction was performed
European rules require vaguer conditions, like where final assembly was done or similar.

Regards

Mike C
Offline mike c  
#10 Posted : 27 December 2012 22:21:14(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,902
Location: Montreal, QC
Originally Posted by: alexaqui Go to Quoted Post
After a 20 year hiatus, I received Marklin starter set 29483 for Christmas this year. Unfortunately, the locomotive was damaged during shipping, with part of the front plastic bumperon one side snapped off. I'm trying to determine with the dealer how to proceed. Until then, sadly, everything is staying in the box unused/unpackaged. I do have a question regarding the locomotive. The pantographs open up to to different heights. While I know that the locomotive that comes with the starter set does not have working pantographs, I find it odd that they open up to different heights. Is this normal?

Sadly, I can also see why Marklin is struggling financially. My starter set just reeks of 1980's style German arrogance. It is about as un-user friendly as it gets. Combined with the lack of any reasonable instructions for setting up the basic layout and hooking up the transformer, simple things such as the shipping contents with the set are just flat out wrong. Also, one of the booklets talks about needing to use a lok-card; one didn't ship with the set as it is already pre-configured. Overall, for the cost of the set, everything seems like a giant afterthought.

I find it a shame as, at least in the US, there is a huge resurgence in interest in trains due to shows such as Thomas the Tank. I have a few nephews who are train crazy and will be age appropriate to get into Marklin in a few short years. Sadly, I doubt giving them a starter set is something I could consider given my poor re-entry experience and the fact that Marklin does nothing to make entry into their ecosystem easy.


The 29483 is a SBB Re 421. It has two round buffers, the UIC step, diagonal handrail and UIC plug (between the front windows). The UIC plug and the diagonal handrail are the two items most commonly subjected to damage in transit.

I am not exactly clear on what you mean by "part of the front plastic bumper snapped off". If it is one of the four buffers, these can easily be replaced. If you are talking about the UIC step, this too, can be replaced, but removing the remnants may take some skilled manipulation. The diagonal handrails can be carefully straightened using plastic tools. I usually use the plastic tweezer from my Swiss Army knife.

As far as the pantographs, both are made by Sommerfeldt for Maerklin. They are lifted by springs coiled around the base of the mast. The pantographs may raise to different heights, depending on the existing tension. Normally, the height is limited by the catenary, but when used without catenary, there is nothing to restrict the pantograph from fully extending. I would be more concerned if one or both of them was not sufficiently extending to contact the catenary. If the slider is raised about an inch higher than the lok, it is working normally.

The Set should have been delivered with a little pamphlet, showing how to connect the tracks and giving basic instructions on how to set up the track. There should also be a manual with information on how to set up the Mobile Station. I would check with the dealer to ensure that your set included this information.

Here is a photo of the lok: http://cdn01.trixum.de/u...d9e75220d448e7f3a0c6.jpg
Here is a track diagram (as shown on the box): http://cdn01.trixum.de/u...6bc6e6b65efd494e5875.jpg

If you just received the set, you can ask the dealer to replace the damaged lok rather than simply ordering the parts.

The lok should be detected by the MS as "Re 421 374-0". If that fails, you should be able to manually enter address '44'

Regards

Mike C
Offline mike c  
#11 Posted : 27 December 2012 22:24:50(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,902
Location: Montreal, QC
Originally Posted by: alexaqui Go to Quoted Post
Thanks all for the responses. My dealer has offered to repair the locomotive and has ordered parts. Unfortunately, the problems got worse when I decided to actually put the set together today. The locomotive will not register with the MS2.

As a workaround, I manually entered it from the database and can only control functions via pressing the stop button twice. It is as if the locomotive is "deaf" to commands unless it is stopped. Very odd! Any thoughts? Everything else (switches) worked right away.

Thanks in advance.


The only functions of this lok are F0 headlights on/off, F1 Highbeams on/off and F4 Shunting Mode (Accel/Decel on/off)
I don't see how any of these functions would require the lok to be stopped nor why the stop button would need to be pressed twice.

Perhaps one of the members who has the MS2 can elaborate on this as I am still using the classic 6021 from a decade ago.

Regards

Mike C

Offline alexaqui  
#12 Posted : 27 December 2012 23:55:32(UTC)
alexaqui

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2012(UTC)
Posts: 24
Quick update. Went back and forth with the dealer troubleshooting the problem. Long and short of it is that I ordered more track to expand my layout and I will be getting a new Lok and MS2 with that order, which will be tested before shipping. I will then send back the defective combo. All around a great solution!

I crocodile also found its way into my order!!! Pesky creatures....
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by alexaqui
Offline RayF  
#13 Posted : 28 December 2012 00:11:49(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,840
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Great news Alex!

It's unlikely that both the loco and the MS2 were faulty, but I guess replacing both is a safe option.

More track, another loco...sounds like you're heading in the right direction. BigGrin
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline H0  
#14 Posted : 28 December 2012 08:15:16(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,271
Location: DE-NW
Hi!
Originally Posted by: alexaqui Go to Quoted Post
Thanks all for the responses. My dealer has offered to repair the locomotive and has ordered parts. Unfortunately, the problems got worse when I decided to actually put the set together today. The locomotive will not register with the MS2.

As a workaround, I manually entered it from the database and can only control functions via pressing the stop button twice. It is as if the locomotive is "deaf" to commands unless it is stopped. Very odd! Any thoughts?
How can you enter the loco from database? I should not be in the database because no mfx locos should be in the database.

You should be able to control the loco using MM protocol - but only if you disable the mfx protocol in the MS2.
The loco will not respond to MM commands as long as mfx is enabled in the MS2.

Before taking a loco off the track you should stop it and then wait a few seconds before turning the power off or taking her off the track.
After the test run at the factory, they do not always obey this. So loco remembered "full speed" and next time it gets power it runs off at full speed.
The automatic mfx registration may or may not work for a loco running at full speed (running locos have worse contact than standing locos and running motors disturb the signals).

If you're willing to give it a try, reset the MS2, activate the MM protocol only, then register two locos (addresses 24 and 44 (the manual doesn't indicate the MM address of this loco)) manually, then put your loco on the track. If loco works now, activate mfx again (by default, mfx, MM, and DCC are active) and within 10 seconds you should see a flashing "mfx" symbol on the display.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
Offline Andrey  
#15 Posted : 28 December 2012 09:11:20(UTC)
Andrey

Russian Federation   
Joined: 03/12/2012(UTC)
Posts: 641
Location: Moscow
Originally Posted by: alexaqui Go to Quoted Post
It is about as un-user friendly as it gets. Combined with the lack of any reasonable instructions for setting up the basic layout and hooking up the transformer, simple things such as the shipping contents with the set are just flat out wrong. Also, one of the booklets talks about needing to use a lok-card; one didn't ship with the set as it is already pre-configured. Overall, for the cost of the set, everything seems like a giant afterthought. I find it a shame as, at least in the US, there is a huge resurgence in interest in trains due to shows such as Thomas the Tank.


Fully support almost everything said aboveWoot .
I bought 29539 starter for my older son.
Info contained in the main booklet IMHO was not enough the child would connect electricity properly (son was already 8).
Frankly speaking, if I wouldn't be Maerklin familiar, this would be hardly done from the first or second attempt.
ANY pictures were put to the booklet, but almost no picture representing 29539 starter set! I paid 359 euro for this set and expected more...
For most people in our country pictures say more than text since they don't understand English.

This is the starter set (not the cheapest one), this is the first what man gets in the beginning, let him get something valuable what Maerklin produces! Woot

Offline alexaqui  
#16 Posted : 28 December 2012 19:04:26(UTC)
alexaqui

United States   
Joined: 05/12/2012(UTC)
Posts: 24
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Great news Alex!

It's unlikely that both the loco and the MS2 were faulty, but I guess replacing both is a safe option.

More track, another loco...sounds like you're heading in the right direction. BigGrin


Ha! Thanks. I ended up getting the Swiss "weathered" Croc, so I'm excited. My wife is not so excited about the bill.... I will post pictures of my updated plan once I get the parts (it is essentially a 2nd loop off of the starter set, with a long 3rd 1/2 loop of R3 for passing...).

Sadly it will be a week until I get the parts.
Offline evan.v.giles  
#17 Posted : 06 May 2013 09:36:36(UTC)
evan.v.giles


Joined: 15/03/2013(UTC)
Posts: 85
Location: South Brisbane, Queensland

Hi people,
After reading this report it seems Marklin succumbed to the thought that by going to china that the reduction in manufacturing costs would out weigh the cost of keeping it at home with this
I mean inside Europe.

There is now a myriad of stories about how the Chinese seem to do ok for a while and then all of a sudden the quality of its manufacturing goes down the gurgler, it's seems everyone forgets
it is COMMUNIST and the Politburo in Beijing don't care so long as they get the hard currency.

Unfourtunately this may have almost sunk the company because left as it was the brand would have become worthless.

It annoys the hell out of me that people with better educations than I had can't seem to see this.

For the sake of a few dollars they risk the company.

People buy Marklin because of it's robust and solid construction, thats why I bought it ( Locomotives that is ).Mad
Offline Bigdaddynz  
#18 Posted : 06 May 2013 09:56:34(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,667
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: evan.v.giles Go to Quoted Post
After reading this report it seems Marklin succumbed to the thought that by going to china that the reduction in manufacturing costs would out weigh the cost of keeping it at home with this
I mean inside Europe.


Marklin has been pulling their manufacturing out of China for some time, there are places in Europe closer to home where they can make stuff just as cheap, or even cheaper, than China.

It seems they've already realised that it wasn't worth risking the company for the sake of a few dollars.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Bigdaddynz
Offline RayF  
#19 Posted : 06 May 2013 16:34:33(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,840
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
A lot of companies are moving their manufacturing out of China, but quality is not the main issue. The fact is that as the standard of living is going up in China, the workers are expecting more money, and the cost of manufacturing is going up.

Manufacturing is now possible in Eastern Europe for less than in China, but the same will be true of those countries if they get enough business. As the people get better off the costs will increase!

Quality is only as good as is specified by the ordering company, and as good as the quality control put in place. It has nothing to do with the political system governing the country...
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by RayF
Offline Yumgui  
#20 Posted : 06 May 2013 19:44:21(UTC)
Yumgui

United States   
Joined: 20/03/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,660
Location: Paris, France
Hehehe,

That's it; it's all a Communist plot I say ^^ !

Yum LOL
If your M track is rusted ... DON'T throw it out !
Working on: https://studiogang.com/projects/all
My heavy train station renovation: https://youtu.be/QQlyNiq416A
Inspired by: http://www.nakedmarklin.com/... Am not alone in this universe, phew.
Users browsing this topic
Guest
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

| Powered by YAF.NET | YAF.NET © 2003-2024, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.946 seconds.