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Offline BrandonVA  
#51 Posted : 02 May 2012 18:49:47(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,533
Location: VA
Originally Posted by: MM-MarkMontreal Go to Quoted Post
Welcome to forum NewMB ThumpUp

If not, the Fat controller aka Topham Hat will come and give you work orders!
- Mark BigGrin


Haha! Mark...that's not what I meant. Got me laughing at my desk.

-Brandon
Offline NewMB  
#52 Posted : 02 May 2012 19:47:56(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

Where do you intend to sit/stand to control the layout, or will you be mobile on your iphone. Smile

Ian.



Ian, I don't have an iPhone as I am a Blackberry person..... as for where to make the connections etc, I have no idea. I would think it should be possible to have a very long cable running across the room Laugh
Offline RayF  
#53 Posted : 02 May 2012 20:12:44(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,838
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
hi Patrik,

I think I like it more with Bonn station in the middle.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline Mark5  
#54 Posted : 02 May 2012 21:08:07(UTC)
Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
Hi Patrik,

I have built yards like that too, but the one issue I have with yards the way that you have it, is access issues.
You can't really put long trains in those yards.... but its nice for shunting a few cars around.
However, longer trains could easily be kept in a shadow yard.

It seems to me a shadow yard would work best on a thin shelf style layouts where its easier to access.
That way you both length for a long train, and easy of access in working with it...
.... I have been thinking of a design to actually have my lower level slide out on drawer slides to work with it when needed,
or to work on the upper level wiring.

Just thinking out-loud here and hoping it helps,
Mark
DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
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Offline BrandonVA  
#55 Posted : 02 May 2012 21:17:41(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,533
Location: VA
Patrik,

I don't think any of us have room for this on our layouts, but here's an example of a fairly large classification yard in Heilbronn, Germany. Maybe give you some ideas. I can't figure out a good way to show the whole thing here, but if you go to Google maps, choose satellite view, and look for Heilbronn, Germany you should be able to zoom in and look at the whole thing. There's also a roundhouse just a bit to the West at the SEH Eisenbahnmuseum.
BrandonVA attached the following image(s):
Capture.JPG
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Offline H0  
#56 Posted : 02 May 2012 21:50:03(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline NewMB  
#57 Posted : 02 May 2012 22:05:18(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: MM-MarkMontreal Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

I have built yards like that too, but the one issue I have with yards the way that you have it, is access issues.
You can't really put long trains in those yards.... but its nice for shunting a few cars around.
However, longer trains could easily be kept in a shadow yard.

It seems to me a shadow yard would work best on a thin shelf style layouts where its easier to access.
That way you both length for a long train, and easy of access in working with it...
.... I have been thinking of a design to actually have my lower level slide out on drawer slides to work with it when needed,
or to work on the upper level wiring.

Just thinking out-loud here and hoping it helps,
Mark



I know what you mean with access. I think that in most cases it all comes down to space and size of the room.
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Offline kbvrod  
#58 Posted : 02 May 2012 22:12:51(UTC)
kbvrod

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2006(UTC)
Posts: 2,597
Location: Beverly, MA
Hi Patrik,all,


>I know what you mean with access. I think that in most cases it all comes down to space and size of the room. <

Not at all.

Dr D

Offline BrandonVA  
#59 Posted : 03 May 2012 16:47:40(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,533
Location: VA


Thanks Tom! More interesting examples.
Offline NewMB  
#60 Posted : 08 May 2012 13:57:39(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Just a small update.

I have been working on yet another layout using the full length of the room (11.4m) that has some nice features....

- Station in middle
- Long loops
- Yards for Goods and Passenger wagons - both in connection with the station
- Industrial areas
- Roundhouse & Turntable
- Mountains
- Bridges
- Tunnels

etc etc

Offline NewMB  
#61 Posted : 09 May 2012 17:10:16(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
So here we go..... comments etc are very welcome.

UserPostedImage


Here we have 2 loops where loco's can travel in each direction independently from each other. Station in the middle, passenger wagons yard, loco yard with roundhouse & turntable, goods yard (intend to have factories etc there) and 2 places for local trains.

Only snag I can see is that with this one, I can not get the parade route that is going like a snake.....
Offline Ian555  
#62 Posted : 09 May 2012 17:17:25(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

I see you are slowly moving into the middle of the room. Smile

Ian.

Offline petestra  
#63 Posted : 09 May 2012 17:28:02(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 27/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 5,824
Location: Leesburg,VA.USA
I like it a-lot, Patrik. I would make the Bonn Hauptbahnhof station platforms longer to accommodate longer
passenger trains. PeterThumpUp
Offline NewMB  
#64 Posted : 09 May 2012 21:16:04(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

I see you are slowly moving into the middle of the room. Smile

Ian.



Oh yes! LOL We will see what the wife says about that as she is SO interested at the moment!


Originally Posted by: petestra Go to Quoted Post
I like it a-lot, Patrik. I would make the Bonn Hauptbahnhof station platforms longer to accommodate longer
passenger trains. PeterThumpUp



Thanks! Longer platforms can certainly be arranged, but I think that will wait until it's time to build it. It's difficult to understand the size of this thing..... the total track now measures 131.20m which is considerable longer than any of the previous plans I made.

Any idea's to make this one better?
Offline Rinus  
#65 Posted : 09 May 2012 21:52:55(UTC)
Rinus


Joined: 20/02/2005(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Wageningen, The Netherlands
Hi Patrik,

These are some ambituous plans!

Personally I like to copy the resal things as much as possible, restricted by the limitations we all have to work with (room, scale, money etc..). When you look closer to the real thing you'll notice some interesting things: there are no radius 2 or 3 curves visible and its very rare to see more than 2 tracks at the same time.

My thoughts are therefor:
With so much space I'd go for a reconstruction of something real. I read you have some interest in German lines. Perhaps this plan of Cologne inspires you.

UserPostedImage

Taken from: http://sporenplan.nl/

Also I'd try to avoid 90 degree turns, especially in radius 1,2,3 and even 4 or 5. Its just not that good looking. Furthermore with that amount of space available you could afford some wide radius turns with superelevations just as the real thing. Its fantastic seeing your trains passing such a tuns.

I liked your first plan the most. Its clean and simple. An overdosis of track per m2 as in your later plans, other than a station or shunting yard, does not look very realisic.

And last, planning programms are great but I got the best results don't using one and just start laying track and see how things look for real.

Once again: just my thoughts

I hope you enjoy the designing process!

Have you seen Monsters and Ians layouts too? They are large and great too see.

Rinus
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Offline NewMB  
#66 Posted : 09 May 2012 22:35:38(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Rinus Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

These are some ambituous plans!

Personally I like to copy the resal things as much as possible, restricted by the limitations we all have to work with (room, scale, money etc..). When you look closer to the real thing you'll notice some interesting things: there are no radius 2 or 3 curves visible and its very rare to see more than 2 tracks at the same time.

My thoughts are therefor:
With so much space I'd go for a reconstruction of something real. I read you have some interest in German lines. Perhaps this plan of Cologne inspires you.

UserPostedImage

Taken from: http://sporenplan.nl/

Also I'd try to avoid 90 degree turns, especially in radius 1,2,3 and even 4 or 5. Its just not that good looking. Furthermore with that amount of space available you could afford some wide radius turns with superelevations just as the real thing. Its fantastic seeing your trains passing such a tuns.

I liked your first plan the most. Its clean and simple. An overdosis of track per m2 as in your later plans, other than a station or shunting yard, does not look very realisic.

And last, planning programms are great but I got the best results don't using one and just start laying track and see how things look for real.

Once again: just my thoughts

I hope you enjoy the designing process!

Have you seen Monsters and Ians layouts too? They are large and great too see.

Rinus


Thanks Rinus. That's the thing, I feel that it may be a tad too large. Yes, Cologne station is fantastic. Impressive place....

The problem I found in the earlier plans were the issues I would have by having a hidden yard (been there, done that and nothing but problems) so I thought that I do it "upstairs". That would save me the time it takes to take current train sets off the tracks and place a new one one etc. I have 100 loco's now (just taken delivery no 100 which happens to be 37994 Big Boy).

On the plans, there are no R1 turns on any of the two loops. Only in industrial and the local runs can those be found. It was one of the basic rules for me. I would also like to see a better paraderoute that a simple straight one. This last plan is one of those plans I actually really like and will be one to consider later when time comes to build it. I have well over 12-18 months before even starting to build anything so plenty of time to change and re-consider.



Offline NewMB  
#67 Posted : 10 May 2012 13:40:45(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Some changes....

Just realized that the loops did not work individually so had to fix that Blushing They work now though.

Also split the outer loop towards the wall and some other minor changes. Seems like less track but it's actually more at a total of 134.07m. It also have me that curved paraderoute I wanted. Lots of elevations but can't be seen on this drawing. Would be happy to post a 3D pic, but for some reason all tunnel entrances are shown as being above the tracks....anyone know why?

Again, comments and opinions welcome Smile

Thanks!

UserPostedImage
Offline BrandonVA  
#68 Posted : 11 May 2012 21:38:21(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,533
Location: VA
I like the parade route!
Offline petestra  
#69 Posted : 11 May 2012 22:54:04(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 27/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 5,824
Location: Leesburg,VA.USA
Hi Patrik, looks great. yes the elevations are VERY important to get right beforehand. I had to do several layouts
over and over again because of it. I don't know if you will be using catenary as I have but one does need to
allow more space for it (at least 105 mm). I raised each track section by 5mm on Wintrack. PeterSmile
Offline NewMB  
#70 Posted : 12 May 2012 11:06:02(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: BrandonVA Go to Quoted Post
I like the parade route!



Thanks Brandon. I think I am slowly getting there! Laugh

Originally Posted by: petestra Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik, looks great. yes the elevations are VERY important to get right beforehand. I had to do several layouts
over and over again because of it. I don't know if you will be using catenary as I have but one does need to
allow more space for it (at least 105 mm). I raised each track section by 5mm on Wintrack. PeterSmile



Thanks!

I wasn't planning to use catenary.... never appealed to me, but perhaps I could use it on the parade route, if not connected then at least for the looks. I have allowed 120mm for enough clearance. Perhaps a tad much??

I am also having problems understanding how to hook all this up to power. Previous layout used a simple MS1 + a 60052 Transformer (plus other 60052's for power to lights, turnouts etc). On this one I intend to use a CS2 (or better!) and I have frankly saying, no idea what the best solution for power is.

Anyone know pls???

Do I need to use Boosters?? How to hook them up???

Greatful for any input.



Offline Bigdaddynz  
#71 Posted : 12 May 2012 11:29:31(UTC)
Bigdaddynz

New Zealand   
Joined: 17/09/2006(UTC)
Posts: 18,661
Location: New Zealand
Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post
Do I need to use Boosters?? How to hook them up???



The answer to that question is entirely based on how many trains you want to run and what features they have - sound / smoke / coach lights, etc.

You should be able to run 6 to 8 trains with just the CS2, and maybe even more.


As to how you connect a booster......well, the 60174 booster connects to a socket on the back of the CS2, and has a red and brown track output which you connect to your booster track section just like you would connect the CS2. You must isolate the centre rail at both ends between the track section supplied by the CS2 and the track section supplied by the booster.

Connect a 60061 power supply (60101 power supply at 5 amps is not supported by Marklin for H0 use, and you will invalidate your warranty if you do use it.) and away you go.

With a large layout like yours, make sure you have plenty of track feeder wires - Marklin recommends every 2 to 3 metres.
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Offline NewMB  
#72 Posted : 12 May 2012 16:13:34(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Bigdaddynz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post
Do I need to use Boosters?? How to hook them up???



The answer to that question is entirely based on how many trains you want to run and what features they have - sound / smoke / coach lights, etc.

You should be able to run 6 to 8 trains with just the CS2, and maybe even more.


As to how you connect a booster......well, the 60174 booster connects to a socket on the back of the CS2, and has a red and brown track output which you connect to your booster track section just like you would connect the CS2. You must isolate the centre rail at both ends between the track section supplied by the CS2 and the track section supplied by the booster.

Connect a 60061 power supply (60101 power supply at 5 amps is not supported by Marklin for H0 use, and you will invalidate your warranty if you do use it.) and away you go.

With a large layout like yours, make sure you have plenty of track feeder wires - Marklin recommends every 2 to 3 metres.



Thanks for that. Still don't quite understand why I would need to isolate sections, I thought that Boosters were simply a tool to "boost" power to a large layout.

I wish to use 2 trains at all times with coach light etc. Another 2 can be run, but need to be "looked" at unless I automate them, something which is completely new for me.

So when using a CS2, one can simply connect a 60174 Booster and a 60061 power pack?

Can one connect several boosters to the above to gain more power to the track?

You say that I need several track feeder wires. All presumably back to ONE transformer (can I use 60052 or can I only use 60061?)? These track feeder wires are just a simple connection to the track every 2-3 metres and nothing else?

Do I even need to use boosters on my layout and only with say 4-5 loco's running at any one time??

Sorry for all the questions, but I really do not understand this electrical things.....

Thanks!!


Offline NewMB  
#73 Posted : 13 May 2012 12:41:32(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Yet another version, now allowing for 3 loops.

UserPostedImage

3D version too...

UserPostedImage

Please note that the 3D buildings are not showing.

Comments etc very welcome!

Thanks.
Offline petestra  
#74 Posted : 13 May 2012 16:18:42(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 27/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 5,824
Location: Leesburg,VA.USA
Hi Patrik, looks great! Lots of access to all areas. PeterThumpUp Smile
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Offline NewMB  
#75 Posted : 14 May 2012 08:34:47(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: petestra Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik, looks great! Lots of access to all areas. PeterThumpUp Smile



Yes indeed. Important.

Just don't know how to make mountains in Wintrack though..... my wife wants to give me the Berlin TV tower (1m high!) and this should stand in a corner I think, on a mountain.....
Offline Ian555  
#76 Posted : 14 May 2012 10:02:28(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

When you say loops, does that mean 3 seperate circles that you can run trains on, without any signal control.

Ian.

Offline NewMB  
#77 Posted : 14 May 2012 13:47:21(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

When you say loops, does that mean 3 seperate circles that you can run trains on, without any signal control.

Ian.



Yes. Round and round we go..... Laugh

I have not planned to use any signals.....seems difficult!



Offline Ian555  
#78 Posted : 14 May 2012 14:22:12(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

Yes, I to like to see trains running on the layout.

I have 8 seperate loops on the layout, 3 of them are analog and 5 are digital.

The digital section of the layout is split into 2 seperate layouts, one controlled by my CS2 and the other by a MS2. The analog section is also 2 seperate layouts with 5 blue transformers.

This allows me to easily run up to 10 trains all at the one time. (double trains running on the 2 long outside loops.)

My plans for the new layout is to run 20+ trains all at the one time.

If you like, I can post a video of 8 or 9 trains running on the layout.

Ian.

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Offline BrandonVA  
#79 Posted : 14 May 2012 17:12:16(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,533
Location: VA
Patrick,

My only observation here would be to avoid using a 3-way turnout on any kind of loop. I use this in yards, but that's about it. This may be a matter of personal preference, but I do not like the way the trains run over them, clunking and whatnot. They also carry a much higher risk of derailment if one gets distracted (maybe just me again). :)

I like the 3rd industrial loop. Good addition.

-Brandon
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Offline NewMB  
#80 Posted : 14 May 2012 20:38:14(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

Yes, I to like to see trains running on the layout.

I have 8 seperate loops on the layout, 3 of them are analog and 5 are digital.

The digital section of the layout is split into 2 seperate layouts, one controlled by my CS2 and the other by a MS2. The analog section is also 2 seperate layouts with 5 blue transformers.

This allows me to easily run up to 10 trains all at the one time. (double trains running on the 2 long outside loops.)

My plans for the new layout is to run 20+ trains all at the one time.

If you like, I can post a video of 8 or 9 trains running on the layout.

Ian.





Thanks Ian.

It would be like a dream to have so many trains running at the same time..... I am sure it's doable in the space I have but I think my fantasy is what's stopping me! I don't consider myself very good with planning a great layout. Sure, I (like everyone else) can do loops and some A to B routes, but that's about it for me. Although the current plan has some seriously long loops. Total amount of track is now over 135metres!

Ian, do you have a layout plan?




Originally Posted by: BrandonVA Go to Quoted Post
Patrick,

My only observation here would be to avoid using a 3-way turnout on any kind of loop. I use this in yards, but that's about it. This may be a matter of personal preference, but I do not like the way the trains run over them, clunking and whatnot. They also carry a much higher risk of derailment if one gets distracted (maybe just me again). :)

I like the 3rd industrial loop. Good addition.

-Brandon



Thanks Brandon. There is only one 3-way turnout on the 3rd smaller loop (perfect for a railcar me thinks) and this can easily be "resolved" to avoid hassle later. Like you say, I also do not trust them and have had loco's running over them and not liking them full stop.



Offline Ian555  
#81 Posted : 15 May 2012 07:31:21(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

I approach this differently, first I build my framework to suit the available space I have, allowing for plenty of access, and then start laying out some tracks.

I don't work from a track plan, just lay out some tracks and see if it looks right. (to me anyway Smile )

Ian.




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Offline Rinus  
#82 Posted : 15 May 2012 08:29:37(UTC)
Rinus


Joined: 20/02/2005(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Wageningen, The Netherlands
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

I approach this differently, first I build my framework to suit the available space I have, allowing for plenty of access, and then start laying out some tracks.

I don't work from a track plan, just lay out some tracks and see if it looks right. (to me anyway Smile )

Ian.



Great method Ian! There is no substitude for creativity.

I used it to when buidling my present layout.

Allthough it has some disadvantages (difficult to estimate the amount of track needed), its great advantage is that you'll avoid a trackplan that is based on a 90/45 degree grid, and get a much smoother trackplan.

Rinus
Offline NewMB  
#83 Posted : 15 May 2012 08:57:16(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

I approach this differently, first I build my framework to suit the available space I have, allowing for plenty of access, and then start laying out some tracks.

I don't work from a track plan, just lay out some tracks and see if it looks right. (to me anyway Smile )

Ian.







When I did my small layout I also used WinTrack, but while laying the track changed alot. Just looked better.

For me the WinTrack program helps me to see how much, what and were I can lay track in the available space. On such a big space, it is difficult to do it I think.

Currently I am considering some other options that may work better, but so far no new ideas..... need to sleep on it.


Offline nevw  
#84 Posted : 15 May 2012 08:58:17(UTC)
nevw

Australia   
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,071
Location: Murrumba Downs QLD
Going to be a great layout.

N
NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders
and a hose pipe on the aorta
Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
Offline Ian555  
#85 Posted : 15 May 2012 09:11:03(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Originally Posted by: Rinus Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

I approach this differently, first I build my framework to suit the available space I have, allowing for plenty of access, and then start laying out some tracks.

I don't work from a track plan, just lay out some tracks and see if it looks right. (to me anyway Smile )

Ian.



Great method Ian! There is no substitude for creativity.

I used it to when buidling my present layout.

Allthough it has some disadvantages (difficult to estimate the amount of track needed), its great advantage is that you'll avoid a trackplan that is based on a 90/45 degree grid, and get a much smoother trackplan.

Rinus



Hi Rinus,

Thanks, yes I've followed your layout closely, those long flowing curves....looks great.

Ian.

Offline Ian555  
#86 Posted : 15 May 2012 09:13:52(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

With the space you have available, the layout will look great. ThumpUp

Ian.

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Offline NewMB  
#87 Posted : 15 May 2012 09:18:07(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

With the space you have available, the layout will look great. ThumpUp

Ian.





I think so too. My wife and daughter obviously think I am nuts....... after all, we are building a new house with a basement only for this! LOL
Offline Ian555  
#88 Posted : 15 May 2012 09:35:36(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

Don't worry, you're not alone. Smile

Ian.



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Offline nevw  
#89 Posted : 15 May 2012 12:21:55(UTC)
nevw

Australia   
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,071
Location: Murrumba Downs QLD
the more space the better.

NN
NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders
and a hose pipe on the aorta
Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
Offline petestra  
#90 Posted : 15 May 2012 12:26:22(UTC)
petestra

United States   
Joined: 27/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 5,824
Location: Leesburg,VA.USA
Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

With the space you have available, the layout will look great. ThumpUp

Ian.





I think so too. My wife and daughter obviously think I am nuts....... after all, we are building a new house with a basement only for this! LOL


Hi Patrik, not nuts, we are all just a "little" engrossed in our Marklin. Love Wub Woot
PeterWink

ps - oh, back in '96 when we bought our current house I made sure we had the model with the
extra large basement, finished of course!
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Offline NewMB  
#91 Posted : 15 May 2012 14:00:05(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: petestra Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: NewMB Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

With the space you have available, the layout will look great. ThumpUp

Ian.





I think so too. My wife and daughter obviously think I am nuts....... after all, we are building a new house with a basement only for this! LOL


Hi Patrik, not nuts, we are all just a "little" engrossed in our Marklin. Love Wub Woot
PeterWink

ps - oh, back in '96 when we bought our current house I made sure we had the model with the
extra large basement, finished of course!



Excellent!! ThumpUp

I also made sure my garage can fit my other hobby..... BigGrin
Offline Ausipeet  
#92 Posted : 17 June 2012 00:29:31(UTC)
Ausipeet

Australia   
Joined: 04/06/2012(UTC)
Posts: 311
Location: Adelaide
I am staggered by the complexsity of this layout and the amount of track to be used, makes me wish that i had started my purchase of equipment some 30 years ago

Layouts like this would be uber expensive i shudder to think as to what price.

Peter a total noob to all this
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Offline river6109  
#93 Posted : 17 June 2012 04:56:07(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,635
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Patrik,

Your plan and expectations are nothing out of the ordinary, it's a man's privilege to have toys and to make room for them.

As far as your plan is concerend, my idea behind a plan was, what will I have on my layout and having a mobile layout with modules it was easy to determine what goes on what module,
My Bonn station covers 2 modules, (4.8m) my freight yards cover over 7.2m and each module covers a different scenery or point of interest.
Another important part is further down the line, your stations have the same lenght (mainline or branchline, it is important when you are trying to program your locos to stop before the signals.
my modules include:
1 with a lake
1 with a snowscenery
1 coal mine (will be changed to a snow scenery
1 freight depot
2 Bonn Station
1 City
1 HOe
3 Freight yeard (incl. passenger carriages)
2 just landscaping with waterfall
1 funicular railway
2 just landscaping
1 diesel fuel depot
1 Viaduct
2 branchline

regards.,

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
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Online hxmiesa  
#94 Posted : 29 June 2012 09:56:26(UTC)
hxmiesa

Spain   
Joined: 15/12/2005(UTC)
Posts: 3,519
Location: Spain
I think that with so much space you can do better.

I see that you have put a lot of thought into accesibility. That is good, you should NOT compromise on that EVER.
I dont see an area dedicated to hold and store complete trains (shadow-station). I would highly recommend that you do that.
I see that you practically dont use multi-level layout. While you may have your own (and good) reasons for not doing that, I would definatly try to install shadow-stations on lower levels, or hidden under mountains on the main level.

Good luck on the project, and please keep us updated (with photos!)
Best regards
Henrik Hoexbroe ("The Dane In Spain")
http://hoexbroe.tripod.com
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Offline NewMB  
#95 Posted : 29 June 2012 10:20:35(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: hxmiesa Go to Quoted Post
I think that with so much space you can do better.

I see that you have put a lot of thought into accesibility. That is good, you should NOT compromise on that EVER.
I dont see an area dedicated to hold and store complete trains (shadow-station). I would highly recommend that you do that.
I see that you practically dont use multi-level layout. While you may have your own (and good) reasons for not doing that, I would definatly try to install shadow-stations on lower levels, or hidden under mountains on the main level.

Good luck on the project, and please keep us updated (with photos!)



While living in Britain I built a small layout (2x1.2 + 1.2x0.8m) in 2 levels connected via a Helix (Noch) and I found it to be a nightmare to build due to all cables from the top level. There simply was no end to cables everywhere.... ok, it didn't help that I also made the first level (bottom) having lights and fully equipped landscape etc. In reality it was only used to store trains and to run a small branch-line. Because of this I originally have decided not to go for a multilevel layout.

BUT seeing other people's layout on here and the internet has made me think again. Having trains parked, ready to go would be great of course..... not sure where I can put one though and I would prefer to avoid a Helix (@ 360 Degrees) but realise that one way or another, I will need to use this so that the trains can get "downstairs".

Any idea's of where to put it in?

Thanks for the input!!

PS Pics etc will only come once I start building.... but must first build the house (start is imminent!).
Offline Ian555  
#96 Posted : 29 June 2012 11:44:11(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

Good luck with the house build. ThumpUp

What type of construction will it be...timber framed, traditional, concrete blockwork ???.

Very few houses in Scotland are built with a basement, I'd be interested in how that is laid out/built etc.

Ian.

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Offline NewMB  
#97 Posted : 29 June 2012 12:15:04(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: Ian555 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

Good luck with the house build. ThumpUp

What type of construction will it be...timber framed, traditional, concrete blockwork ???.

Very few houses in Scotland are built with a basement, I'd be interested in how that is laid out/built etc.

Ian.



Hi Ian,

Thanks!

I was about to say "all of the above" but is reality it's like this:

Basement: Re-inforced (watertight) concrete walls - 20cm thick + isolation and a few other bits making the walls for the basement 28cm thick. The basement base is also made of re-inforced concrete.
Basement to Ground Floor - concrete
Groundfloor to First Floor and Loft is all timberframe with bricked outer walls. With the outer walls comes lots of isolation etc making them 43cm thick (compared to the 28cm we had in England).

All windows are 3-glas Thermoglas (UW 0.7) and heated floors throughout.

PM sent btw Smile
Offline Ian555  
#98 Posted : 29 June 2012 13:02:44(UTC)
Ian555

Scotland   
Joined: 04/06/2009(UTC)
Posts: 20,235
Location: Scotland
Hi Patrik,

Thanks for the PM. ThumpUp

Ian.



Offline RayF  
#99 Posted : 29 June 2012 13:49:53(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,838
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Hi Patrik,

I've been following the evolution of your plan with interest. I haven't wanted to comment too much because it's all too easy to get too many suggestions from different people all wanting to push their idea of a perfect layout!

I agree with your wishes to keep away from "shadow stations". Real railways don't hide their trains in tunnels when not in use. You have a large area of sidings where you can keep quite a few complete trains. For me that is a perfect solution. In reality unused passenger trains are kept in "carriage sidings" without their locomotives, but you can stretch reality and store them complete with locos.

If you wanted to make more storage space you could even redesign the lower left hand side to include a few passing loops and keep another four to six trains there. I would even possibly decorate this as another station.

There are many advantages of keeping primarily to one level:
You don't have to worry about helixes which can be a pain to build and operate,
You can keep gradients to sensible angles so you don't have to have super pulling power in all your locos,
Access to your stored trains is much easier,
Cleaning tracks is much easier,
etc.

Don't forget, real railways go to great lengths to avoid gradients!

I look forward to seeing how it all works out!
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline NewMB  
#100 Posted : 03 July 2012 22:34:08(UTC)
NewMB

Germany   
Joined: 26/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 668
Location: Erftstadt
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Hi Patrik,

I've been following the evolution of your plan with interest. I haven't wanted to comment too much because it's all too easy to get too many suggestions from different people all wanting to push their idea of a perfect layout!

I agree with your wishes to keep away from "shadow stations". Real railways don't hide their trains in tunnels when not in use. You have a large area of sidings where you can keep quite a few complete trains. For me that is a perfect solution. In reality unused passenger trains are kept in "carriage sidings" without their locomotives, but you can stretch reality and store them complete with locos.

If you wanted to make more storage space you could even redesign the lower left hand side to include a few passing loops and keep another four to six trains there. I would even possibly decorate this as another station.

There are many advantages of keeping primarily to one level:
You don't have to worry about helixes which can be a pain to build and operate,
You can keep gradients to sensible angles so you don't have to have super pulling power in all your locos,
Access to your stored trains is much easier,
Cleaning tracks is much easier,
etc.

Don't forget, real railways go to great lengths to avoid gradients!

I look forward to seeing how it all works out!


Thanks Ray!

Lots of ideas there. I have plenty of time to experiment with the ideas of hidden storage yards.

For me a hidden yard would be great to have as one does not have to prepare loco and wagons every time you want to drive something different. Having it all underneath means they are ready to go. But dust may be an issue.... it certainly was at the old house and plenty of tracks to clean on a regular basis.



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