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Offline skeeterbuck  
#1 Posted : 14 March 2016 14:39:58(UTC)
skeeterbuck

United States   
Joined: 15/12/2015(UTC)
Posts: 523
Location: Maryland, Baltimore
Era II is usually described for model railroad purposes as from 1920-1945. Sometimes you will see era freight wagons cars marked "Deutsche Reichsbahn" and others marked "DR" and both types will be listed as Era II. I always thought that wagons marked with the "DR" would indicate East German cars after the war ended. I realise that marking and repainting didn't take place all at once but over time. Would cars marked "DR" be accurate for before or during the war?

Also what does the areas like "Munchen", "Bremen" etc. indicate?

Just looking for a general historical overview on the subject. Thanks!

Chuck
Offline H0  
#2 Posted : 14 March 2016 19:49:52(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,262
Location: DE-NW
Hi, Chuck,

NEM 806 defines era II as 1920 through 1950.
Deutsche Bundesbahn was founded in September 1949 - until then they used the letters DR. After the war there were additional markings (e.g. "DR US Brit Zone").
I think there was no big hurry to replace DR with DB after 49.

Originally Posted by: skeeterbuck Go to Quoted Post
Also what does the areas like "Munchen", "Bremen" etc. indicate?
How about some photos or a better description?

Locos and coaches belong to a district and a specific station. This is one use for such town names.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline kimballthurlow  
#3 Posted : 14 March 2016 23:21:53(UTC)
kimballthurlow

Australia   
Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,668
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Hi Chuck,

The names such as "Munchen", "Bremen" were allocated to wagons to assist identification by railway employees.
That started in 1910, with the 10 standard rolling stock designs used by all German railroads.
The name idea, is probably a leftover from the provincial railroad systems, prior to 1910.
Each type of wagon was allocated a genus (or two), using town names.

So from 1910, the famous G wagon (covered van) was either Munchen, Kassel, or Cassell and others.
The O (open wagon) was either Breslau or Essen, and others.
It had nothing to do with district of assignment or of deployment.
From 1920, the Deutsch Reichsbahn continued the practice, systematically naming a genus for each series of wagons.

For a full historical analysis of this interesting subject, I wrote this topic last year.
There are also many relevant comments within the topic from user.net members.
https://www.marklin-users.net/forum/posts/t34086-Lettering-on-wagons---ownership---1920-to-1960

regards
Kimball
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge.
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Offline kimballthurlow  
#4 Posted : 14 March 2016 23:32:26(UTC)
kimballthurlow

Australia   
Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,668
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Hi, Chuck,

NEM 806 defines era II as 1920 through 1950.
Deutsche Bundesbahn was founded in September 1949 - until then they used the letters DR. After the war there were additional markings (e.g. "DR US Brit Zone").
I think there was no big hurry to replace DR with DB after 49.
...........


Thanks Tom. I was not aware of the NEM definition.

The "DB" was officially "expected" to be used as of 1954.

regards
Kimball

HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge.
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Offline skeeterbuck  
#5 Posted : 15 March 2016 04:52:27(UTC)
skeeterbuck

United States   
Joined: 15/12/2015(UTC)
Posts: 523
Location: Maryland, Baltimore
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Hi, Chuck,

NEM 806 defines era II as 1920 through 1950.
Deutsche Bundesbahn was founded in September 1949 - until then they used the letters DR. After the war there were additional markings (e.g. "DR US Brit Zone").
I think there was no big hurry to replace DR with DB after 49.

Originally Posted by: skeeterbuck Go to Quoted Post
Also what does the areas like "Munchen", "Bremen" etc. indicate?
How about some photos or a better description?

Locos and coaches belong to a district and a specific station. This is one use for such town names.


Here a pic Tom. In this example "Konigsberg". Kimball has already explained their meaning.

Thanks, Chuck

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Offline skeeterbuck  
#6 Posted : 15 March 2016 05:00:11(UTC)
skeeterbuck

United States   
Joined: 15/12/2015(UTC)
Posts: 523
Location: Maryland, Baltimore
Originally Posted by: kimballthurlow Go to Quoted Post
Hi Chuck,

So from 1910, the famous G wagon (covered van) was either Munchen, Kassel, or Cassell and others.
The O (open wagon) was either Breslau or Essen, and others.

For a full historical analysis of this interesting subject, I wrote this topic last year.
There are also many relevant comments within the topic from user.net members.
https://www.marklin-users.net/forum/posts/t34086-Lettering-on-wagons---ownership---1920-to-1960

regards
Kimball


Thanks for the info Kimball. So, if I'm understanding you correctly using "Munchen" as an example, this would only be used on G wagons.

You wouldn't see "Munchen" on an open wagon or "Essen" on a G wagon. Is this correct?

Chuck
Offline H0  
#7 Posted : 15 March 2016 07:47:33(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,262
Location: DE-NW
With your picture the name "Königsberg" denotes the type of car. All "Königsberg" are gondolas, all "Oppeln" are box cars, all "Köln" are heavy-load flat cars.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by H0
Offline kimballthurlow  
#8 Posted : 15 March 2016 10:13:56(UTC)
kimballthurlow

Australia   
Joined: 18/03/2007(UTC)
Posts: 6,668
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Originally Posted by: skeeterbuck Go to Quoted Post


Thanks for the info Kimball. So, if I'm understanding you correctly using "Munchen" as an example, this would only be used on G wagons.

You wouldn't see "Munchen" on an open wagon or "Essen" on a G wagon. Is this correct?

Chuck


Substantially correct!!!! I don't know of an exception.
And only a guess, but I think you could have found a Munchen wagon #11077 and a Konigsburg wagon #11077. The only differentiation is the genus (or designation).

You can imagine a railway station master phoning the despatch controller at the nearest large holding yard, and saying "I need one Munchen car to take a load of turnips to .....", so there is no confusion.

By the way, the original 10 standard rolling stock designs of 1910 are listed here in tabular form, with diagrams.
http://web.hs-merseburg.de/~nosske/EpocheII/fg/e2f_gwwv.html

Building of these designs had generally ceased by 1928.
Subsequent designs into the 1940s were also allocated a genus (or district/town designation), so you will come across names like Oppeln, Konigsberg etc. That is another subject too.

regards
Kimball
HO Scale - Märklin (ep II-III and VI, C Track, digital) - 2 rail HO (Queensland Australia, UK, USA) - 3 rail OO (English Hornby Dublo) - old clockwork O gauge - Live Steam 90mm (3.1/2 inch) gauge.
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