Welcome to the forum   
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Share
Options
View
Go to last post in this topic Go to first unread post in this topic
Offline mike c  
#1 Posted : 03 January 2016 03:14:58(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,865
Location: Montreal, QC
The new Maerklin Eurofima (1:93.5) is longer (282mm) than the original Maerklin (1:100) model (264mm). The model is also a little narrower and a littleness tall than the older model. I also compared the scale width and height with a comparable Roco coach in the same scale (44201 SBB EWIV) which also had a similar scale width and height to the original Maerklin model. To confirm, I also compared the new Maerklin coach with a few other 1/87 coaches, including the most recent Eurofima models from L.S. Models and ACME. Those coaches are also a little wider than the new Maerklin model. In terms of scale height, the LSM model is very close to the Maerklin one.
The Maerklin model's windows (doors and compartment) seem to be a little under dimensioned. It is possible that as in previous models, the vertical size was also factored into the scale reduction rather than just the scale length. The spacing between the compartment windows and between the WC window and the doors also does not correspond to the 1/87 models. I would go as far to say as the spacing between the compartment windows is the same on the 1:93 and 1:87 models, which should not be the case.
The lettering on the Maerklin coach is nicely done. The destination sign holder is printed on rather than moulded into the plastic as it was on the original model. This will, however, make it easier to apply the destination sign decals.
The handrails (door) are moulded into the plastic. Overall, the detail of the print work is very good. I would have preferred to see the white stripe wrap all the way around the coach ends as per prototype.
The underside of the Maerklin coach is relatively detailed, including the skirting, although that is merely an extension of the coach shell rather than an integrated part of the chassis like the original Maerklin model.
Colourwise, the new Maerklin model has a more matte orange colour than the original bright orange of the 1:100 models. The white stripe is the same greyish white as the 1:87 Roco and LSM models. The older Maerklin and ACME models (and some of the LSM models in the matching livery (see 47235/47220)) had white stripes.
I am looking forward to completing the consist for this new SBB coach, which will run together with FS first and second class coaches, possibly supplemented by the 2015 model of the SBB WRm in red and possibly a single DB 1st class coach of either the Avmz111 or Avmz207 types. I already have this same consist in 1:87, but I intend to equip the Maerklin consist with lighting for night operation. The Maerklin consist will also be able to operate on tighter radii than the exact scale consists, which perform better on R4 and R5.
I will be adding photographs to the this review over the weekend.

Regards

Mike C
thanks 6 users liked this useful post by mike c
Offline H0  
#2 Posted : 03 January 2016 08:49:48(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
It has been written before that the "new longer length" coaches by Märklin are not 1:93.5, they are 282 mm. The length scales I've seen so far are 1:93.5 and 1:97.6 - and the product database incorrectly uses the "1:93.5" symbol for both scales.
It is a well-known fact that a length of 282 mm can be NEM compatible only if the width of the coaches is reduced. That's what Märklin do.

I've noticed with several of the "new longer length" coaches that the windows are to narrow (incorrect aspect ratio for windows) while the spacing between windows it larger than it should be.

At a recent club meeting I tested Piko coaches (303 mm) and Roco coaches (303 mm and 316 mm respectively) on Märklin R1. To my surprise there weren't any problem.
I even had mounted the doorsteps of the Piko coaches and according to Piko the minimum radius for those is Märklin R3 - still it worked with Märklin R1.

Do "new longer length" coaches look better on R1 than full length coaches? Not in my humble opinion. The angle is a bit smaller due to shorter coaches, but the gap is about the same due to relocated pivot points.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by H0
Offline RayF  
#3 Posted : 03 January 2016 09:14:38(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,837
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
As has been discussed before, the issue of scale length versus a compromise length is very much one of personal preference.

In my opinion the longer coaches should be offered in two lengths, 1:100 and 1:87. I believe some manufacturers have offered this choice in the past. I don't think the intermediate 28.2 cm length looks that different to the old standard of 27cm and has only added another variable to the whole discussion.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by RayF
Offline H0  
#4 Posted : 03 January 2016 09:28:59(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,249
Location: DE-NW
The prototype length of 26.4 m is available in at least five model lengths: 24 cm, 26.4 cm, 27 cm, 28.2 cm, 30.3 cm.
Some say they prefer 28.2 cm because it allows an extra coach at their platform.
Some say they prefer 26.4/27 cm because it allows an extra coach at their platform.
Some say they prefer 24 cm because it allows an extra coach at their platform.

Or the other way around: a platform that was built for e.g. five 27 cm coaches may not allow five 30.3 cm coaches - and people therefore stick to older, shorter coaches.
Curves with bridges, tunnel portals, signals, catenary masts are another issue - not all layouts allow 30.3/31.6 cm coaches.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by H0
Offline sjlauritsen  
#5 Posted : 03 January 2016 12:14:15(UTC)
sjlauritsen

Denmark   
Joined: 18/08/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,081
Location: Denmark
I do not think of the 282 mm coaches as a problem. It is a model with compromises, as any model, this time the length is one of the compromises. I don't see why this has to be brought up every single time somebody expresses love for Märklin's coaches.

What I think is much "worse" is that the white stripe does is not painted on the ends of the Eurofima coach. That sounds a bit on the cheap side. Are we sure that there is not a prototype where this was the case? Some times they base the paint scheme on an oddball of a prototype.
Søren from Denmark
Blog: https://railway.zone/ | Danish Model Railway Forum: https://baneforum.dk/
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by sjlauritsen
Offline mike c  
#6 Posted : 03 January 2016 18:54:19(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,865
Location: Montreal, QC
As I was putting away the 43340 for the night, I noticed that there are a pair of slots underneath the washroom compartments and a pair of stick-in drain pipes that can be added to the model.

I used the scale length of 1:93.5 in reference to this model because this is the ratio that was used to reduce a 26,40m coach to 282mm. This was the scale that was originally used by Fleischmann when it expanded from 24cm (Maerklin went to 1:100).

Roco chose the Fleischmann standard when it brought out it's SBB EWIV coaches in 1983, a year or two before introducing it's first 1:87 models. The end result was that the SBB EWIV remained orphan coaches in the Roco collection and no further 1:93.5 coaches came from Austria. Roco eventually released exact scale models of the SBB EWIV. Roco's decision in 1983 was determined by the fact that the EWIV at 1:93 were approximately the same length as the exact scale EWII B and could therefore be used by modellers who were using that model (paraphrased from the 1983-84 catalog).

The decision by some manufacturers to make models with a prototype length of under 25m in exact scale, while longer coaches are rendered in reduced scale length makes for complicated combinations. For example, the new Am Eurofima, Bcm and WRm of the SBB are all 1:93 while the lightsteel coaches were 1:87. For DB fans, some might be frustrated that the WRmz diner is not longer than the compartment coaches as in prototype.

My frustration with reduced scale lengths is that this ratio should affect the coach length, window and door widths only. Window and door height should remain in 1:87. The alternative would be to render the model with less compartments/windows as was the norm when the models were only 24cm long. Rendering all these dimensions in reduced scale does result in windows that look too small and spacing that does not appear proportional to prototype.

Regards

Mike C
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by mike c
Offline danmarklinman  
#7 Posted : 08 January 2016 08:55:59(UTC)
danmarklinman

United Kingdom   
Joined: 18/10/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,377
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
It has been written before that the "new longer length" coaches by Märklin are not 1:93.5, they are 282 mm. The length scales I've seen so far are 1:93.5 and 1:97.6 - and the product database incorrectly uses the "1:93.5" symbol for both scales.
It is a well-known fact that a length of 282 mm can be NEM compatible only if the width of the coaches is reduced. That's what Märklin do.

I've noticed with several of the "new longer length" coaches that the windows are to narrow (incorrect aspect ratio for windows) while the spacing between windows it larger than it should be.

At a recent club meeting I tested Piko coaches (303 mm) and Roco coaches (303 mm and 316 mm respectively) on Märklin R1. To my surprise there weren't any problem.
I even had mounted the doorsteps of the Piko coaches and according to Piko the minimum radius for those is Märklin R3 - still it worked with Märklin R1.

Do "new longer length" coaches look better on R1 than full length coaches? Not in my humble opinion. The angle is a bit smaller due to shorter coaches, but the gap is about the same due to relocated pivot points.


Dear HO, when the piko coaches were tested on Marklin radius 1? Was it K or C track? As I was thinking about getting a Corail Piko SNCF coach?
.
Cheers Dan
Marklin and Piko era 4 SNCB , Marklin wagons
Wiking model car Fan
Faller fan including car system
Instagram: marklin1978
Wiking fan
Offline RayF  
#8 Posted : 08 January 2016 13:03:33(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,837
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
My main problem with longer coaches is the overhang on R1 curves. I have some coaches I can't use because they hit every catenary mast as they go round the ends of my layout.

It's funny that I'me so used to the shorter model coaches that scale length ones look wrong to me. I picked up some Piko Silverfish coaches in a shop recently and then put them back on the shelf because they looked longer than they should to my eyes. I have a theory that we never see real coaches from the side like we do our models. Usually we see them at an oblique angle at a station platform, where the length is foreshortened.

To answer Dan's question, Piko coaches tend to run well on my Marklin C track, and I have no problems with R1 curves or turnouts. If you want to be really safe you can get AC wheels for them that have the correct dimensions.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
thanks 3 users liked this useful post by RayF
Offline danmarklinman  
#9 Posted : 08 January 2016 14:18:41(UTC)
danmarklinman

United Kingdom   
Joined: 18/10/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,377
Thanks Ray, I might have a rake of them, it might not look to bad along with the new Marklin SNCF eurofima to provide first class accommodation and lighting?. Also the new Piko SNCF Z2 looks really interesting.?:-)
Have you got any Piko diesels?
Link to Piko Sncf new items
http://web.lerelaisinter...ailway/piko.htm#MACHINES
Marklin and Piko era 4 SNCB , Marklin wagons
Wiking model car Fan
Faller fan including car system
Instagram: marklin1978
Wiking fan
thanks 1 user liked this useful post by danmarklinman
Offline RayF  
#10 Posted : 08 January 2016 19:11:06(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,837
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Originally Posted by: danmarklinman Go to Quoted Post
Thanks Ray, I might have a rake of them, it might not look to bad along with the new Marklin SNCF eurofima to provide first class accommodation and lighting?. Also the new Piko SNCF Z2 looks really interesting.?:-)
Have you got any Piko diesels?
Link to Piko Sncf new items
http://web.lerelaisinter...ailway/piko.htm#MACHINES


I have several of the Piko AC locos. The "expert" range are about the same price as the Marklin equivalents and are a bit better detailed, except that the bodies are plastic if that matters to you.

As far as diesels go I have the CFL 1500 and the DR 118. I'm very happy with them.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline danmarklinman  
#11 Posted : 08 January 2016 21:13:34(UTC)
danmarklinman

United Kingdom   
Joined: 18/10/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,377
Thanks Ray, I must admit I'm still a bit hesitant after Brawa engine turned out this year to be a bit of a let down, I may weight for Marklins anouncments. It's good to know there is an alternative if nothing takes my fancy from Mother MLOL Do you use K or C track?
Marklin and Piko era 4 SNCB , Marklin wagons
Wiking model car Fan
Faller fan including car system
Instagram: marklin1978
Wiking fan
Offline RayF  
#12 Posted : 08 January 2016 23:18:35(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,837
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Originally Posted by: danmarklinman Go to Quoted Post
Thanks Ray, I must admit I'm still a bit hesitant after Brawa engine turned out this year to be a bit of a let down, I may weight for Marklins anouncments. It's good to know there is an alternative if nothing takes my fancy from Mother MLOL Do you use K or C track?


I use C track. I changed over from M track after trying the C track that came in a starter set. I was very impressed with how smooth and quiet the trains were compared to M Track.

I'm afraid I have no experience of K Track, but I think I would try it if I was ever tempted to create an exhibition layout.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline Mark_1602  
#13 Posted : 10 January 2016 15:31:45(UTC)
Mark_1602

Luxembourg   
Joined: 24/09/2014(UTC)
Posts: 704
Location: Luxembourg
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
I have a theory that we never see real coaches from the side like we do our models. Usually we see them at an oblique angle at a station platform, where the length is foreshortened.


That's true, Ray. Objectively, the 1:87 coaches are the right length, but the way we perceive objects is subjective, so 1:100 coaches look right. The newer 1:93.5 coaches look very nice, but only on larger layouts with Flex-K-tracks, or at least R4/R5. On smaller layouts with R3 or less, 1:100 coaches probably look most convincing.

Best regards,
Mark
Best regards, Mark

I like Märklin items produced in the 1960s or early '70s, but also digital locos & current rolling stock.
thanks 2 users liked this useful post by Mark_1602
Users browsing this topic
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

| Powered by YAF.NET | YAF.NET © 2003-2024, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.860 seconds.