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Offline ari1982  
#1 Posted : 30 November 2012 19:51:27(UTC)
ari1982

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2012(UTC)
Posts: 58
Location: San Francisco
So I just got a new Marklin 4089 car, it has factory installed interior lights and end of the cab lights. The wheels are somewhat loose, it seems that the suspension assembly is too wide so the wheels come off sometimes when cornering. Is this a "feature" for this car or I just got a bad one?

I can post pics later
Offline mike c  
#2 Posted : 30 November 2012 20:30:50(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,880
Location: Montreal, QC
One clarification requested. When you say come off, do you mean that the axles actually pop out of the bogie or do you mean the wheels pop off the rails (derails)?

If the axles are popping out of the bogie, that does not seem like normal operation. Was it bought from a dealer or from a private sale? If it was bought (new) from a dealer, I would return it or ask for a replacement bogie. It sounds like the plastic frame of the bogie is deformed and somehow allowing the axle to pop out. If it was a private sale or second hand purchase, you may be able to return it or you will have to either repair or replace the bogie at your cost.

If you can post photos, this will probably help us diagnose the exact problem.

Regards

Mike C
Offline ari1982  
#3 Posted : 30 November 2012 20:46:39(UTC)
ari1982

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2012(UTC)
Posts: 58
Location: San Francisco
Hi Mike,
Axle pops out of the bogie. Actually one axle had already popped out in the box. it was brand new from Marklin dealer (AJC). I'll post some pics. The bogies seem brand new and intact (not deformed) but it looks like the axles are too short to fit securely in the bogie groves!!!


Offline Western Pacific  
#4 Posted : 01 December 2012 14:27:00(UTC)
Western Pacific

Sweden   
Joined: 19/09/2009(UTC)
Posts: 841
Location: Lidingö, Sweden
This is a tin-plate 24 cm coach and that means that the design of the bogie is a combination metal and plastic. The top part which is connected to the floor of the coach is metal. The sides are plastic and behind them metal parts holding the wheel sets. These metal parts are not visible from the outside of the bogie. This picture shows the bogie as a spare part (the top one):




What you could do is to have a look at the metal part that sits behind the plastic bogie sides and slightly bend it inwards.

Edited by user 02 December 2012 10:11:11(UTC)  | Reason: Typo

Offline JohnjeanB  
#5 Posted : 03 December 2012 20:25:07(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,084
Location: Paris, France
Hello ARI1982
As was said earlier the boggies are made of a sheetmetal frame with 2 vertical sides. On these sides the 2 boggie plastic housings & its metal frame (where the axles are rotating into ) are slightly rotating into a hole to accomodate track uneven sections.
You problem if I understand correctly is to remove one of the plastic housing (remove the C clips that prevents it from falling.
Then with a flat plier, very slightly bend the boggie frame inside so that the distance between the two parts holding your boggie cheeks is reduced (1/2 to 1 mm?).
Then re-assemble - its finished.
Cheers
Jean
Offline mike c  
#6 Posted : 04 December 2012 08:21:37(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,880
Location: Montreal, QC
I would have suggested straightening out the bogie, but since it was just bought (new) from a dealer, I suggested that he contact the dealer first, before trying any repairs himself.

Regards,

Mike C
Offline ari1982  
#7 Posted : 05 December 2012 09:27:45(UTC)
ari1982

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2012(UTC)
Posts: 58
Location: San Francisco
Thanks guys, so I contacted the dealer and they said they looked at another box and the axles where loose as well! they suggested I just push the bogies with my fingers. I did but I'm afraid it will break. I am convinced this is a common issue because I ordered a similar TEE car 4087 from an eBay seller and guess what. All 4 axles loose! These cars are factory installed with lights (both shoe and ground at one bogie) so maybe this is why?


Photo shows the axle which is too short for a secure fit in the bogie holes
ari1982 attached the following image(s):
_H5D7082.jpg
Offline JohnjeanB  
#8 Posted : 05 December 2012 11:41:53(UTC)
JohnjeanB

France   
Joined: 04/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 3,084
Location: Paris, France
Hello Ari1982
As I explained, remove the 2 circlips (Red arrow):
UserPostedImage
Then remove the boggie sides
Slightly bend the vertical side of the frame to narrow the distance between those 2 sides (in the direction of the red arrows)
Assemble back
Finished
Cheers
Jean
Offline Western Pacific  
#9 Posted : 05 December 2012 17:28:25(UTC)
Western Pacific

Sweden   
Joined: 19/09/2009(UTC)
Posts: 841
Location: Lidingö, Sweden

Even if JohnjeanB suggests that you should remove the the bogie sides, I'd suggest that before trying that, try the following:

1) Remove the wheel set.
2) Hold the bogie between thumb and index finger without really pressing, insert a thin screwdriver between the plastic bogie side and the thin metal plate. (Insert it roughly at where your white arrows point).
3) Bend the metal plate inwards carefully on both sides.
4) Try putting the wheel set back and if it stays in place - fine done! - if not repeat the procedure.

The reason for why I suggest this method is that the plastic part around which the C-clip is attached may break. It has happened to me once and that was decades ago and on a relatively new coach. Your 4089 is old, even if it was bought new and the plastic bogie sides may have become more brittle with age. (According to "Helmut Kern" this model was last produced in 1980).
Offline mike c  
#10 Posted : 05 December 2012 18:05:01(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,880
Location: Montreal, QC
Arash,

looking at your photo, the first thing that struck me is that this is not a "new" or "unused" model. The wheels show wear and the oxidization on the underside of the coach and rust on the bogie behind the buffers suggest that this model may have gotten damp/wet or been exposed to the elements. This deterioration might have also affected the metal that holds the wheelsets in place. I am wondering if the dealer may have replaced the original wheelsets with more modern ones in slightly better condition, which may not fit into the bogies quite as well as the originals would have, or may have bent the metal arms that hold the wheelsets in place while making the swap.
I have one of these coaches, bought around 2000 from a dealer and it is in pristine condition, as any other model coming straight out of the box. I have not seen any issues with wheelsets popping out of the bogies on any of the dozen or so 24cm metal coaches in my collection or in any of the shops where I have worked or been a regular customer over the years.

Regards

Mike C
Offline Hoffmann  
#11 Posted : 05 December 2012 19:05:57(UTC)
Hoffmann

Canada   
Joined: 25/11/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,106
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Hi all,

I will post a Picture of the Bogie shortly.. It is very easy to bend the Metal Taps so the Wheel will fit correctly. As mentioned by "Western Pacific"

I would never cross my mind to send a 30Year old car back to the Dealer for Warranty.

Reason being that the Dealer will not be able to get you another one. He may fix the Bogie himself and send the car back to you and all you do is waste Postage.


From Top to Bottom : Plastic outer Frame--Metal Frame (which holds Wheels )-- Small Circlip which holds Bogie on car-- Large Circlip which holds Plastic and Metal Frame--Wheels--Bogie--.
Hoffmann attached the following image(s):
DSCN0383.JPG
marklin-eh
Offline ari1982  
#12 Posted : 05 December 2012 23:10:54(UTC)
ari1982

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2012(UTC)
Posts: 58
Location: San Francisco
thanks I will try these suggestions and hopefully it will fix it!



As I mentioned these are new cars, they have probably been sitting on a shelf for a long time as they have been discontinued for a long time. I like these cars because unlike the new ones they are made of metal. The new coaches have better build tolerance in their bogies but I don't like the plastic feel. The fact that different models from two different dealers show exactly the same issue indicates it is manufacturing related.


One other thing that I don't like is the old incandescent light bulbs inside the cars, in particular the 4087. They are too bright and somewhat distracting. Is it possible to replace this with a diffuse light bar or LEDs?

Thanks again
Offline mike c  
#13 Posted : 06 December 2012 02:37:01(UTC)
mike c

Canada   
Joined: 28/11/2007(UTC)
Posts: 7,880
Location: Montreal, QC
Originally Posted by: Hoffmann Go to Quoted Post
I would never cross my mind to send a 30Year old car back to the Dealer for Warranty.

Reason being that the Dealer will not be able to get you another one. He may fix the Bogie himself and send the car back to you and all you do is waste Postage.


1) If the dealer advertised the item as new with Full Warranty, I would expect the dealer to honor that warranty, by:
a) Exchanging the model if he has another one in stock, or
b) Ordering and replacing the damaged/defective bogie(s) as required to return the coach to proper condition
c) issuing a credit note, refund or similar

If the dealer is equipped to suitable repair the item and return it to the customer, in many cases, the dealer may have more professional tools than the customer.

The original post referred to the item as being "new" "from the dealer", hence my suggestion, which I have elaborated on above.

The so-called "new" item appears more used than items that I have had in my collection for 30 years. Additionally, if you look at the photo you provided and compare it to the wheelsets in Arush's photo, there are differences that may explain why the wheelsets are not staying in place. The wheelsets in Arush's photo look more like those from the 27cm plastic bogied coaches.

Regards,

Mike C

Offline Hoffmann  
#14 Posted : 06 December 2012 03:47:08(UTC)
Hoffmann

Canada   
Joined: 25/11/2004(UTC)
Posts: 1,106
Location: Guelph, Ontario


Hello Mike,

It crossed my mind as well that the Wheels may not be the proper one for this car. However I checked all my Wheels I have in stock and the one from the 27cm car may work but not for long.

See Picture of the two types of Wheels.
Hoffmann attached the following image(s):
DSCN0384.JPG
marklin-eh
Offline ari1982  
#15 Posted : 06 December 2012 17:55:38(UTC)
ari1982

United States   
Joined: 23/08/2012(UTC)
Posts: 58
Location: San Francisco
my cars have the wheels on the left. I'll get to sit down and fix them this weekend.
Offline sgtb  
#16 Posted : 01 February 2016 22:20:23(UTC)
sgtb

United States   
Joined: 21/04/2014(UTC)
Posts: 27
Location: Central Ohio
Hi guys,
I just tuned up 4 this weekend. First when you pop that e clip, make sure your finger keeps it from flying away and taking 2 days finding it. oops.
With the bogie off, its a good time to adjust the coupler height. check also to see that it is l shaped or 90 degrees not a z like mine was.
With it shaped like a z the coupler was under the coach too far and bind, causing a derail.
Be carefull that plastic breaks easy and good luck.


Bob
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