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Offline H0  
#1 Posted : 01 January 2011 14:37:30(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
I'm not trying to write a manual. A manual is available from Märklin:
http://medienpdb.maerkli.../1/pdf/60653_betrieb.pdf
Copy URL to address bar. English version in the second half (use Adobe Reader to turn pages around).

The Mobile Stations from TRIX and Märklin are identical except for printing and colours.
The TRIX version also shows the Märklin logo when it's turned on:
UserPostedImage

Default language is German:
UserPostedImage

Open the options and select "Sprache" to change this:
UserPostedImage
Press SHIFT and TURNOUT to open this menue, then press the key to the left of "Sprache" to select this entry.

"Deutsch" is selected, but "Englisch" is the second entry in the list:
UserPostedImage

There we are in English:
UserPostedImage

Trying to add a new loco leads to this menue:
UserPostedImage
The menue has three items, but only two are visible. Two keys to the right of the screen are used to scroll up and down, two keys on the left are used to select an entry.

"Find" will try to find the address of an MM loco on the track (must be the only loco on the track). Locos with LEDs as lights are normally not detected (probably they don't draw enough current).

UserPostedImage
"Enter Manually" can be used if you quickly want to test a loco or if you know the loco is not in the database.
For digital Märklin locos, "From Database" normally is the best choice.

UserPostedImage
The product database also shows two items at a time (sigh).

UserPostedImage
Good news: if you press SHIFT, you can use the knob to scroll quickly through the list.
With MS2, the list is sorted by string, meaning that 37xx and 37xxx are mixed in one section (with MS1 they were sorted by number).

The 39xxx numbers are a long way down the road:
UserPostedImage
The name "BR 152 902-3" is another Märklinism: writing BR (short for Baureihe or class) only makes sense when referring to the whole class (as in "BR 152") but is not used when referring to a single loco of that class (as in "152 902-3").
Editing loco names is not shown in this review, but it is a time-consuming process: you use keys to select the character position to modify, then use the knob to select the character you want.
With MS1 it was just a matter of turning an clicking the knob and could normally be done faster (but OTOH there were no lower case characters).

Here's the loco created from database (with unchanged name):
UserPostedImage

Pressing the loco key selects the next loco slot:
UserPostedImage
"+" indicates free permanent slots, "o" is the volatile slot (the eleventh loco will not be remembered when power is turned off).

I put an mfx loco on the track and pressed the STOP key. After a few seconds, the "mfx" symbol starts flashing:
UserPostedImage

Here's the mfx loco (with functions F0 through F7):
UserPostedImage

When SHIFT is held, you can access F8 through F15. The grown loco symbol indicates that you can use the knob to select a different loco (the loco key will always take you to the next slot so you have to press it ten times to get back to the previous loco so SHIFT plus knob is a better way to move loco selection to the left):
UserPostedImage

Inverted function symbols indicate activated functions:
UserPostedImage

Available loco symbols (1 of 3):
UserPostedImage

Available loco symbols (2 of 3):
UserPostedImage

Available loco symbols (3 of 3):
UserPostedImage

Mobile Station 2 can control up to 320 turnouts - two are showing at the same time:
UserPostedImage
Use the keys left and right from the display to activate that turnout.

After switching turnout 1:
UserPostedImage

After moving to the next screen:
UserPostedImage

And the last screen:
UserPostedImage
(since the list wraps around it's a short way from 1/2 to 319/320)

And here's the slave MS - still void:
UserPostedImage

Here we find a new option: "From Master":
UserPostedImage

This brings up another menue with two visible items where you can select the loco fom:
UserPostedImage
Note 1: when used with a CS2, you use this option to select a loco from the complete CS2 loco list; however this list is not sorted by name - with e. g. 200 locos registered on the CS2 and two items visible from an unsorted list, this is a helluva fun job to select up to ten locos for control with the MS2.
Note 2: the Master cannot copy locos back from the Slave (unless a loco card is used)
Note 3: originally my MS2 (bought in October 2010) came with software V 1.1 and this option was missing; after upgrading to V 1.5 (MS2 must be connected to a CS2 with current software) this option was available (I don't know which version introduced this feature).

MS2 shows a gauge control while data is being copied (not really necessary, takes only one second):
UserPostedImage

Here's the loco on the Slave:
UserPostedImage
Now you can delete it on the Master to free a slot for another loco - but you cannot copy it back.

For DCC, addresses from 1 through 10239 are supported:
UserPostedImage
You can use SHIFT plus knob to quickly change the address.

For programmable MM decoders, addresses from 1 through 255 are supported:
UserPostedImage

For old-fashioned "mouse piano" MM decoders, addresses from 1 through 80 are supported:
UserPostedImage

The MS2 in all its beauty:
UserPostedImage
There are keys around the knob and beginners sometimes hit them accidentally (when turning the know with three fingers). You can avoid this if you turn the knob with a thumb from below.

21 horizontal bars next to the function keys on the right indicate the current speed setting of the loco:
UserPostedImage
It seems the MS2 used 167 virtual speed steps for every loco.

I made a test with a current Märklin hobby loco that supports 14 speed steps only.
At virtual speed steps (VSS) 0 and 1 the loco was still standing (physical speed step PSS 0).
At VSS 2 through 7 the loco was running at PSS 1.
At VSS 8 through 18 the loco was running at PSS 2.
At VSS 19 through 29 the loco was running at PSS 3.
At VSS 30 through 39 the loco was running at PSS 4.
At VSS 40 through 50 the loco was running at PSS 5.
At VSS 51 through 61 the loco was running at PSS 6.
With VSS 62 the loco reached PSS 7 (and I gave up the test).

Limitations
Each MS2 can store 10 locos (I call them permanent slots) plus a volatile loco that is lost when power is turned off.
With two MS2s it's 10+1 for every MS2 allowing up to 22 locos.
The connection box supports up to two MS2s.
For people with more than 10 locos, loco cards seem to be a good choice to work around this 10 loco limit of the MS2.
I haven't tested working with loco cards yet.
Maximum track power is 1.9 A (which should be enough for 3 through 6 H0 locos running at the same time (your mileage may vary)).

Personal Reflections
The MS2 is much better than the old Mobile Station 1:
- 16 functions with mfx locos (versus 9 with MS1)
- 255 addresses for MM locos (versus 80 with MS1)
- DCC support
- turnout support

I take it with me to club meetings and we use it at home for a "carpet railway" and it's good for that.
Support for turnouts is useful only for carpet railway and club meetings; for a permanent layout control boxes would be a better option IMHO.

The display is better than it looks on the photos.
Many menues only show two items at a time which is annoying with long lists (especially with long unsorted lists).

Bad news for mailorder customers: MM recommends visiting your dealer once a year to upgrade the software.

My TRIX MS2 developed a display problem after a few days (one horizontal line and one vertical line were always dark).
It had version 1.1 when I bought it in October 2010 and version 1.5 when I sent it to repair. The replacement unit came in December 2010 with version 1.3 and needed an update.

Advantages of the Central Stations
The MS2 is an entry level controller.
Both CS1 reloaded and CS2 still have their advantages:
- two locos on screen, two speed knobs
- (at least) 16 functions visible on screen
- touchscreen (with on-screen keyboards to enter addresses, ref. numbers, loco names etc.)
- layout display for comfortable turnout control
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
UserPostedImage
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Offline RayF  
#2 Posted : 01 January 2011 14:56:27(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,838
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Tom, that's an excellent overview of the MS2. I'll go through that a few times I think.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline Darren W  
#3 Posted : 01 January 2011 18:23:25(UTC)
Darren W

Canada   
Joined: 01/01/2007(UTC)
Posts: 643
Location: Alberta
Thanks for the review it's the next best thing to having one in my hands. It is also nice to see someone who actually has the Marklin and Trix versions who can say without a doubt that they are the same apart from name.

Darren
Offline nevw  
#4 Posted : 02 January 2011 00:52:58(UTC)
nevw

Australia   
Joined: 27/08/2005(UTC)
Posts: 11,071
Location: Murrumba Downs QLD
A nice review Tom,
Thanks.
NN
NOt wearing the Pink Pinny, which is hard to see and now I have a white Pinny which also is hard to see against MY pure white Skin Still have 2 new shiny tin Hips that is badly in Need of Repair matching rusting tin shoulders
and a hose pipe on the aorta
Junior member of the Banana Club, a reformist and an old Goat with a Bad memory, loafing around
Offline river6109  
#5 Posted : 03 January 2011 10:37:25(UTC)
river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,636
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Yes, very informative,

Thank Tom.

John
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
Offline Jim Calderone  
#6 Posted : 23 February 2011 23:25:33(UTC)
Jim Calderone


Joined: 23/02/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1
Location: New Mexico
Confused I am brand new to digital railroading, and the Marklin Mobile Station 60653. I just tried to "register" my first digital loco. I didn't have a loco card, so I tried manual entry. I followed step-by-step in manual. I do not get any response in loco from mobile station. What should I do now?
Offline TimR  
#7 Posted : 24 February 2011 08:07:00(UTC)
TimR

Indonesia   
Joined: 16/08/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,752
Location: Jakarta
Originally Posted by: Jim Calderone Go to Quoted Post
Confused I am brand new to digital railroading, and the Marklin Mobile Station 60653. I just tried to "register" my first digital loco. I didn't have a loco card, so I tried manual entry. I followed step-by-step in manual. I do not get any response in loco from mobile station. What should I do now?


This is not a problem with your 60653.

I take from your question your digital model is not MFX (it's not auto-registering).

What is the model number?
Older Marklin models has a dip switch on the decoder to identify the digital address;
there are several different types of these depending on the model.

Then you need to change the address on your MS so that it would match the address of the model.

Now collecting C-Sine models.
Offline baggio  
#8 Posted : 10 February 2014 04:43:08(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
I realize that this question follows a thread that is quite old. However, perhaps someone will be nice enough to answer this question:

I have a starter digital set, the construction one;
I am considering buying an MS2;


On my set, to change control from one loco to another, the wireless remote on my digital set requires me to move a switch at the back of the remote control and then I can control the loco corresponding to the position I chose (there are four positions).

The problem:
If I want to avoid one loco hitting the other, the process of switching takes too long (also, sometimes I overshoot the position) and I run the risk of not being able to prevent the accident. (The remote control does not have a stop button that stops ALL trains. I know that the MS2 does, the big red button, I believe).

How does one switch from one loco to another on the MS2? How long does the process take without having to push the red button?

Thank you to anyone who may be good enough to answer this question. BigGrin
Offline franciscohg  
#9 Posted : 10 February 2014 05:12:42(UTC)
franciscohg

Chile   
Joined: 10/07/2002(UTC)
Posts: 3,266
Location: Patagonia
it is pretty fast, you press the shift button and then turn the red know until you reach the desired loco, with only 10 to choose that will not take too long.
By pressing the red knob you only stops the selected loco
For emergengy stop, you have to press the STOP button
Regards
UserPostedImage German trains era I-II and selected III, era depends on the mood, mostly Maerklin but i can be heretic if needed XD, heresy is no longer an issue.. LOL
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Offline BrandonVA  
#10 Posted : 10 February 2014 18:15:52(UTC)
BrandonVA

United States   
Joined: 09/12/2011(UTC)
Posts: 2,533
Location: VA
Baggio,

You could also control two locos simultaneously with two MS2. The track box (60113) will support two MS2 without any additional items needed (other than the second MS2 itself).

WIth MS2 you can also just hit the loco key to advance to the next loco (sequentially through the loco list), but normally this seems to turn out not to be the order you want.

-Brandon
Offline baggio  
#11 Posted : 11 February 2014 04:46:50(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Thank you for your feedback, guys. BigGrin

There is a DCC controller where (if I am not mistaken) one can push a button and, voila', you change loco. I was hoping the MS2 would be like this, but obviously it is not so. Pity.

The time it takes to do what you all pointed out to me seems to be the same as in my wireless remote control. Under normal conditions, they are both fine, but in a jam, they are both a bit slow.

I will need to simply buy a switch that will shut off all power to all locos. In that sense, the MS2 is better since it has the off button already (albeit not the red one, it appears).

Good night from Toronto and thank you all again.

Baggio aka Silvano
Offline baggio  
#12 Posted : 06 December 2014 05:08:51(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Hello Everyone:

I was looking for a DCC controller and looked around a while. I then realized that Trix is DC and DCC as well as Marklin.

My hope is that by buying the Trix Mobile Station I could gain access to ALL DCC locos, be it, Trix (obviously) but also Roco, Walthers, Kato and Marklin AC digital locos.

So far, am I right? Is the Trix 66950 re truly a universal controller that would allow me to use one day any DCC loco, American, Europan or Japanese, and another day a Marklin loco?.

Any feedback would be truly appreciated.

BigGrin
Offline H0  
#13 Posted : 06 December 2014 09:38:38(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Is the Trix 66950 re truly a universal controller that would allow me to use one day any DCC loco, American, European or Japanese, and another day a Marklin loco?
The Trix 66950 is a somewhat limited DCC¹ controller (16 functions per loco only). Apart from that I think it can do anything you need from a DCC controller.

It does not have an extra output for a programming track, but you can add an external switch, so this is no issue.

The Märklin MS2 is absolutely the same.

ESU ECoS and Märklin CS2 give you much the same options (ECoS supports 28 functions per loco).
And you can run DCC locos and Märklin locos at the same time - same track or different tracks.
If you don't need mfx, there are many other options for DCC and Märklin Motorola like the Intellibox from Uhlenbrock.

These options are available for years now, so you can find such "universal controllers" also on the second hand market. The MS2 from either Märklin or Trix could still be the most affordable solution.

¹ In this post, DCC refers to NMRA DCC.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#14 Posted : 06 December 2014 12:57:24(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: BrandonVA Go to Quoted Post
Baggio,

You could also control two locos simultaneously with two MS2. The track box (60113) will support two MS2 without any additional items needed (other than the second MS2 itself).

-Brandon


Has anyone tried using the terminal connection box to attempt to have more than 2 MS2 devices on one of these tracks? It seems to me, from my knowledge of the CAN protocol that this should be possible.

Offline baggio  
#15 Posted : 06 December 2014 12:58:19(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
How is this possible: "And you can run DCC locos and Märklin locos at the same time - same track or different tracks."? The former is a DC system and the other an AC system. Confused
Offline H0  
#16 Posted : 06 December 2014 17:40:25(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
The former is a DC system and the other an AC system. Confused
That's old thinking.
"DC" just stands for "two rail" and "AC" just for "three rail". Motors, decoders, and digital controllers are the same, the current on the track is the same. Therefore it is rather simple to convert locos from 2R to 3R.
You can connect 2R and 3R tracks to one controller at the same time and run locos.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline baggio  
#17 Posted : 06 December 2014 17:44:29(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Well, I just bought a Marklin MS2 so that I have the best of both worlds, AC and DC BigGrin

Merry Christmas to me!

ThumpUp
Offline baggio  
#18 Posted : 08 December 2014 02:02:18(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Sorry, Tom, but I need to know:

Are you saying that with the MS2 it is possible to run both a DCC loco and a Marklin digital loco on the SAME track?

How is this possible?

That seems to me is like saying you can watch a Beta tape on a VHS machine.

Am I missing something? Confused Confused Confused
Offline GDJTrain65  
#19 Posted : 08 December 2014 03:10:02(UTC)
GDJTrain65

Sweden   
Joined: 13/01/2014(UTC)
Posts: 88
Location: Gävle, Sweden
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Sorry, Tom, but I need to know:

Are you saying that with the MS2 it is possible to run both a DCC loco and a Marklin digital loco on the SAME track?

How is this possible?

That seems to me is like saying you can watch a Beta tape on a VHS machine.

Am I missing something? Confused Confused Confused


Hi
Well , I am not Tom, but maybe I can try to answer anyway...
...yes, it is possible with MS2 and Central station. They are multi-protocol controls. I run everything from DELTA, MM to MFX and DCC on my layout. Usually I run non-Märklin locos in DCC format but sometimes I choose MM. I have locos from , besides M, Roco, Fleischmann, Brawa, Piko amongst others.
They are all running on the same track , some of them in DCC, others in MM or MFX.
The only thing is, (maybe its just me), is to keep to the format that each loco had when I added it. One example is a Brawa loc I recently bought. I entered it in MM and it worked very well. Then I tried to test it in DCC and it didnt run at all. And a Roco loc was behaving very strange when I changed from DCC to MM.
Please note that I only use 3-rail locos, dunno about 2-rail. I am sure that Tom can give you more information. Cheerz.
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Offline baggio  
#20 Posted : 08 December 2014 04:50:16(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
"Please note that I only use 3-rail locos"

In that case, the mystery is solved, you are not really running DCC locos, you are running the Marklin equivalent. BigGrin
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Offline H0  
#21 Posted : 08 December 2014 08:31:03(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
In that case, the mystery is solved, you are not really running DCC locos, you are running the Marklin equivalent. BigGrin
A DCC loco with centre rail pickup is still a DCC loco for me.
I can run two-rail and three-rail locos at the same time with the same controller. Track signals are the same - two-rail and three-rail are just different "plugs" to bring the juice to the loco. DCC, MM, and mfx are just different "languages" to bring commands to the locos.

There are locos (from ESU and other companies) where you just have to add or remove a centre rail pickup to switch between two-rail and three-rail operation.
The current takes different paths from controller to decoder due to different rail architecture, the rest is the same.

A Piko DCC loco with centre rail pickup is not the "Marklin equivalent" - it's better. LOL
Some dealers advertise it as "AC" or "for Märklin".
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline biedmatt  
#22 Posted : 08 December 2014 15:37:20(UTC)
biedmatt

United States   
Joined: 09/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,343
Location: Southwest Ohio
They are all DC. Even Marklin analog AC loko will run on DC. What determines direction of travel with a field coil motor is which of the two coils is powered. Put plus to the motor brush and negative to the field coil and it will run. Put that negative on the other field coil and will run in the opposite direction. This is why they are called "all current" and not "alternating current" motors. One of Marklin's big secrets when MM came out in the mid 80s was revealed to me then by Jeff Stimson. Jeff btw was and may still be a Marklin NA employee. At the time he was apparently a regional sales manager and you would catch him at your local Marklin shop. He did most of the translations from German as he spoke both languages and understood model railroad terminology. He revealed to me that Marklin digital was actually DC. A secret Marklin wanted to keep as they had always been the alternating current model railroad company. So yes Virgina, you can run all these formats simutaneously on the same two or three rail set.

What is impossible is to run a simple DC motor on alternating current. It will just sit there stalled and burn up as it tries to reverse direction 60 (50 if you are European) times a second.

Let me clairify before someone believes Jeff was revealing some corporate secret. The owner of my shop made the reveal, I just asked Jeff if that was right and he agreed. I believe my response was "So what". Technology moves on, move with it or die.
Matt
Era 3
DB lokos, coaches and freight cars from across Europe
But I do have the obligatory (six) SBB Krocs
ECoS 50200, all FX and MFX decoders replaced with ESU V4s, operated in DCC-RailCom+ with ABC brake control.
With the exception of the passenger wagens with Marklin current conducting couplers, all close couplers have been replaced with Roco 40397.
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Offline H0  
#23 Posted : 08 December 2014 16:18:52(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: biedmatt Go to Quoted Post
Edit: What is impossible is to run a simple DC motor on alternating current. It will just sit there stalled and burn up as it tries to reverse direction 60 (50 if you are European) times a second.
With 50 Hz the motor will change direction 100 times a second (120 times for 60 Hz).

Still you can run an analogue DC loco with some DCC controllers - with 5000 through 10000 direction changes per second. NMRA DCC allows bit stretching, especially 0 bit stretching - the motor will get more current in one direction than the other, the ratio between directions is adjustable and the loco is under control. Don't try this with bell-shaped armatures. And other motors may also become warm or even hot.
But that's off topic, the MS2 does not support this.

With digital operation there is alternating polarity on the track (even with "DC digital") while the motor is fed with a single polarity for each direction of travel (even with "AC digital").
And that's why "two-rail digital" and "three-rail digital" are better terms than "DC digital" and "AC digital".
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline kiwiAlan  
#24 Posted : 08 December 2014 17:10:02(UTC)
kiwiAlan

United Kingdom   
Joined: 23/07/2014(UTC)
Posts: 8,082
Location: ENGLAND, Didcot
Originally Posted by: biedmatt Go to Quoted Post
This is why they are called "all current" and not "alternating current" motors.


Commonly called 'Universal Motors'. These are also used in most single phase power tools that operate off the mains, i.e. saws (table and portable), drills, motor mowers, weed trimmers, etc, as they have high power output for low weight as you don't need to haul a heavy magnet around.
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Offline harris19  
#25 Posted : 13 December 2014 09:56:36(UTC)
harris19

Greece   
Joined: 11/04/2011(UTC)
Posts: 80
Location: Greece
hello friends,
can anybody told me how to upgrade from Ms to Ms2 ?
i am running 3 locos the one with smoke generator and 5 cars with lights
i wouldlike also to add digitaltutnrounds
does anybody know if i need additional parts to my MS ?
thank you
harris
Offline H0  
#26 Posted : 13 December 2014 11:00:07(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Hi, Harris!
Originally Posted by: harris19 Go to Quoted Post
does anybody know if i need additional parts to my MS?
You need the MS2 and the new track box. You cannot use the feeder track or track box from the old MS.

I'd recommend getting a complete set (MS2, track box, power supply with 36 VA) from a starter set. Many dealers sell them separately.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline harris19  
#27 Posted : 14 December 2014 08:11:12(UTC)
harris19

Greece   
Joined: 11/04/2011(UTC)
Posts: 80
Location: Greece
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Hi, Harris!
Originally Posted by: harris19 Go to Quoted Post
does anybody know if i need additional parts to my MS?
You need the MS2 and the new track box. You cannot use the feeder track or track box from the old MS.

I'd recommend getting a complete set (MS2, track box, power supply with 36 VA) from a starter set. Many dealers sell them separately.


tom thanks a lot
i will try to find it from my dealer .
they asking me 110 euros but i am not sure if it is complete set ?
thank you wishing you merry christmas
harris
Offline H0  
#28 Posted : 14 December 2014 10:14:29(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: harris19 Go to Quoted Post
they asking me 110 euros but i am not sure if it is complete set?
€ 109.95 is the RRP for an MS2 with original box, but without power supply and without track box.

Complete MS2 sets from starter sets, but without original box, are about as expensive as just an MS2 in original box - but maybe not all dealers split starter sets and sell items separately.
Tell your dealer you need a complete set with track box and power supply and that you'd also buy such a set without original boxes and ask for the price.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline baggio  
#29 Posted : 29 May 2016 19:10:43(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
" " indicates free permanent slots,


If you skipped one position, can you go back or do you have to keep on going forward until you eventually come back?

I just don't see how I can go back....

Thanks for a great post, HO.

BigGrin
Offline H0  
#30 Posted : 29 May 2016 19:27:42(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
To go back, press Shift and turn the speed knob.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline baggio  
#31 Posted : 29 May 2016 22:11:03(UTC)
baggio

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Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Works like a charm! ThumpUp

Thank you.

BigGrin
Offline baggio  
#32 Posted : 30 May 2016 02:51:31(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
As you may have guessed, I have now acquired an MS2 and have with some struggle input my locos into it.

Problem: The arrow points in one direction and the loco goes in the other! Cursing

I reversed the way the track was attached, 180 degree turn, no change.

I reversed the way the wire are hooked up to the track and put the red where the brown was and vice versa; no change.

I am scratching my head as to WHY! Scared

Any help would be much appreciated. Sad

Thanks.

(The feeder track is right in front of me and I never had this problem before....)
Offline PMPeter  
#33 Posted : 30 May 2016 04:08:27(UTC)
PMPeter

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Location: Port Moody, BC
Have you tried taking the locomotive off of the track. Switch the direction on the controller. Place the locomotive back on the track and see if the direction of travel now agrees?
Offline baggio  
#34 Posted : 30 May 2016 04:25:14(UTC)
baggio

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Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
I did now, Peter, but no luck.

Thanks for the suggestion, however. BigGrin
Offline Cyborg  
#35 Posted : 30 May 2016 05:22:42(UTC)
Cyborg

Australia   
Joined: 11/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 107
Location: Maroubra
Hi,

I'm pretty sure that the locomotives have a 'front' and 'back' with the motor usually at the rear with respect to the forward direction of the locomotive. I think if you turn the locomotive around 180 degrees it will solve your problem (assuming it is a diesel or electric locomotive).

cheers

Paul
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Offline H0  
#36 Posted : 30 May 2016 07:25:13(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
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Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Cyborg Go to Quoted Post
I'm pretty sure that the locomotives have a 'front' and 'back' with the motor usually at the rear with respect to the forward direction of the locomotive.
That's how it is for models, called default direction. Prototype locos usually operate in both directions - and at least in Germany they always move forward when they operate a train, no matter which cab is in front.

With several Märklin models, cab 2 will be leading when the loco moves in its default direction. There are models where the motor truck will lead in the default direction.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline baggio  
#37 Posted : 30 May 2016 13:37:32(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
I did not have this problem with my MS1.

I wonder if the fact that when I added the locos on the MS2, I was doing it on a small piece of track and I may have had them go in the opposite direction that now the locos run on the main layout. In other words, the loco when added may have been facing right, while now I put them on the main track and face left.

Could this be the problem?

I will test this theory later on today when I have a bit of time.

In the meantime, if anyone has any other thoughts, please keep them coming.

Thanks. BigGrin
Offline RayF  
#38 Posted : 30 May 2016 14:03:40(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,838
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Hi Silvano,

Which loco are you having this problem with?

Locos with 6080 and Delta decoders will not necessarily remember the direction of travel and might set off in either direction when placed on the track. Later locos have a defined front and back which will be recognised by the controller.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline baggio  
#39 Posted : 31 May 2016 02:55:08(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Which loco are you having this problem with?


I think the problem is the way the MS2 starts, not the locos.

When the MS2 starts, the STOP function is on and red in colour. So, there is no power to the track. (Is this normal?)

The lit arrow AT THAT POINT is facing right.

The trains, all of them, however, go AS USUAL to the left, where they are facing, so life is good. ThumpUp

In other words, if it were not for the arrow, all would be fine. However, the arrows confuse me. Confused

If I pretend the arrows are not there, there is no problem.

I believe there has to be a way to have the arrow to the left light up at start up so it would match the direction of travel of the locos.


If it makes any difference, I am running firmware 1.81 and a 230 volt set with a step down power transformer.

Thank you.

Silvano
Offline michelvr  
#40 Posted : 31 May 2016 03:11:15(UTC)
michelvr

Canada   
Joined: 06/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,287
Hi Silvano,

Just switch the wires on the track to make the arrow face the correct direction.

Michel
Offline baggio  
#41 Posted : 31 May 2016 03:24:03(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: michelvr Go to Quoted Post
Just switch the wires on the track to make the arrow face the correct direction.

Michel


I did, but it does not work. Sad

Thanks for the suggestion, however. BigGrin
Offline Cyborg  
#42 Posted : 31 May 2016 05:59:21(UTC)
Cyborg

Australia   
Joined: 11/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 107
Location: Maroubra
Hi Baggio,

did you do what I suggested and turned the locomotive around?

regards

Paul
Offline Rwill  
#43 Posted : 31 May 2016 06:13:05(UTC)
Rwill

United Kingdom   
Joined: 04/05/2015(UTC)
Posts: 777
Location: England, London
A number of you are suggesting the fix of swapping wires. Now this appears to go against something I have had ingrained into my brain for twenty five or more years of digital operation - just remember B is not brown its red and that's important. Now the MS2 may have done away with that importance but what of everything else. As an occasional fryer of that well known delicacy the K83 decoder I thought the red/brown configuration was sacrosanct, so if I take power from them from the track from which the wires have been swapped then we will surely get "that" smell which indicates another £30 unbudgeted spend. Or am I just showing my total ignorance of electronics?. The issue raised is not one I as a recent MS2 convert have noticed - I thought the direction followed the picture on the screen which is fine until we get a swiss electric which is omni directional but like most things Marklin it appears after a while to be simply intuitive.
Offline H0  
#44 Posted : 31 May 2016 06:46:46(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: michelvr Go to Quoted Post
Just switch the wires on the track to make the arrow face the correct direction.
LOL
Excellent proposal for analogue DC. Does not work with analogue AC or any from of digital current.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline H0  
#45 Posted : 31 May 2016 07:08:36(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
I believe there has to be a way to have the arrow to the left light up at start up so it would match the direction of travel of the locos.
None I was aware of.
The right arrow indicates "forward" (default direction of the loco), the left arrow indicates "reverse". And I think it is exactly the same with the MS1.

With CU 6021 and Intellibox those arrows point up or down - IMHO less confusing than the left/right arrows that actually mean "default direction" and "not the default direction".
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline H0  
#46 Posted : 31 May 2016 07:19:03(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: Rwill Go to Quoted Post
[...] just remember B is not brown its red and that's important. Now the MS2 may have done away with that importance but what of everything else.
It's the same for all controllers: red and brown are important for some decoders. You won't fry anything by just swapping red and brown from the MS2 track box, but some loco and accessory decoders will not function at all when wires are swapped.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline RayF  
#47 Posted : 31 May 2016 13:21:00(UTC)
RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,838
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: RayF Go to Quoted Post
Which loco are you having this problem with?


I think the problem is the way the MS2 starts, not the locos.

When the MS2 starts, the STOP function is on and red in colour. So, there is no power to the track. (Is this normal?)

The lit arrow AT THAT POINT is facing right.

The trains, all of them, however, go AS USUAL to the left, where they are facing, so life is good. ThumpUp

In other words, if it were not for the arrow, all would be fine. However, the arrows confuse me. Confused

If I pretend the arrows are not there, there is no problem.

I believe there has to be a way to have the arrow to the left light up at start up so it would match the direction of travel of the locos.


If it makes any difference, I am running firmware 1.81 and a 230 volt set with a step down power transformer.

Thank you.

Silvano


Hi Silvano.

I think I understand you now.

From where you control the trains they move from right to left, so you would like the arrow to point to the left. Unfortunately the controller has no way to know what side of the train you are standing, so it is ignorant of whether the trains faces left or right.

The MS2 just tells you whether the locomotive is travelling forward or reverse, not left or right. Ignore the arrow if it is confusing you.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
Offline baggio  
#48 Posted : 31 May 2016 13:57:40(UTC)
baggio

Canada   
Joined: 21/09/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,729
Location: Toronto
Originally Posted by: baggio Go to Quoted Post
I reversed the way the track was attached, 180 degree turn, no change.

I reversed the way the wire are hooked up to the track and put the red where the brown was and vice versa; no change.


I did, Paul, thanks for the suggestion - see my post no. 32.

I think I understand now the problem. Thanks Ho.

As Ho sated, the arrows on the MS2 do not indicate the direction of travel, only "forward" or "reverse".

A "direction of travel" is relative to the player who is watching the train. As a result, Ho has it right - it's not quite the same thing. The MS2 does not know where I sit. BUT there should be a way of reversing the arrows from the default going to the right.

This is another advantage of DC: my locos go where the arrow points. ThumpUp ThumpUp BigGrin. If I need to, I swap wires and am able to have that useful directional feedback no matter where I sit.

Bottom line: Until Marklin provides a fix for this problem, I will have to learn to ignore the arrows.

Thanks to everyone for your help. BigGrin

Silvano aka Baggio
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Offline michelvr  
#49 Posted : 31 May 2016 14:46:57(UTC)
michelvr

Canada   
Joined: 06/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,287
Originally Posted by: H0 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: michelvr Go to Quoted Post
Just switch the wires on the track to make the arrow face the correct direction.
LOL
Excellent proposal for analogue DC. Does not work with analogue AC or any from of digital current.



Baggio is using the MS2 in DCC for 2 rail. So my assumption was that he should just reverse the wires so that the arrow would correspond to the arrow direction.

WARNINGBlink Blink Blink Blink Blink Blink BlinkWARNING

Be advised to follow the Marklin colour coding for wiring MARKLIN products. Failure to do so will case damage.

Regards,

Michel
Offline H0  
#50 Posted : 31 May 2016 16:21:28(UTC)
H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,254
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: michelvr Go to Quoted Post
Baggio is using the MS2 in DCC for 2 rail.
He uses the MS2 for Märklin three-rail.
With DCC there is no difference between two-rail and three-rail and swapping the cables will not reverse the direction.

Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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