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Offline SteamNut  
#1 Posted : 25 April 2015 10:15:58(UTC)
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SteamNut

United States   
Joined: 11/05/2013(UTC)
Posts: 488
In general reviewing my loks the older ones have greater power then newer ones. My ruling grade is 3.6% using M track. The best lok is my 3047, which I believe Utkan set some kind of record with, and the worst is the 37452 considering it is a 2-10-2. I believe it has nothing to do with the type of motor but rather how many drivers are driven with gears. It is not a great problem but I have to take into consideration what lok can pull what, the size of lok does not really matter. Most likely in the future I will pay more attention reviews with actual performance then looks - Fred
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Offline utkan  
#2 Posted : 25 April 2015 10:30:52(UTC)
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utkan

Turkey   
Joined: 14/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 19,116
Location: Istanbul,
Originally Posted by: SteamNut Go to Quoted Post
...which I believe Utkan set some kind of record with


Let's say a humble try...Blushing
Do unto others, as you would have them do unto you...
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Offline RayF  
#3 Posted : 25 April 2015 11:01:24(UTC)
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RayF

Gibraltar   
Joined: 14/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 15,839
Location: Gibraltar, Europe
I don't think the pulling power is limited so much by the number of driving wheels driven by gears. On real locomotives all the drivers are coupled by coupling rods and it works fine for them.

In my opinion it's more to do with the weight on each driven axle, especially those fitted with traction tyres. Older locomotives like the 3047 are immensely heavy, and this weight is spread evenly over the 5 driven axles, so the performance is bound to be impressive.

The Br45 probaly weighs less than the 3047 and has some of that weight on the non-driven axles, not contributing to traction.

Does the Br45 have a split chassis like the older decapods? If it doesn't then there is also the effect of a long coupled wheelbase which minimises the number of wheels bearing down on the track when there is a change of gradient. At the start of a hill only the first and last drivers are in contact, and when it levels off at the top only the middle axles will be carrying weight.

For a layout like yours Fred, with steep gradients, you're probably right to stick to the older designs with a lot of weight and traction.
Ray
Mostly Marklin.Selection of different eras and European railways
Small C track layout, control by MS2, 100+ trains but run 4-5 at a time.
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Offline SteamNut  
#4 Posted : 25 April 2015 12:30:43(UTC)
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SteamNut

United States   
Joined: 11/05/2013(UTC)
Posts: 488
Hi Ray the BR45 does not have a split chassis which does cause problems with curved turnouts and 5100 tracks. The lok is fairly heavy but if I recall when I installed the smoke unit only two axles were driven while the BR44 has at least four. The grade does present its problems but I notice this on level track also. I also had a rubber traction tire missing on the BR44 but I did notice it missing till I was doing some routine maintainence.
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Offline Mark5  
#5 Posted : 29 October 2015 22:54:53(UTC)
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Mark5

Canada   
Joined: 29/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,420
Location: Montreal, Canada
If we are going to max load pulling, I'd love to see what an old Märklin croc can pull.
Anyone tested theirs?
- Mark
DB DR FS NS SNCF c. 1950-65, fan of station architecture esp. from 1920-70.
In single point perspective, where do track lines meet?
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Offline jcrtrains  
#6 Posted : 29 October 2015 23:35:14(UTC)
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jcrtrains

Canada   
Joined: 31/10/2009(UTC)
Posts: 597
Location: Toronto, Ontario
The Ae 8/14 must be up there in some the great pulling power discussions. Mine is a beast. I have the Roco one as well - also formidable.
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Offline H0  
#7 Posted : 30 October 2015 07:37:51(UTC)
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H0


Joined: 16/02/2004(UTC)
Posts: 15,262
Location: DE-NW
Originally Posted by: jcrtrains Go to Quoted Post
The Ae 8/14 must be up there in some the great pulling power discussions.
An MRR magazine found the pulling power of Märklin's V 188 disappointing.
Tractive weight is the weight resting on powered axles. With respect to that, V 188 and Ae 8/14 are far from perfect.

Modern constructions (centrally mounted motor, two trucks powered) have an advantage with respect to tractive weight.
Regards
Tom
---
"In all of the gauges, we particularly emphasize a high level of quality, the best possible fidelity to the prototype, and absolute precision. You will see that in all of our products." (from Märklin New Items Brochure 2015, page 1) ROFLBTCUTS
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Offline Janne75  
#8 Posted : 30 October 2015 08:13:09(UTC)
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Janne75

Finland   
Joined: 23/03/2012(UTC)
Posts: 2,550
Location: Finland
Originally Posted by: Mark5 Go to Quoted Post
If we are going to max load pulling, I'd love to see what an old Märklin croc can pull.
Anyone tested theirs?
- Mark


Hi Mark,

Before I started to build my permanent layout I tested some of my locos pulling power in our living room. I built a big oval C-track with R5 (24530) curves and long straight track sections.

My best pulling Crocodiles were 3756 and 39560 as they could pull and accelerate without any sudden speed changes. If I remember right they both pulled a little less than 80-85 wagons. They pulled better in other direction, but I can't remember anymore in which direction it was. 36159 (basically 3015 with old school decoder) was not able to pull as much as it accelerates so suddenly when pulling a heavy train. Traction is lost and wagons tend to fall towards inside of the big oval, because of the sudden speed changes.

Best pulling locos are the ones which have smooth motor control, good torque and good gear ratio. Weight distribution is also important and enough total weight. In my pulling tests two of my best pulling locos during that time (around year 2011?) were starter set DB E 40 electric (29855) and DB BR 221 diesel (29811). Both have only two driving axles and four traction tyres. 29855 DB E 40 weight is only slightly over 400 grams and 29811 DB BR 221 weight is over 600 grams. Both of these pulled over 100 wagons easily.

Regards,
Janne
Märklin H0 digital layout. I have analog and digital H0 Collection. Rolling stock mostly from era I, II, III and IV. Märklin 1 gauge beginner.
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Offline river6109  
#9 Posted : 30 October 2015 10:02:13(UTC)
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river6109

Australia   
Joined: 22/01/2009(UTC)
Posts: 14,715
Location: On 1965 Märklin Boulevard just around from Roco Square
Originally Posted by: jcrtrains Go to Quoted Post
The Ae 8/14 must be up there in some the great pulling power discussions. Mine is a beast. I have the Roco one as well - also formidable.


if you couple both locos together you'll find out quickly which one is the better puller. one is what they call "plastic" and the other metal.

Märklin Crocs with one bogy driven, no match for the Roco Croc (75% metal) = plastic middle housing.
https://www.youtube.com/river6109
https://www.youtube.com/6109river
5 years in Destruction mode
50 years in Repairing mode
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